Sendero Advice

[Greyfox]

I' think the Sendaro in either caliber would be a good choice. I currently have the Nightforce G7/50mm mounted on my Rem 700 Milspec in 300WM. It's pricey but is a superb scope that I found had the features I was looking for. Highspeed Turret, zero stop, and a reticle that has MOA windage, and a calibrated yardage reticle for 600 yards as a quick backup for mid range, quick shots when encountered. I also like the turrets available from G7 that are available with a custom yardage scale that has a MOA scale in the lower portion of the turret.. It's a very versatile, high quality long range scope. IMO.

 

[southpa]

ok so what ive gathered is 7 mag or .300 are essentially a wash as far as performance is concerned. Some say 7 m and some say .300 but all say either is about the same....for some reason im wanting to go with the 7 mag?

Sendero is a GO... with minimal (if any) negative feedback...

the scope is another deamon...keep in mind im completely new to all of this LR stuff. Im not completely competent on what the numbers correlating with MOA mean. Basically im not sure exactly what .5 MOA or any numbers before MOA means...When i buy some good glass will i need to have the scope dialed in for that exact load or just the caliber? and/or Have my rifle sent in and the scope built/mounted by the optics company...

 

[roninflag]

i have scopes from 299$ vortex to 1700$ nightforce. my favorites are leup 6.5-20. i like at least 6.5-20 power . some like less, like 4.5-14. you need to get one with turrets so you can get a kenton knobb or equivalent once you settle on a load. if money is tight i would pay more for the rangefinder and get a lower priced scope.

 

[fmajor]

Well, the 7mm STW Sendero is a slightly hard to find rifle/caliber combination and Remington stopped manufacturing them in the early 2000's. Mine were manufactured in '97 and '98.

I have been wanting one for a long time and last year I came on an opportunity to acquire a slightly used one from an estate sale at a really good price and then a month later from one came up for sale (only slightly used too and also a really good price) in the classifieds on this website so I bought that one too.

I absolutely love this caliber and it is sort of an addition once you shoot one. A number of members on this website has 3 or more 7mm STWs, i.e., "Long Time Long Ranger" I think has 5 of them. And the Sendero platform can not be beat!

Look at this thread on this website; there is a great following of this caliber:

http://www.longrangehunting.com/for...who-shoot-7mm-shooting-times-westerner-88228/

I knew the 7mm STW is an excellent, well-regarded chambering, but it somehow struck me odd to have 2 exact platforms/chamberings. I agree that the Sendero is a great rifle and so it does make sense someone would have more than one.

THanks for the reply!

 

[fmajor]

ok so what ive gathered is 7 mag or .300 are essentially a wash as far as performance is concerned. Some say 7 m and some say .300 but all say either is about the same....for some reason im wanting to go with the 7 mag?

Bryan Litz penned an article about 7mm vs .308 calibers (somewhat controversial, but he's an educated ballistician.....) right here

I'm absolutely certain you will get some other opinions/experiences/etc so lots of great information will soon be coming on this very topic!

the scope is another deamon...keep in mind im completely new to all of this LR stuff. Im not completely competent on what the numbers correlating with MOA mean. Basically im not sure exactly what .5 MOA or any numbers before MOA means...When i buy some good glass will i need to have the scope dialed in for that exact load or just the caliber? and/or Have my rifle sent in and the scope built/mounted by the optics company...

There are others here who will give a better, more exacting answer than mine, but the 'quick and dirty' answer is 1 MOA is ~1" at 100 yards. This relationship is pretty much a constant at any distance, though using easy-to-compute distances aids in making MOA calculations. So, given your example, .5 MOA, would be approx., 1/2" at 100 yrds or 5" at 1000 yrds.

hth...

 

[MontanaRifleman]

If you're hunting anything larger than deer I would recommend the 300. Not that the 7 can't do it, but the 300 will do it better. The 300 will also have better barrel life.

If recoil is a concern then get a brake. Most here in LRH will recommend a brake for either one because it generally leads to more accurate shooting and allows you to see your hits or misses not to mention much more pleasant to shoot.

I've also put a lot of rounds through an unbraked 300 RUM using a slip-on recoil pad. Worked just fine for me.

 

[southpa]

montana,
what about the .300 leads to longer barrel life? And how much "better" will the .300 do it? I was under the the general consensus that the difference between the 7 and the .300 was splitting hairs...i realize most of these responses are left solely in the hands of personal prefference but im really wondering what (if any) are the "cut-n-dry" advantages of either caliber over the other?

