Choosing bullets Berger's or Barnes

Battering Ram

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Apr 5, 2015
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South East Idaho
Oops, I hit the wrong button. This was 800 yards on an elk. TTSX from a 300 Rum at 3420 from the muzzle. I hunt and shoot Barnes. I’ve had great success with them on goats and deer for years now. They are usually always a complete pass through, but with decent placement the game has always been anchored. I can also recommend the LRX 145’s in the .284. My wife’s 7-08 has taken elk and deer with zero problems. Just my 2 cents
 

Jluck

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Jan 25, 2014
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419
They don't/can't explode. They are pure copper. We use a very soft copper so that they deform very rapidly on impact. They open with a few petals like a banana. They are designed to shed those petals. This rapid expansion and petal shedding creates the shock that is very impressive. The 70% to 90% retained (depending on the chosen bullet) weight will have a square flat front designed for deep straight line penetration. This retained weight needs to keep velocity after impact. Bullets that stop inside an animal stop doing damage. They don't have brakes, they slow down until they stop, doing less and less damage as they come to a stop. There is no such thing as energy dump. There is such a thing as shock and permanent wound channel. If we have a bullet that owns but does not shed its petals, we almost consider it a bullet failure. The shed petals very often follow the retained shank for computer pass through as well. Like 3 or 4 little 20g bullets.

Explode- no. Rapid expansion shedding a few pieces with the same weight retention regardless of impact vel- yes.
Designed to come apart not stay together that’s the difference... splitting hairs here...
 

crazyhorse

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Oct 31, 2004
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southeast
For a couple of years (before the 28N) I ran the Barnes TTSX 120grn out of my 7RM clocking 3300fps on several antelope hunts and results were impressive!
All DRT results and a "puff" of hair floating in the breeze after the shot.

Having said all of that I ordered a sample pack of the Hammers a few weeks ago and load testing was beyond impressive. The only reason I haven't switched over completely is the fact hunting season interrupted finishing load development.

If I was starting today with a brand new rifle primarily for antelope, a couple of Hammer sample packs would already be on order!
 

tooth doc

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Jul 31, 2012
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139
I'm new to reloading. I have a Cooper firearms 28 nosler long range with a proof research barrel . I'll be hunting deer or pronghorn . I'm leaning towards the Barns 145 grain I have a reloading book and brass coming in a few days what powder do you start with or primer seems like there are a lot of things to consider I was just hoping to save some money and start with a powder that works instead of buying powder and finding out it's the wrong one.
Thanks for any advice.
Retumbo powder,for sure. I love barnes bullets and use them for most hunting. In my new benchmark 28 nosler i am using berger 195 vld hybrid at 3050. Look at the ballistics, they are unbelievable. Not as fast as lighter bullet but they loose less velocity and drop less at longer ranges. Havinf said that, i love barnes tsx and ttsx bullets. Just remember to not load them on the lands. The typically shoot best 50 to 120 thousands off the lands. Merry xmas
 

Blacktail

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May 12, 2006
Messages
476
HHs in my experience with my 280ai on antelope from 250-450 yds and my daughters 708ai on antelope and hogs are expand a lot better then the barnes. In her 7-08 a 120 ttsx while accurate at 3150 was pin holing lugs it literally looked like an arrow went through them if have to use lead free HHs for me!! my 280ai is pushing the 143 3180 and have been lethal I a loading 131s for her 7/08 today
 

azarcher10x

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Joined
Nov 12, 2012
Messages
28
Barnes will just blast a little hole right through the goat. I’d go with something softer. You will have lots of energy with whatever bullet you choose, I’m pretty sure you won’t be happy with the terminal performance of Barnes
I totally disagree! The only time I've seen what you're describing, was with a much to heavy a bullet for the game being shot, at close range. One of the problems I have with the long range shot fad, is their use of heavy bullets for long range. That's fine, until the shot on deer that pops out at 75, doesn't perform. Most of the uninformed, shoot these heavy bullets for class of game they're targeting. When shooting a Mono bullet, pick a lighter weight, and plan for close shot. Then if a longer shot presents itself, you'll still have a bullet will hold together and perform. As an example, I shoot 165 gr. from my 300 RUM @ 3500 fps. I've taken Coues at 95 yds., and elk at 600. Full expansion on the deer, and and exit hole performance on the elk.
 

