30 NOSLER OR 300 PRC

[WildRose]

I have considered RL26 and RL33 as well. Have you used N570?

Not as yet. I almost bought some a couple of years ago during the shortage because I could alway find it when I couldn't find my "pets" but suddenly Natchez got a big shipment of H1000 and Alliant powders and I was able to lay in a good stock.

I know of guys who swear by it in spite of the cost which I always thought was a bit off putting. It usually ran about a 1/3 or more higher than the others. Haven't done a price comparison in a long time though.

 

[yorke-1]

the 300 PRC is at 98.3 h20 to top of case and 93.6 to neck/shoulder junction (according to Quick Design) has a full caliber neck length at .308" and .017" case taper from bottom of case head to top of body/shoulder junction...... with a 30 degree shoulder angle...... not a whole lot left to "improve" on this case,

if you simply bump up the shoulder to 40 degrees with the .308" neck length and no other changes you get 98.9 gr h20 for a .6 gr increase....

if you stay with the 40 degree shoulder/.308" neck length and reduce taper to .010" then you get 100.2 gr h20.... a whopping 1.7 gr increase in h20....... ""MEH""

so lets say some of you bought into the 40 degree and longer neck for double the barrel life bs.....

take the 300 PRC case and push the neck down to 40 degrees with no other changes and you get a neck length at .355" with 97.6 gr h20 for a loss of .7 gr.....

improve the body for .010" case taper and you end up with 98.9 h20 for an increase at .6gr over the original... WTH is the point ?

so now with the 40 degree shoulder angle and .010" case taper improved body lets push it all up to the "magical" barrel life enhancement of the .320" neck length in 30 caliber, shall we ? you get 99.9 gr case h20 capacity.......

an astounding 1.6 gr gain in capacity over the original..... but hey with the 40* shoulder an longer neck it will magically gain you 150 fps and double your barrel life......

you max it out to maximize case capacity.... to burn more powder.... to get higher velocities, how will it "Improve barrel life" ? a 40 degree shoulder WILL NOT magically offer you any sort of measurable "barrel life " improvements..... it is a retarded and unproven notion.......

this message brought to you by by the letter F...... for facts not folly.....

That's an interesting commentary given the source. It would seem like you of all people would appreciate the reality that there's often no improvement to improvement and that it's just as much about doing something different as it is about the results. The idea that it's not worth doing if there isn't a significant performance improvement seems to fly in the face of a significant percentage of wildcats that get designed just to duplicate the performance of a preexisting option, but do so in a slightly different package.

We can all agree that a 2% increase in case capacity really isn't particularly significant from a performance perspective. But are you arguing that case design doesn't play a role in how a particular chamber design performs or handles pressures? I have to assume that you've had a custom reamer made for a design only to find out that it doesn't perform how you thought it would. Or at the very least you've found specific design aspects that have worked well for you in the past and you apply those to future designs.

Case design matters, more to some than others. That's what starts the whole debate about which 30 caliber chambering to go with, despite them having essentially the same performance potential when all things are equal. Some folks hate belts, others hate short case necks or a specific shoulder angle. Some guys like Fords others like Chevy. Then there's always that one guy who pulls up in a Freightliner SportChassis and tells everyone their trucks suck. It's the same with guns.

 

[Swamplord]

public service announcement for those who may be unwittingly lured to throw their cash into a hole that won't offer any improvement over the original , it's like trying to improve the 300 Win Mag .... lots of $$, effort with no gains ....

changing a shoulder angle 10 degrees and widening the top of body a bit to gain less than 2 gr of h20 capacity WILL NOT change much, a few fps faster maybe, barrel life will not magically improve, remember you just added a bit more fuel to the fire,

with the 300 PRC, Hornady did very well in maxing case design and yet maintain it to where it will function very well at peak pressures for extraction, a solid design that will adapt quite well for semi auto and machine gun use, probably why it appeals to the DOD .... not dissing the cartridge at all, just don't care for the hyped up bs from Hornady, their minions and gun dummy followers


the only way you can get any gain is with a longer freebore to seat bullet out of case for more powder space AND a longer barrel .....

you can do that with any cartridge

 

[Deleted member 25294]

with the 300 PRC, Hornady did very well in maxing case design and yet maintain it to where it will function very well at peak pressures for extraction, a solid design that will adapt quite well for semi auto and machine gun use, probably why it appeals to the DOD .... not dissing the cartridge at all, just don't care for the hyped up bs from Hornady, their minions and gun dummy followers

Say what you want about marketing, but at least Hornady is introducing modern case designs to perform efficiently with modern powders, and offering alternatives to stupid things like belted mags...
These guys don't run on charity, marketing is key to successfully stay in business.

 

[BClrh]

Not as yet. I almost bought some a couple of years ago during the shortage because I could alway find it when I couldn't find my "pets" but suddenly Natchez got a big shipment of H1000 and Alliant powders and I was able to lay in a good stock.

I know of guys who swear by it in spite of the cost which I always thought was a bit off putting. It usually ran about a 1/3 or more higher than the others. Haven't done a price comparison in a long time though.

I have 10lb of N570 and I think it would offer the highest level of performance in the Norma with the 215's, and it is a pretty temp stable powder as well. The thing that I am debating is I don't think any of these double based powders are as temp stable and consistent as h1000 and I think the double base powders may chew up barrels quite a bit faster. I am considering giving up likely 100fps for possibly a more consistent load and better barrel life. I believe Shawn Carlock has posted that when pushing hard with N570 he thinks you could get as little as 1/2 the barrel life.

