7wsm or 28 Nosler

[jrock]

I think the 28 Nosler is a great option for the 195 grain bullet. If you shoot the 180's there are a lot of chambering's that can push them to 3000 fps. For the 180 and down weight bullets, I'd choose something other than Nosler due to the price of brass and cases with better efficiency. Pick a bullet and speed that you want and find a cartridge that gets you there.

Consider recoil as well when going up to the 28 Nosler and down that much in rifle weight unless you are installing a break.

 

[maninthemaze]

Thanks for the replies. I'm definitely going with the 28 Nosler as the 195 Bergers are what I'm planning on shooting. Hopefully I can get an accurate load with them around 3050-3100 fps. In my 7wsm I could always push the 180's and 168's fast, but not fast and accurate. I settled on the 180's at 2900 in my 7wsm. I have pushed the 180's to 3100 and the 168's to 3300 without signs of pressure, but they just didn't group well at those speeds.

Thanks again for everyone's opinion...

 

[SteveBurton]

I wanted to throw in my $0.02 about the 28 Nosler. I just received mine a month ago. I am able to push the 180 Bergers well over 3200fps but my rifle likes them around 3150. I'm sure I will be able to push the 195 Bergers over 3000fps easily. Before anyone jumps on my claims I will say that my rifle is built on a magnum action so I can seat the bullets out much farther than a commercially built rifle for maximum case efficiency. My barrel is 26" with a brake installed. I just started load development and have gotten 3/4 MOA so far. I will start playing with seating depths so I'm confident I can get it to under 1/2 MOA. This thing should be a hammer on any medium to large game that I will hunt. With the brake, the recoil is much less than my friends 300WSM without a brake. I honestly don't like shooting his rifle. I think you will be happy with the 28 Nosler.

If your wallet can handle it, I wholeheartedly recommend going with a custom build vs a production rifle. I have been much happier since doing so.

 

[SansSouci]

I've carried a rifle thousands of miles in rough country and other than in jungle conditions have never noticed an extra 2" of barrel being a detriment.

WildRose,

We all have preferences. I've clearly indicated that my preference is 22" barrels. It is my preference and only my preference. I am well aware that other hunters have other preferences. That's what makes us unique. If you prefer longer barrels, I'm good. You know what's right for you. I would never attempt to tell another hunter what's right for him.

I can write that I've gone in some very thick stuff looking for big antlers. In one such excursion, I saw a huge buck get up from his bed and saunter off. I was no more than 10 yards from him. Trees were so thick that there was no way I could get a shot at him. That's why I prefer shorter barrels. They give me options. I can shoot a long way with a 22" barreled .270 Win, and it handles well where there's a possibility of a jump shot.

While I do not need another rifle, I'd give a long, hard look at a .308 Win carbine. From what I understand, the .308 Win does not lose much velocity if any out of short barreled rifles. But then again, even with a handgun, I wasn't going to get a shot at that big antlered buck. He had chosen his bed wisely.

During general season rifle hunts, the big dudes that I'm after usually bed down before sunup. Unless other hunters rouse them, they'l stay put until sundown. Then they'll feed all night and return to their beds before sunup. Hence, you gotta go after them.

While one could shoot a half-mile and better in the area we hunt, I'd bet that 90% of all deer we've killed were shot at well under 200 yards.

I've killed a trophy bull elk of a lifetime at a lasered 130 yards. We hunted that huge dude for two-to-two-and-a-half hours before he stood broadside giving me a clear shot at his heart.

Hence, for my hunting needs, a 22" barrel in a fast handling rifle is just the ticket. It could be a whole lot different for other hunters.

 

[maninthemaze]

If your wallet can handle it, I wholeheartedly recommend going with a custom build vs a production rifle. I have been much happier since doing so.

I'm planning on using my Stiller Tac 300 action and a #5 Brux 1:8.5 twist barrel at 26" with straight flutes and a brake on it. I plan on having it throated specifically for the Berger 195's. And I've already got a gunsmith lined up to do it. Hopefully it won't take too long to complete the barreled action once I get him all the parts.

 

[toddc]

WildRose,

We all have preferences. I've clearly indicated that my preference is 22" barrels. It is my preference and only my preference. I am well aware that other hunters have other preferences. That's what makes us unique. If you prefer longer barrels, I'm good. You know what's right for you. I would never attempt to tell another hunter what's right for him.

I can write that I've gone in some very thick stuff looking for big antlers. In one such excursion, I saw a huge buck get up from his bed and saunter off. I was no more than 10 yards from him. Trees were so thick that there was no way I could get a shot at him. That's why I prefer shorter barrels. They give me options. I can shoot a long way with a 22" barreled .270 Win, and it handles well where there's a possibility of a jump shot.

While I do not need another rifle, I'd give a long, hard look at a .308 Win carbine. From what I understand, the .308 Win does not lose much velocity if any out of short barreled rifles. But then again, even with a handgun, I wasn't going to get a shot at that big antlered buck. He had chosen his bed wisely.

