Switching Bullet Maker, not grain wt. in .280AI

[Troutslayer2]

Gentlemen, long time no see. I don't know why I come here because half the time pouring over your genius minutiae creates more questions than it answers.... I have a problem. I have been shooting Berger 168 VLDs in my .280AI with outstanding accuracy but poor terminal performance. I know many of us claim DRT kills with the VLD but last season I took an elk at 200YDS, about 2850 at the muzzle. He kept standing so I kept shooting and I put three bullets in the boiler room before he went down. I was unimpressed by the lack of exit holes and what appeared to be minimal destruction of his internal organs. I have just added an unrecovered bull elk to my list of accomplishments. I don't want to blame the VLD but I am struggling to come up with any other reason I don't have an elk hanging right now. I have decided to switch it up, and having had great success with Accubonds I picked up a box of 168 Accubond Long Range. I went down this road once before with the rifle but just wasn't getting the accuracy I desired with the regular Accubond.

Can I load, switching nothing but the bullet manufacturer and not blow my face off? I am using a trusty batch of RL22. How far do I really need to back off for load development with a bullet the same weight? I am sort of relegating this rifle to daily driver for ranges inside 500 YDS and I hope to get accuracy enough for that and will push the envelope up as high as yeilds good results. I do not have a lot of time to mess with it right now and am hoping to score success with 1 trip to the range.

I look forward to your responses. Also, if anyone has any good loads for the Accubond Long Range 168 in .280AI, or any insight into this bullet's performance I'm all ears.

 

[HARPERC]

I doubt it will be as extreme as blowing your face off, but yes back off.

You don't say how you established maximum for you current load, so as to how far to back off is hard to say, but 5-10% should work.

I'm currently playing with the Hammer's, and generally finding the lower bearing surface allows a little more powder, or similar charges with the next weight up. They also seem to require less head scratching to find a load. Just loading them to magazine length.

I like the Accubonds also I have some on the shelf I haven't got to.

I believe the Bergers work, but it seems the the folks having the best results spend a little more time making sure the hollow point is clear prior to use.

I like the way the Hammer has evolved, with regards to the size of the hollow point.

They guarantee they will shoot, so not much to lose.

Still waiting to put one in game, got close the other evening, but the youngster couldn't put it all together in time.

 

[Barrelnut]

With the limited time you have, I would try the Bergers once more. Things may work with one trip to the range or they may not. I have "read" that the biggest issue with the ABLR is that the BCs are off. That could cause problems if you don't have time to verify your drops before hand and adjust your BC in your app...

Did you verify that the tips of the Berger bullets are open? This has proven to be important. There is a contributor on here named Broz that has more kills with the Berger bullets than most on this forum. below is a link ,to another forum, but it addresses you issue with the Berger's. They also have a link to a tool on Amazon that will help you clear the tips.

I now do this with all my Bergers that I shoot for game. I have found well over 50% of them to be filled with a clay type substance. This seems to affect the Berger's ability to expand. Sounds like yours penciled thru. This is what opening the tip addresses.

Link: http://www.longrangeonly.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-2415.html

 

[rcoody]

i trim the meplate on all my hunting berger VLD's

if you change bullets you need to use a stoney point and find what the max OAL of that cartridge is in your rifle. the curve of the ogive could be quite different.

i believe i would start over with load development charge and seating depth.

 

[L.Sherm]

If you start over give RL23 a try I picked up 60fps over my RL22 load and had as good or better accuracy.

 

[Troutslayer2]

Wouldn't you know it, the same charge I use with the VLD of 57.5 GR of RL22 was my most accurate load with the long range Accubond. Chrono'd right where to book said it should 2850 although the spread is a lot more than I like, I may never figure out what the factors are for reducing MV variations. Maybe it's the RL22, because everything else was consistent. The nice thing about working up with the Accubond is that I got inside of 1 MOA basically on my first try working in .5 grain increments. I had to screw around so much with VLD to get them to shoot this good, although with enough toying with them I did get the VLD to shoot bugholes but I don't have time to mess around with seating depths right now.

 

[MudRunner2005]

I almost posted this the other day, but decided not to... But figured this might help you out now that you know it wasn't the bullets...

Stop using RL22 and you might get improved accuracy and much lower ES and SD. RL22 is not known to be the most consistent powder. Try IMR 7828 SSC and Federal 210M primers. Try it with both Bergers and Accubonds. Seat the Bergers .015" off the lands, and do the same for the Accubonds. You will have to adjust your dies and get OAL settings for both types of bullets before you can figure out what 15 thousandths is for both bullets. They will most likely be different.

 

[Troutslayer2]

I almost posted this the other day, but decided not to... But figured this might help you out now that you know it wasn't the bullets...

Stop using RL22 and you might get improved accuracy and much lower ES and SD. RL22 is not known to be the most consistent powder. Try IMR 7828 SSC and Federal 210M primers. Try it with both Bergers and Accubonds. Seat the Bergers .015" off the lands, and do the same for the Accubonds. You will have to adjust your dies and get OAL settings for both types of bullets before you can figure out what 15 thousandths is for both bullets. They will most likely be different.

Thanks for that. I am going to pick up a jug of that ASAP and give it a try.

 

[MudRunner2005]

Keep us updated. I can't guarantee it will work, because very little in this game is a guarantee... But it does great in my .25-06 AI and .30-06 AI. So, I'd bet it's going to work great in your .280 AI, being that it's right in the middle of the two.

 

[WeiserBucks]

The 7 SAUM is basically the same capacity and 180 hybrids work great for me. Give them a chance if you don't get what you're looking for in the Noslers . I have personally had better accuracy and on game results from the hybrids than the VLD .

 

[lancetkenyon]

I run the 175 Berger Elite Hunters in my .280AI over 58.0 of RL23 with phenomenal results. Just got back from the desert and shot a 2.9" 3 shot group @ 926 yards in preparation of the upcoming late bull tags members of my family hope to fill. I could not get the 168s to shoot nearly as well.

I also shoot the 180 Berger Hybrids in my 7RM @ 2996, and just took a good bull @ 662 yards with one shot. Bull went 50 yards and piled up. 1/4" entrance, exit was the size of a silver dollar. Chunks of lung Jell-o in the last 30 yards of blood trail.

 

[hseII]

I run the 175 Berger Elite Hunters in my .280AI over 58.0 of RL23 with phenomenal results. Just got back from the desert and shot a 2.9" 3 shot group @ 926 yards in preparation of the upcoming late bull tags members of my family hope to fill. I could not get the 168s to shoot nearly as well.

I also shoot the 180 Berger Hybrids in my 7RM @ 2996, and just took a good bull @ 662 yards with one shot. Bull went 50 yards and piled up. 1/4" entrance, exit was the size of a silver dollar. Chunks of lung Jell-o in the last 30 yards of blood trail.

What Velocity are you seeing with that AI & the 175s?