I think N570 would likely give the highest velocities in the 300 prc and 30 nosler as well with heavy bullets.

 

[WildRose]

I have 10lb of N570 and I think it would offer the highest level of performance in the Norma with the 215's, and it is a pretty temp stable powder as well. The thing that I am debating is I don't think any of these double based powders are as temp stable and consistent as h1000 and I think the double base powders may chew up barrels quite a bit faster. I am considering giving up likely 100fps for possibly a more consistent load and better barrel life. I believe Shawn Carlock has posted that when pushing hard with N570 he thinks you could get as little as 1/2 the barrel life.

I think N570 would likely give the highest velocities in the 300 prc and 30 nosler as well with heavy bullets.

With any cartridge when you push the limits you get smaller and smaller returns in velocity by increasing the charge etc and that will always result in shorter barrel life.

Longer barrels, slower burning powders and bullets with smaller bearing surfaces seem to me to be the wisest way to go.

Find an accurate, consistent load that you can put where it belongs and forget about max velocities and the rest comes together pretty quickly and at a far lower cost.

 

[TG-5150]

the 300 PRC is at 98.3 h20 to top of case and 93.6 to neck/shoulder junction (according to Quick Design) has a full caliber neck length at .308" and .017" case taper from bottom of case head to top of body/shoulder junction...... with a 30 degree shoulder angle...... not a whole lot left to "improve" on this case,

if you simply bump up the shoulder to 40 degrees with the .308" neck length and no other changes you get 98.9 gr h20 for a .6 gr increase....

if you stay with the 40 degree shoulder/.308" neck length and reduce taper to .010" then you get 100.2 gr h20.... a whopping 1.7 gr increase in h20....... ""MEH""

so lets say some of you bought into the 40 degree and longer neck for double the barrel life bs.....

take the 300 PRC case and push the neck down to 40 degrees with no other changes and you get a neck length at .355" with 97.6 gr h20 for a loss of .7 gr.....

improve the body for .010" case taper and you end up with 98.9 h20 for an increase at .6gr over the original... WTH is the point ?

so now with the 40 degree shoulder angle and .010" case taper improved body lets push it all up to the "magical" barrel life enhancement of the .320" neck length in 30 caliber, shall we ? you get 99.9 gr case h20 capacity.......

an astounding 1.6 gr gain in capacity over the original..... but hey with the 40* shoulder an longer neck it will magically gain you 150 fps and double your barrel life......

you max it out to maximize case capacity.... to burn more powder.... to get higher velocities, how will it "Improve barrel life" ? a 40 degree shoulder WILL NOT magically offer you any sort of measurable "barrel life " improvements..... it is a retarded and unproven notion.......

this message brought to you by by the letter F...... for facts not folly.....

WOWZER !!!
Do you have any reamers available for rent off your wildcat designs ? Bet not ! I remember shooting you a p.m. asking if I could rent one or maybe even buy one, heck I don't remember. I believe it was the one based off the 6.5x55. For whatever reason doesn't matter.
I for one appreciate different cartridges, and don't want the same ol'. And the .300 PRC S.I. is to new to exactly know just how much gain is available. For some there are other better benefits than velocity for improving a SAAMI cartridge.

 

[FEENIX]

Say what you want about marketing, but at least Hornady is introducing modern case designs to perform efficiently with modern powders, and offering alternatives to stupid things like belted mags...
These guys don't run on charity, marketing is key to successfully stay in business.

As a life long learner, I totally agree. Effective communication strategy and implementation (to include marketing and their continuum) is an essential element for a successful learning organization. Like it or not, accept it or not, hype or not, Hornady is a success story, especially with their collaborative efforts and partnership with other organizations.

I am a big fan of creativity and innovation and I personally welcome both Nosler's and Hornady's efforts. Having alternative choices is never a bad thing.

Cheers!

 

[TG-5150]

WOWZER !!!
Do you have any reamers available for rent off your wildcat designs ? Bet not ! I remember shooting you a p.m. asking if I could rent one or maybe even buy one, heck I don't remember. I believe it was the one based off the 6.5x55. For whatever reason doesn't matter.
I for one appreciate different cartridges, and don't want the same ol'. And the .300 PRC S.I. is to new to exactly know just how much gain is available. For some there are other better benefits than velocity for improving a SAAMI cartridge.

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbt...topics/9519326/my_Wildcats_no_longer_have_a_p
I need to apologize you, I did not realize you had made theses all publicly available. I can be an *** sometimes and this was one of them.

 

[jd5521]

Tag

 

[brinker19]

I know this is close to what some others have said, but the 30 Nosler I had built will push 212 ELD-X at 3100 with accuracy, but I like the data behind it in the 3050-3070fps better.
I still need to try it on something like an elk, but exits on broadside antelope and mule deer were about 2" unless you hit substantial bone...then it became a little more aggressive.
A bag experience with a 7mm and 168 Berger on an elk nudged me to bump up.

 

[brinker19]

From Defensive Edge...

 

[Tex LR]

Witch one and why?

30 Nosler. Mine is very accurate with 190G VLD's and H1000. I like the quality of brass from Nosler and the cartridge is not finicky to reload for.

 

[FEENIX]

Witch one and why?

Sorry I couldn't resist ...