During general season rifle hunts, the big dudes that I'm after usually bed down before sunup. Unless other hunters rouse them, they'l stay put until sundown. Then they'll feed all night and return to their beds before sunup. Hence, you gotta go after them.

While one could shoot a half-mile and better in the area we hunt, I'd bet that 90% of all deer we've killed were shot at well under 200 yards.

I've killed a trophy bull elk of a lifetime at a lasered 130 yards. We hunted that huge dude for two-to-two-and-a-half hours before he stood broadside giving me a clear shot at his heart.

Hence, for my hunting needs, a 22" barrel in a fast handling rifle is just the ticket. It could be a whole lot different for other hunters.

With the OP asking about a 28 nosler, the 22 inch barrel comment is just a tad out of place. A 22 inch 28 Nosler would be a ludicrous waste of case capacity and your hearing. A WSM would be nearly as silly. Your comment would be great on a thread about 30-30s. Not so much here. IMHO

 

[SteveBurton]

I'm planning on using my Stiller Tac 300 action and a #5 Brux 1:8.5 twist barrel at 26" with straight flutes and a brake on it. I plan on having it throated specifically for the Berger 195's. And I've already got a gunsmith lined up to do it. Hopefully it won't take too long to complete the barreled action once I get him all the parts.

I waited 19 months for mine but a large part of that was due to the stock and barrel manufacturers. If you have all of the pieces in hand you should be good.

Good luck with your build!

 

[SansSouci]

With the OP asking about a 28 nosler, the 22 inch barrel comment is just a tad out of place. A 22 inch 28 Nosler would be a ludicrous waste of case capacity and your hearing. A WSM would be nearly as silly. Your comment would be great on a thread about 30-30s. Not so much here. IMHO

Begging your pardon, maninthemaze indicated that he was after a lighter rifle that's easier for all day carry.

I know little of the 7MM WSM & .280 Nosler, but my guess is that they're not well-suited for 22" barrels. However, a .280 Rem would be. My guess would be that especially due to his desire for a lightweight rifle, he might benefit by looking at cartridges that perform well with lighter rifles, cartridges that when fired out of light rifles won't loosen teeth.

I've been where maninthemaze is. I got tired of lugging around a 10+ pound 7MM Rem Mag up and down high ridges of Wyoming. The heft of my 7MM Rem Mag makes recoil very manageable, but the weight of it had me rethinking. Hence, I've gone back to my .270 Win, which will shoot farther than I can shoot. Moreover, maninthemaze's indicating his carrying his rifle indicates that he gets off of trails and pursues animals, which means he probably gets close enough to make a lightweight rifle doable.

There is no doubt in my mind that my eight pound, 22" barreled .270 Win will kill all big game in North America just as dead as .338 LAPUA with a 28" barrel and weighing in at 16 pounds.

I'm thinking of how I can do another trophy elk hunt in 2017. If I can get a tag in an area that produces good bulls and line up a guide that has availability, I'll be developing 150 grain Partition loads for my 22" barreled .270 Win. But then again, I wouldn't worry were I to use a 130 grain Accubond. It's all about bullet placement, not bullet diameter. An elk with his heart destroyed has seconds to live. What destroys its heart is immaterial.

 

[toddc]

Begging your pardon, maninthemaze indicated that he was after a lighter rifle that's easier for all day carry.

I know little of the 7MM WSM & .280 Nosler, but my guess is that they're not well-suited for 22" barrels. However, a .280 Rem would be. My guess would be that especially due to his desire for a lightweight rifle, he might benefit by looking at cartridges that perform well with lighter rifles, cartridges that when fired out of light rifles won't loosen teeth.

I've been where maninthemaze is. I got tired of lugging around a 10+ pound 7MM Rem Mag up and down high ridges of Wyoming. The heft of my 7MM Rem Mag makes recoil very manageable, but the weight of it had me rethinking. Hence, I've gone back to my .270 Win, which will shoot farther than I can shoot. Moreover, maninthemaze's indicating his carrying his rifle indicates that he gets off of trails and pursues animals, which means he probably gets close enough to make a lightweight rifle doable.

There is no doubt in my mind that my eight pound, 22" barreled .270 Win will kill all big game in North America just as dead as .338 LAPUA with a 28" barrel and weighing in at 16 pounds.

I'm thinking of how I can do another trophy elk hunt in 2017. If I can get a tag in an area that produces good bulls and line up a guide that has availability, I'll be developing 150 grain Partition loads for my 22" barreled .270 Win. But then again, I wouldn't worry were I to use a 130 grain Accubond. It's all about bullet placement, not bullet diameter. An elk with his heart destroyed has seconds to live. What destroys its heart is immaterial.

I think this is LRH. A 270 Win will not shoot farther than I can shoot I will assure you. Your advice would be great on many boards. Here? IDK. The very definition of this board is sorta contrary to your position. Just MHO though.

