Scopes, what's the clearest 5-25 power?

The brands with Asian glass (Trijicon, Leupold, Nightforce, Nikon and so on) all have to take a back seat to the brands with German glass such as Schmidt & Bender, Swarovski and the others. I have scopes with Asian glass and they're fine, but the German glass is still the best there is at the highest price point.


Edit: I know there are a couple of American brands that are very nice such as March and Tangent Theta. I don't know where they get their lenses, but I presume they just pay a higher premium to the Japanese manufacturer.
 
I don't have the experience with lots of the scopes mentioned on this forum but I do own a NF ATACR 5-25 and a Swarovski X5i 5-25.
Both are great scopes but the Swarovski is much more crisp and clear.
I personally have never looked through any scope that has better glass than Swarovski.
 
jmcmath said:
Neither of those companies are American.

March is Japanese, Tangent theta is Canadian and source their glass from Schott (German)

The only USA made scope glass is in the Vortex AMG
Click to expand...
Well there you go, my post can be read without the disclaimer. The best lenses are from Schott.
 
bdlesh said:
At what price point do you start to get to diminishing returns? How much difference is there once you spend $1500 and $4000+? I don't have $4000 in any of my guns, but I am not a competitive shooter or have the need for one....want is totally different!
Click to expand...

Significant difference. Not as much of a difference between a $200 to $1500 scope, but still quite a bit.
Not only in glass, but in turrets, repeatability, reliability, features, and overall quality.
To be completely honest, unless you have actually spent time behind alpha glass, you don't notice what you are missing. I would say that 95% of shooters would never need $3k-4k+ optics. But spend enough time behind a scope, and they sure become a viable commodity and investment.
This thread is "What is the CLEAREST 5-25 Scope". Not "What is the clearest FOR THE MONEY 5-25 scope". Anyone who says a $1000-1500 scope competes with a Tangent Theta for clarity has never spent time behind a Tangent Theta. And they shouldn't start now if they are happy with their scope. It is mind boggling how good Tangent Theta glass really is. Even other $3000 scopes fall a bit behind Tangent Theta.
 
I've been lucky enough to own a majority of top end glass. I love my NF ATACRS and TT's. Owned Leupold Mk8, Kahles k624i, Kahles k318i, Kahles K525i, several Gen 2 Razors, Trjicon Accupower, Zeiss v6 Conquest, US Optics B25, and a bunch of mid tier and lower end optics. Of all of the ones I mentioned, to the average person I don't know that you can really distinguish between them. My good buddy and I have compared numerous scopes side by side and this has been our experience. One may have better light transmission than the other, while one may have better contrast, while another may or may not have slight chromatic aberration. Some may have more tunneling than others. It's kind of a pick your poison situation. If you are simply looking for glass clarity (clearness) - some of what the others have mentioned above (Tangent Theta, Premier, Schmidt & Bender, Swaro, Kahles, Zeiss, Leica, Minox, etc) - any German glass will likely fit the bill.
 
Depending on the application, even given an unlimited budget, I find myself making trade offs. Weight, size, controls, reticle layout, and basic ergonomics often trump glass quality which when considering the upper tier scopes, can reach diminishing returns when the total package is considered. While my S&B PMII has superior glass, I find my Nightforce ATACR F1 5x25x56 consistently produces higher PRS scores due to some of the aforementioned feature differences. Same principle applies to my March 2.5x25x52 for my style of LRH. I think it could be a mistake to focus solely on glass quality. The end justifies the means.
 
I'm in the mid price glass world...

Nikon for hunting since I enjoy the option of early morning to late evening hunting,,, not the world top tear glass,,, but when the focus and parallax are adjusted to max they are pretty clear optics...

My other LR optic is a simple Sightron,,, pretty good glass in them for the price as well...

I like the idea of the eye specialist first,,, once my glasses are set looking threw the distance section of them,,, the optic is only half the battle to get it to focus clear...

Always more wrong then right,,, Ha
 
Greyfox said:
Depending on the application, even given an unlimited budget, I find myself making trade offs. Weight, size, controls, reticle layout, and basic ergonomics often trump glass quality which when considering the upper tier scopes, can reach diminishing returns when the total package is considered. While my S&B PMII has superior glass, I find my Nightforce ATACR F1 5x25x56 consistently produces higher PRS scores due to some of the aforementioned feature differences. Same principle applies to my March 2.5x25x52 for my style of LRH. I think it could be a mistake to focus solely on glass quality. The end justifies the means.
Click to expand...

This is largely why I have stuck with ATACRS... my TT's go on my multi caliber rifles for ease of re-zeroing.
 
Check out a thread on the optics section of SnipersHide called "new high end tatical article", you can also look at the videos the reviewer made on YouTube. He covers the scopes you are asking about.

I can't give you any direct feedback because the only really nice scope I own is a Vortex AMG. All my other experience is with 2k and under optics.
 
Swaro X5...hands down.
I have top of the line leupolds and nightforce nxs. .
The X5 is easily a much clearer and crisper image and in low light is second to none...not even close. Believe or the second best low light scope I,ve looked through is a leuopld. Mark 4..

Got a little off topic....I believe the X5 will solve you,re issues with focus and clearity
 
Braunschweiger said:
I've been lucky enough to own a majority of top end glass. I love my NF ATACRS and TT's. Owned Leupold Mk8, Kahles k624i, Kahles k318i, Kahles K525i, several Gen 2 Razors, Trjicon Accupower, Zeiss v6 Conquest, US Optics B25, and a bunch of mid tier and lower end optics. Of all of the ones I mentioned, to the average person I don't know that you can really distinguish between them. My good buddy and I have compared numerous scopes side by side and this has been our experience. One may have better light transmission than the other, while one may have better contrast, while another may or may not have slight chromatic aberration. Some may have more tunneling than others. It's kind of a pick your poison situation. If you are simply looking for glass clarity (clearness) - some of what the others have mentioned above (Tangent Theta, Premier, Schmidt & Bender, Swaro, Kahles, Zeiss, Leica, Minox, etc) - any German glass will likely fit the bill.
Click to expand...
I just went through this same thing, and this is the total truth. I looked at all of them. Everyone's eyes see a little differently. The best for me was a Kahles K25i in mills. I have been told it is pretty much Swaro's best glass with Nightforce turrets. Time will tell, but me thinks once you get to this level of spending, you have to just trust your own eyes. They are all excellent. The Kahles has a couple of things I will have to get used to. For one the power ring rotates backwards. The parallax on the upper turret is weird. The left hand windage may have me starting to dial wind. This scope is not the Holy Grail. I doubt any of them are, but I really like it. Also, there is a whole another level from $4-5k. Somewhere in here there are diminishing returns, but the $3-4k level has some very good optics and very good turrets
 
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