It would be money saved not to have to add a brake if you know what i mean...In that perspective your saying it would be a matter of 7mag unbraked vs. .300 braked for recoil...unless in fact the break aids to accuracy, that of which im wondering how? could you ellborate

BTW thanx for all the help fellas i realize you might all be rolling your eyes at what novice questions i might be asking...either way you are all helping me make important decisions as the money i will be spending is a small fortune to guys like most of us!!!!

 

[Catwhacker]

When I guided deer hunters, I hated muzzle brakes. Having a brake installed was the best thing I've done since I started LR shooting. The rifle kicking & hurting my tender little shoulder isn't the reason. Being able to spot my own hits @ 400yds is why I love it. It's loud, & I'm better about wearing ear protection now than I ever have been. Lol

 

[COBrad]

My preference is the 7 mag, for all the reasons Litz' article mentions. After shooting a good variety of "bigger" calibers, I have come back to the 7 and no more muzzle break.

 

[MontanaRifleman]

montana,
what about the .300 leads to longer barrel life? And how much "better" will the .300 do it? I was under the the general consensus that the difference between the 7 and the .300 was splitting hairs...i realize most of these responses are left solely in the hands of personal prefference but im really wondering what (if any) are the "cut-n-dry" advantages of either caliber over the other?

It would be money saved not to have to add a brake if you know what i mean...In that perspective your saying it would be a matter of 7mag unbraked vs. .300 braked for recoil...unless in fact the break aids to accuracy, that of which im wondering how? could you ellborate

BTW thanx for all the help fellas i realize you might all be rolling your eyes at what novice questions i might be asking...either way you are all helping me make important decisions as the money i will be spending is a small fortune to guys like most of us!!!!

The 300 is less overbore than the 7. I burned out a 7RM in about 1000 rounds. I've never owned a 300 WM but I read you can expect 1500 round or more out of them if you treat them well. There's at least one member on here who has over 2000 rounds through his and it's still shooting very well.

The brake is a personal choice. Some people like them and some don't. I've never had a braked rifle but I'm having 2 built at present with brakes, the main reason being the ability to spot shots which is a huge benefit in LR hunting. The other being just more pleasant to shoot. Some also say it facilitates accuracy because of less flinching. And maybe it helps barrel harmonics? I'm not too sure about t that. I shot my unbraked 300 RUM fairly accurate - .5 MOA or better. Maybe it or I would have a little better with brake? In the future all my good kicking rifles will probably get brakes. You should be able to shoot a 300 WM OK without a brake in a Sendero for maybe 20 rounds. If you don't get a brake, I would highly recommend a slip on decelerator pad. They work great. I could shoot my RUM all day with one.

Good shooting.

 

[MontanaRifleman]

BTW, I have a lot of respect for Bryan Litz and after reading the article it seems that one of the arguments made for the 7 is that it can push heavier bullets faster. I'm not too sure about that. In the 7RM Sendero, you should be able to push a 180 bullet about 3000 or so. 3000 fps was max for 160's in my 24" 7RM. Might have got them going a little faster with Retumbo or RL17. The 300 WM Sendero should be able to push a 215 gr bullet close to 3000. When it comes to hunting, there is a significant difference between a 7mm 180 gr bullet and a 30 cal 215 gr bullet. Not exactly splitting hairs. Ballistics are close but not terminal performance.

 

[Greyfox]

I struggled with the choice between the 7Mag and the 300WM. I already owned a few 6.5x284's which were not substantially different from the 7mm at 1000 yards for deer sized game, with the benefit of strong ballistic performance. I went with the 300 with Berger210's at 2800FPS. I think it's a better round for the bigger game like elk and has better barrel life at these velocities and case/bore dimensions. Accuracy is superb. iMO.

 

[cohunter14]

2800fps sounds better for a 300 win too. 3,000fps in a 200+ gr bullet is more in the RUM category I think, unless it is a custom 300 win.

 

[MontanaRifleman]

2800fps sounds better for a 300 win too. 3,000fps in a 200+ gr bullet is more in the RUM category I think, unless it is a custom 300 win.

Depending on barrel lengths, throats, powders etc., I would say close to 3000 fps would be expected on the high end for both the 180's in the 7RM and 210-215's in the 300 WM. 3000 fps is a typical max velocity for 160's out of 24" 7 RM and maybe another 50 fps for a 26". With the right combo of barrel and powder 3000 would be possible for 180's but 2800 fps would be more common.

I have shot 210's @ 2935 out of my 24" 300 WSM over RL17.

When comparing apples to apples, a 300 WM is going to shoot a 210-215 bullet about the same velocity that a 7RM is going to shoot a 180.

EDIT: My 300 RUM shoots 210's @ 3130 over Retumbo