 

[maninthemaze]

Thanks guys I really appreciate all the insight and suggestions. And I agree with SansSouci suggestions that a 270 will kill and elk, within a reasonable distance. However, like ToddC said, this is LRH. My brother shoots a Remington 700 in 7mm Express or 280, whatever you want to call it. I'm sure it would be just fine a rifle for elk. I however want something better. I enjoy the challenge of shooting at longer and longer distances. I routinely practice at 700 yards and have become comfortable shooting at live game up to around 500 yards. My last trip to Wyoming yielded an antelope at 482 yards. But this was done with my 14 pound rifle. I'm sorta looking for a comprise between accuracy at distance and lighter weight, but not too light. I'm thinking this is exactly what the LRR, Gunwerks, McWhorter and MOA rifles had in mind when they started producing rifles. A fairly light rifle that will excel at longer distance. This is what I'm hoping to achieve with my rifle. I'm hoping that a rifle with a Stiller Tac 300 action, #5 fluted Brux, EH1 stock and my Vortex Viper scope will finish in around 9 pounds. A few ounces either way, and I'll be happy. And I'm thinking that a 28 Nosler would be the better way to go with a new build. My 7wsm shoots just fine, and if brass wasn't such a pain to source, maintain and prep, I would probably stick with it as my caliber of choice. But since I'm putting a new barrel on my action, I might as well upgrade.

Once again guys, thanks for all the help and suggestions!!!!

 

[SansSouci]

Hi maninthemaze,

Choosing the best cartridge involves compromises. A .338 LAPUA will shoot a very long way. But it would require a heavy rifle to manage recoil.

I own a beautiful Belgian Browning that was manufactured in 1968. My dad gave it to me. It's chambered in .338 Win Mag. I've fired it three times. That was just over 30 years ago. I've never fired it again. It sits in my gun safe. It's too much gun and too much recoil for everything in North America. I had figured that my .270 Win would kill what I wanted to hunt. I did pick up a Sako AV in 7MM Rem Mag some 25 years ago. A So Cal gun store was closing. I got it for an unbelievable price. The 7MM Rem Mag has the most recoil that I can endure while bench shooting. And it is a very sudden killer. But it won't kill any deader than my .270 Win. But if I thought I had to break heavy bone (largest bears' shoulders) I'd go with a 175 grain Partition out of my 7MM Rem Mag. My 7MM Rem Mag is beyond accurate. My now deceased friend had many custom rifles. He told me that not one of them was as accurate as my Sako 7MM Rem Mag.

Hence, if you want a really long range cartridge, you might find yourself back in the same boat: a heavy gun that's a pain in the butt to carry at altitude.

I do wish you the absolute best finding your perfect rifle and that it brings you many successful big game hunting seasons.

 

[toddc]

" It's too much gun and too much recoil for everything in North America"

Pretty sure anyone who has been close to a ****ed off brown bear would violently disagree with this statement.

A 338 Win mag makes a great cartridge to neck down to 6.5 for a mild round.

This is LRH errrr SPARTA

 

[RockyMtnMT]

Hi maninthemaze,

Choosing the best cartridge involves compromises. A .338 LAPUA will shoot a very long way. But it would require a heavy rifle to manage recoil.

I own a beautiful Belgian Browning that was manufactured in 1968. My dad gave it to me. It's chambered in .338 Win Mag. I've fired it three times. That was just over 30 years ago. I've never fired it again. It sits in my gun safe. It's too much gun and too much recoil for everything in North America. I had figured that my .270 Win would kill what I wanted to hunt. I did pick up a Sako AV in 7MM Rem Mag some 25 years ago. A So Cal gun store was closing. I got it for an unbelievable price. The 7MM Rem Mag has the most recoil that I can endure while bench shooting. And it is a very sudden killer. But it won't kill any deader than my .270 Win. But if I thought I had to break heavy bone (largest bears' shoulders) I'd go with a 175 grain Partition out of my 7MM Rem Mag. My 7MM Rem Mag is beyond accurate. My now deceased friend had many custom rifles. He told me that not one of them was as accurate as my Sako 7MM Rem Mag.

Hence, if you want a really long range cartridge, you might find yourself back in the same boat: a heavy gun that's a pain in the butt to carry at altitude.

I do wish you the absolute best finding your perfect rifle and that it brings you many successful big game hunting seasons.

My 338 Lap Imp weighs in just under 12lbs scoped, with sling and ready to hunt. It kicks less than a factory 30-06 with 180g bullets. I am firing 285g bullets at 3120fps. This rifle is very accurate beyond 1000y.

It is possible to have a "big gun" and not be punished or weighed down.

Steve

 

[30BR]

I like the Nosler case better. The short mags are hard to load without compressing. Unless you have them throated long the bullet takes up too much of the case.
I think the Nosler is the better choice.
Steve

Just thinking out loud... What if he cancelled the Brux, pulled the barrel, cut 2 inches off it, fluted it, and throated it? Cheaper than changing calibers and barrels? Weight reduction nearly the same? Then, IF you sell the Vortex for $900 or so, spend the Brux $$ on a Swarovsky Z5 3.5-18 x 44, and shave another 8.5 oz off the rig...