Talk me out of a 7mm rem mag

[6.5-300 BEE]

If you are "must have the newest" type you have many choices. If you want a rifle you can always find ammo for, has resale value and proven data up the kazoo the 7mm RM is good. Belts DMS, set it up to headspace on shoulder. Case shape DMS, a given amount of powder in a given amount of capacity produces the same pressuer as the Handloader 300 WSM vs 300 H&H test proved.

I still have a 7x61 S&H, the 2nd commercial 7 magnum. Anyone who thinks it won't kill as well as the latest .284 wonder probably uses a Speer Wildcat manual to reload.

If course you could be super cool and build a 275 H&H ! (1st 7 mag)

 

[bdlesh]

Well if you stick with the boring 7rm you will......
1. Lose the joy of fire forming brass or paying $5 a piece for brass.
2. You won't have the bragging right of something different and better.
3. You will see ammo everywhere and will not have the joy of asking for ammo that doesnt exist at the local gun shop.
4. You might gain 200 fps....might
5. When you decide to sell it everyone will want it.
6. Find the cost of dies and availability common as unicorn farts.
7. Not have people telling how it has been proven for 50+ years all you really need.
This should help not want one....ah... make that want one.

 

[DJ Fergus]

No complaints what so ever with a 7mm rm. I've got three. Norma , nosler & I believe adg makes brass for it. 180 elds just plain shoot. Probably the same can be said about the Bergers. Many years worth of reloading info & experience here on LRH for the round. I like all 7mm cartridges, so I don't have anything negative to say about the others. If I concerned about going short then the saum or Sherman's would be worth looking at.

 

[6.5-300 BEE]

Yup about 26". Most don't know how belted cartridges started. The Brits hunted in nasty wet humid places with corrosive primers and nitro powder. When you're running in those conditions, hunting things that bite/stomp the cartridge MUST chamber. Solution: make cartride way undersize and stick a belt on it for headspacing. Not really necessary in the USA and for best accuracy most set up to headspace on shoulder. For hunting I still use new 300 WinMag brass as it is still made undersized. Hunting accuracy is still just fine and there are no chambering surprises. As an aside my 280AI has a 28" bbl, my 7x61 a 26" and BOTH equal 7mm RM factory loads from a 24" bbl.

 

[Westernhuntr]

I don't shoot much factory ammo but I have never seen 7saum ammo on the shelf. Brass either. 7mm rem mag is all over the place.

What about the case design didn't you like?

People get offended easily about cartridges so I'll start by saying the 7RM is a good round and will work just fine for your needs.

I feel there are improvements to be had by going with a shorter fatter powder column for accuracy and tunability.

The longer neck on a Saum gives you more flexibility in seating depth with a wider variety of bullets, and it's argued can increase throat life.

The Saum has less case taper than a RM and a 30 degree shoulder, less case growth and more efficient with modern powders.

Lastly there's no belt, and here's why I really don't like belts;
The first shot with virgin brass is headspaced off the belt and there can be a lot of case stretch, like .010 or more depending on the chamber and brass used.
This can cause early case head separation, I've had it happen with 3 firings.
Anyone who denies this can happen needs to measure the shoulder length on virgin brass and compare post firing.
Lastly I've dealt with resizing issues where the case expands above the belt, this can be fixed with a special die but it's a pain.

So there you have it..

 

[Skimbleshanks]

What Unguided Missile said. So many people say they do not like the belt, but then are short on specifics as to why not. Buy ammo anywhere. Always have brass available. Easy to sell if you ever do.

The only other thing I would add is that you should consider finishing that barrel at at least 26." While slightly handier, a short barrel loses velocity and gains muzzle blast. By the sound of it, this is never going to be a brush gun or a lightweight mountain gun, so think about letting the 7RM have enough barrel to do its job.

I hunt in western Oregon. It actually is both brushy and mountainous. Not like Wyoming Montana or the Cascade mountains. Still mountains.

 

[Skimbleshanks]

People get offended easily about cartridges so I'll start by saying the 7RM is a good round and will work just fine for your needs.

I feel there are improvements to be had by going with a shorter fatter powder column for accuracy and tunability.

The longer neck on a Saum gives you more flexibility in seating depth with a wider variety of bullets, and it's argued can increase throat life.

The Saum has less case taper than a RM and a 30 degree shoulder, less case growth and more efficient with modern powders.

