Well, ButterBean, I take being compared to you as a compliment any day of the week and twice on Friday nights.
I will not be getting 'the vaccine'...
- Thread starter Hand Skills
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X-2 I was gonna say that earlier but I figured the Flakes would freak out, Ivermectin in the Farrowing house an Penicillin by the 100 weight, I'm good to go
rammac
Well-Known Member
Really, so if one mask is supposed to work and we find that it hasn't really reduced the infection rate (as is obvious to even the most casual observer) then we just double down on stupid and recommend wearing two masks? That's not science, that's propaganda.
Try reading this article, I know it's long but if you truly are a scientist then that wont bother you.
https://www.aier.org/article/masking-a-careful-review-of-the-evidence/
They have many citations and links in it and I recommend that you go to each to get the full picture of the evidence that the author cites. Of special note is the link to a 2013 Canadian study that concluded that masks aren't of any real value in a surgical room. If they don't have any real affect in an operating room then how are they effective in the outside world.
I doubt that you'll bother reading the article but I suspect that you'll do your best to refute it's claims anyways.
Your post makes the assumption that the CDC is a political entity and that its reports are based on the preferred political outcome rather than scientific fact. Funny thing is, up until this latest pandemic, the CDC as well as Dr Fauci have worked with administrations of both parties without being accused of being political yet for some reason in the last year they have all of a sudden become evil leftist big government deep state entities that can't be trusted. Every administration since Ronald Reagan have had nothing but good things to say about Fauci and the CDC. Based on that reality, I have to lean towards trusting the accused over the accusers.
It didn't start last year
rammac
Well-Known Member
Oh, I see, your concept of science is about as thorough and your idea of how to debate, make an appeal to guilt rather than debate my comment about my own actions.
Here's an obvious point that you either don't understand or simply don't want to understand, I'm responsible for my own actions, if you are right about wearing a mask, and the people I care about feel the same then they neither I nor they will worry about how they check out.
You also make the assumption that I'm going to die and that everyone around me has an equal chance of of dying from the Covid, and that's scientifically false. What's more, if the people around me thought like you they'd be wearing a mask and they wouldn't have to worry about whether I did or not. I know, you're going to claim that a mask protects others from me but that's also false dogma. As has been pointed out, the experts (including Fauci in a resent televised conversation) claim that the mask protects the wearer, not the other people. So if I don't wear a mask then I'm simply endangering myself, not others. Of course, since I don't believe the effectiveness of a mask it doesn't really matter to me anyways.
Oh, and did I mention, my wife and I already went through our Covid infection months ago, and it was so minor that we didn't really care about having it. We've both had flu symptoms that were far worse. The only lasting effect was a lack of energy for a few weeks. I'm 64 years old and she's 55 years old. Our daughter and son-in-law have gone through the infection and at least a dozen other people that we know have gone through this illness. Of all of the people we know personally that dealt with this virus, two have died. That works out to just about 0.1% fatality rate. Both of those people were older (one was 93 years old and the other was in his 70's) and they both had other morbidities. That fatality rate is right about what they are currently seeing in scientific studies, IFR rates of around 0.1%.
What planet did you say they moved your part of Tennesse to. You "lean towards trusting" someone in the government. You may pay for the government, but the government does not work for you.
Another Casual
Well-Known Member
The people who fear the long term side effects from the vaccine should also be fearing the long term side effects of having covid as we do not understand those. I am glad you and your family were able to beat it, but I would not brag about so many around you having had it.
I wish everyone here good health in the years to come. We will beat this, just a matter of keeping heads down until we do and not giving it to someone else.
I wish everyone here good health in the years to come. We will beat this, just a matter of keeping heads down until we do and not giving it to someone else.
Seems my idea of science is more realistic than yours if you don't believe that the more time spent studying the disease the more our understanding progresses. Also, I never made the assumption that you were going to die. You made that statement about if its my time then its my time and my response was, hopefully you won't take someone you care about with you. The fact that your entire family has had it, speaks volumes and exemplifies my point. Yes, you all survived. Congratulations.
Neither does QAnon
There's a big difference between, rights, responsibilities, and liabilities. I feel these get far too mixed up far too much. Everything is relative here. If a grocery store sells someone a case of beer on Monday and that person drinks that case of beer on Saturday and drives drunk and hurts someone, who is responsble, who is liable? The person was sober when they were in the store and they had the right to sell it. The person that drank the beer is responsible for thier own actions and the store is not responsible or liable for that persons life choices at that time. Not that store, not any other store in the country, not every other driver or car owner. The same can be used for a gun shop that legally sells a gun to someone legally allowed to have one and sometime later said person or gun is involved in a crime. The person that made the bad life choice is responsible not every gun owner in the country. Now if someone KNOWINGLY does something stupid as in sells beer to an obviously drunk person, a gunshop KNOWINGLY sells a gun that's knowingly a prohibited possessor, or a person that KNOWINGLY has been infected and tested so and blatantly disregards precations then yes that person imo is both responsible and liable for those actions. BUT I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE for those actions that those persons did. That is what FREEDOM is and THAT is what this country was built on.
Who and what is QAnon, and what does Qanon have to do with this conversation and my post?
I was thinking the same thing
Hand Skills
Well-Known Member
Thanks guys, let's please keep it respectful, and on topic, if possible. I know we are swimming in politically charged waters here, but I would appreciate it if we could keep the discussion within the bounds of medicine and public health.
In an effort to correct our course I'm going to post this video again. I think it outlines my own concerns better than I can articulate.
PLEASE watch this video! I look forward to more comments
It's really long, I know - here is a brief synopsis
0:00 introduction
2:45 long term care nurse shares experience
10:10 doctor critiques COVID 'vaccines'
22:13 rural doctor shares experience
31:30 neonatal nurse shares experience
35:55 ER nurse shares experience
42:10 Audiologist share experience - complications of masking
44:30 doctor talks about clinical ethics as they relate to public health measures
1:26:21 RN talks about ethics
1:27:20 closing statements
In an effort to correct our course I'm going to post this video again. I think it outlines my own concerns better than I can articulate.
PLEASE watch this video! I look forward to more comments
It's really long, I know - here is a brief synopsis
0:00 introduction
2:45 long term care nurse shares experience
10:10 doctor critiques COVID 'vaccines'
22:13 rural doctor shares experience
31:30 neonatal nurse shares experience
35:55 ER nurse shares experience
42:10 Audiologist share experience - complications of masking
44:30 doctor talks about clinical ethics as they relate to public health measures
1:26:21 RN talks about ethics
1:27:20 closing statements
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