Canhunter35

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Jun 13, 2017
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2,600
I totally disagree! The only time I've seen what you're describing, was with a much to heavy a bullet for the game being shot, at close range. One of the problems I have with the long range shot fad, is their use of heavy bullets for long range. That's fine, until the shot on deer that pops out at 75, doesn't perform. Most of the uninformed, shoot these heavy bullets for class of game they're targeting. When shooting a Mono bullet, pick a lighter weight, and plan for close shot. Then if a longer shot presents itself, you'll still have a bullet will hold together and perform. As an example, I shoot 165 gr. from my 300 RUM @ 3500 fps. I've taken Coues at 95 yds., and elk at 600. Full expansion on the deer, and and exit hole performance on the elk.
Yeah I’ve heard this before until you shoot one in the lungs and they run a long ways with a 1” hole in their lungs. Shoot a 175eldx from a 28nosler into an ‘antelope’ at close range which is unlikely, goats don’t live in the trees but regardless it’s gonna kill him even with a lot of expansion, they’re not very big animals.
 

Jluck

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Jan 25, 2014
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419
Yeah I’ve heard this before until you shoot one in the lungs and they run a long ways with a 1” hole in their lungs. Shoot a 175eldx from a 28nosler into an ‘antelope’ at close range which is unlikely, goats don’t live in the trees but regardless it’s gonna kill him even with a lot of expansion, they’re not very big animals.
But if you use a Creedmoor.... Any bullet, any distance... DRT!! 110% of the time.
 

bigngreen

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Nov 24, 2008
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7,699
Location
SW Montana
Totally different bullet camps. Do you want bullet retention or exploding bullets. Do you love cleaning bloodshot meat and eating toxic metal? Go Berger. Want a little less benchracer numbers and like bullet retention and penetration without eating lead? Go Barnes.
Odd, I don't eat lead and have excessive blood shot from Bergers, in fact it's been the best meat bullet I've shot especially considering how many Barnes I saw pencil or turn directions, I've recovered WAY more meat with Bergers than when I drank the Barnes Koolaid!!
Hammers are my go to mono hands down, an actually lethal bullet that expands well and creates excellent bleeding permanent wound channels with straight line tracking through the animal every shot!!
 

Jluck

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Joined
Jan 25, 2014
Messages
419
Odd, I don't eat lead and have excessive blood shot from Bergers, in fact it's been the best meat bullet I've shot especially considering how many Barnes I saw pencil or turn directions, I've recovered WAY more meat with Bergers than when I drank the Barnes Koolaid!!
Hammers are my go to mono hands down, an actually lethal bullet that expands well and creates excellent bleeding permanent wound channels with straight line tracking through the animal every shot!!
cool
 

azarcher10x

Active Member
Joined
Nov 12, 2012
Messages
28
Odd, I don't eat lead and have excessive blood shot from Bergers, in fact it's been the best meat bullet I've shot especially considering how many Barnes I saw pencil or turn directions, I've recovered WAY more meat with Bergers than when I drank the Barnes Koolaid!!
Hammers are my go to mono hands down, an actually lethal bullet that expands well and creates excellent bleeding permanent wound channels with straight line tracking through the animal every shot!!
Been shooting Barnes for 25 years. Never had an issue!
 

bigngreen

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Nov 24, 2008
Messages
7,699
Location
SW Montana
I'm new to reloading. I have a Cooper firearms 28 nosler long range with a proof research barrel . I'll be hunting deer or pronghorn . I'm leaning towards the Barns 145 grain I have a reloading book and brass coming in a few days what powder do you start with or primer seems like there are a lot of things to consider I was just hoping to save some money and start with a powder that works instead of buying powder and finding out it's the wrong one.
Thanks for any advice.
I've been running a 28 for a while, shot a lot of bullets but I kill mostly elk so pretty much what ever I shoot for elk does great on deer but not everything that is great on deer will be ideal for elk if that makes sense. I do shoot the Barnes for deer and smaller game but will never use them on elk again after years of using them, the 145 will work well on deer I MUCH prefer the Hammers because they cause a way better permanent wound channel and they tune soooo much easier for accuracy, just a better bullet period but just about anything will kill a deer. I shoot mostly 195 Bergers and 177 Hammers in my 28 but that's more bullet than needed for deer but if you want to go light for cal on bullets I would not shoot the Berger because you'll be outside their ideal window.
 

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