Lastly there's no belt, and here's why I really don't like belts;
The first shot with virgin brass is headspaced off the belt and there can be a lot of case stretch, like .010 or more depending on the chamber and brass used.
This can cause early case head separation, I've had it happen with 3 firings.
Anyone who denies this can happen needs to measure the shoulder length on virgin brass and compare post firing.
Lastly I've dealt with resizing issues where the case expands above the belt, this can be fixed with a special die but it's a pain.

So there you have it..

Thanks for the input. Belts dont bother me too much. Yeah they are unnecessary and can cause some minor reloading issues but I would rather deal with loading issues than brass sourcing issues. I see the SAUMs are basically dead save for the long range crowd. Once there is a new darling on the block, I see them being even harder to feed.

 

[chilli42]

The only reason to not do a 7mm RM is that's more than you need for the game distance you shoot. I just finished a new 7mm RM with a total weight of 7 lbs ... will add a light scope appropriate for shooting 200-300 yards. Will be perfect for the mountains.

 

[Westernhuntr]

Thanks for the input. Belts dont bother me too much. Yeah they are unnecessary and can cause some minor reloading issues but I would rather deal with loading issues than brass sourcing issues. I see the SAUMs are basically dead save for the long range crowd. Once there is a new darling on the block, I see them being even harder to feed.

ADG makes saum brass, and given how popular that round is with competitive shooters it's never going away.
For your purposes maybe go 7mm-08

 

[Pinoniper]

ADG makes saum brass, and given how popular that round is with competitive shooters it's never going away.
For your purposes maybe go 7mm-08

I too wondered about 7mm-08 but that is, give or take, some 500 FPS slower with a 150 gr projectile and therefore really a whole different class of performance.

 

[Ronald W Schaefer]

7 RM is a great and versatile cartridge. My wife has one in SAKO Finnbear...shoots great with 160 gr Fed Trophy Bonded bullet, Fed 215 primer and 68 grs of RL 25. Barrel twist wont stabilize much over 175. I personally have a 1 shot DRT kill on nice 5X6 Elk at 500 yds using a guides 7mm Greybull rifle (a story there) and 180 gr Berger. I have gotten tired of heavy rifles as I got older, so got a Fierce Firearms CT Carbon Edge in 7mm-08. I weighs 6.5 lbs WITH a Viper Vortex 4-16X44 HS-T scope with custom turrets. With a 22" barrel I get 2850 fps with 145 gr Barnes LRX and that 22" BBL is very handy. I took a nice Mule deer last fall with the little rifle one shot DRT at 475 yds. So you might trade the barrel for a carbon fiber barrel with a brake and stick with that 7RM or go a tad lighter cartridge...but aint no flies on a 7mmRM and you can get ammo at a gas station in Zimbabwe. I'd suggest splashing out for Lapua brass though and save all that brass prep business.

 

[baldhunter]

Another thing to add about the 7mag is the case is 2.5" long.You usually have generous mag box length if you want to load long bullets.That was one of the drawbacks I saw with the 7STW.That case is so long,you really don't have much mag box to work with.I think if I wanted a rifle that was a step above the 7mag,I'd have to take a serious look at the 28 Nosler.

 

[codyadams]

I too wondered about 7mm-08 but that is, give or take, some 500 FPS slower with a 150 gr projectile and therefore really a whole different class of performance.

Do deer at 300 yards or less really need 500 fps more velocity than a 7mm-08???

Not that this is about "needing", but I think an 8 lb ready to hunt gun in a standard bolt face cartridge would be perfect for what the o.p. is wanting, at least if I understand correctly. On the same token, I don't need a .338 Norma Mag to shoot elk and mule deer out to 1000ish yards, a magnum bolt face 7mm or 30 cal would work just fine, I just wanted it.

For the o.p.'s purpose, I would go for a light handling, light recoiling rig myself.

 

[Pinoniper]

Do deer at 300 yards or less really need 500 fps more velocity than a 7mm-08???

Not that this is about "needing", but I think an 8 lb ready to hunt gun in a standard bolt face cartridge would be perfect for what the o.p. is wanting, at least if I understand correctly. On the same token, I don't need a .338 Norma Mag to shoot elk and mule deer out to 1000ish yards, a magnum bolt face 7mm or 30 cal would work just fine, I just wanted it.

For the o.p.'s purpose, I would go for a light handling, light recoiling rig myself.

I can get behind the idea of a light handling, light recoiling rig for deer at 300 yards. And I agree with Codyadams the 7mm-08 would be a good choice of cartridge for that purpose. But I would not use the heavy Palma 30" barrel you have on hand to try to get there.