Short Barrel .308 Weight Savings and Ballistics

[jlarose85]

So, I've got a Bergara Premier Approach that I'm thinking about shortening the barrel on and I wanted to see what you all thought about this from a couple different perspectives. This rifle is going to be 100% dedicated to my hunting property in MS and our longest shot there is just shy of 300 yards (285 to be exact by my range finder). Game will be almost exclusively whitetails with the occasional coyote mixed in. My reasons for wanting to do this are two-fold and probably pretty obvious. First would be to shorten up the gun to make it a little handier as it will live its entire life with a 7.5" suppressor on it. Ladder stands aren't really an issue but when I'm hunting in a shooting house every inch counts when you're trying to get that thing out the window especially if you are in a hurry. Second, some weight saving would be nice. It's not a crazy heavy rifle but it could stand to lose some weight in my opinion. I don't have any super long hikes, and this isn't a mountain rifle, but it'd be nice to shave some weight to make it handle a little better with the suppressor hanging off the muzzle. I'm currently right at about 11lbs. ready to go.

My first question is how much weight do you think I'll save by going down to 16.5" on the barrel and having it flutted? It'd be pretty sweet to knock about a pound off but I'm not sure that's entirely feasible. Second question is do you all think that I'll have any negative effects going that short as far as terminal ballistics are concerned with taking game. I've searched around here and it seems like I'd be fine from what I've read so far at those distances on deer but I wanted to ask.

Last question I have is who are some good smiths that I could get to do this work? I'm pretty handy and have been building AR's for a long time so I don't think I'd have any issues pulling the barrel off the action if I were to send it somewhere but if anyone knows of someone within a few hours of Baton Rouge that'd be even better. I've looked at LRI so far and they seem to have some great reviews if I wanted to ship it off to get the work done.

Let me know what you think and thanks in advance for the input.

 

[WildRose]

So, I've got a Bergara Premier Approach that I'm thinking about shortening the barrel on and I wanted to see what you all thought about this from a couple different perspectives. This rifle is going to be 100% dedicated to my hunting property in MS and our longest shot there is just shy of 300 yards (285 to be exact by my range finder). Game will be almost exclusively whitetails with the occasional coyote mixed in. My reasons for wanting to do this are two-fold and probably pretty obvious. First would be to shorten up the gun to make it a little handier as it will live its entire life with a 7.5" suppressor on it. Ladder stands aren't really an issue but when I'm hunting in a shooting house every inch counts when you're trying to get that thing out the window especially if you are in a hurry. Second, some weight saving would be nice. It's not a crazy heavy rifle but it could stand to lose some weight in my opinion. I don't have any super long hikes, and this isn't a mountain rifle, but it'd be nice to shave some weight to make it handle a little better with the suppressor hanging off the muzzle. I'm currently right at about 11lbs. ready to go.

My first question is how much weight do you think I'll save by going down to 16.5" on the barrel and having it flutted? It'd be pretty sweet to knock about a pound off but I'm not sure that's entirely feasible. Second question is do you all think that I'll have any negative effects going that short as far as terminal ballistics are concerned with taking game. I've searched around here and it seems like I'd be fine from what I've read so far at those distances on deer but I wanted to ask.

Last question I have is who are some good smiths that I could get to do this work? I'm pretty handy and have been building AR's for a long time so I don't think I'd have any issues pulling the barrel off the action if I were to send it somewhere but if anyone knows of someone within a few hours of Baton Rouge that'd be even better. I've looked at LRI so far and they seem to have some great reviews if I wanted to ship it off to get the work done.

Let me know what you think and thanks in advance for the input.

Depending on your contour about a half an ounce per inch I think is pretty close.

I don't know that you'll find anyone willing to flute it for you and if they do, it will have to be lapped again when they are finished and probably should then be heat and or cryo treated again to relieve any stresses induced.

I'd suggest calling Georgia Precision as they kind of specialize in that type of work having done a whole lot of .308's with short barrels for suppressor hunting and shooting.

Don't be surprised though if they suggest your probably going to be best off starting with a new barrel with as much as you're wanting to do to this one.

 

[whhood]

Velocity is hard to say. I have a three .308 rifles that I shot through the chrono today. All three were shooting Sig Sauer 165s

18.5" 700 5r averaged 2650. This is the rifle I've hunted with for the last four years. It is a tack driver. Missouri buck DRT at 325 yards this past season. I would have no problem shooting anything in the lower 48 out to 400 with this combo. About 11 pounds loaded with suppressor. (Sandman S) a little heavy.

18" Barrett Fieldcraft averaged 2730. Shoots great but probably going to move it on down the road. About 7 pounds loaded with a Silencerco Omega direct thread.

16.5" Model 7 averaged 2700. This one surprised me. I was not expecting this much speed from a factory 165 out of a 16.5" barrel. The best part was the three shots were 2697, 2697, and 2699! I couldn't believe it. This rifle will definitely get some woods time this year. About 7 pounds loaded with a Blackhawk Gascan (Omega)

My experience with short 308s is that they perform very well. They might not start out with much but they don't lose very much going short either.

 

[jlarose85]

Good info guys! Appreciate it.

Wildrose, I've though about just starting from scratch but this gun doesn't have many rounds through it and I think the factory Bergara barrel is pretty good. Might have to skip the fluting if it's an issue for stress relief but I'd think shortening it up wouldn't be a problem.

Anyone else have experience with short .308's?

 

[Cajun Hunter]

Following... I'm looking at cutting my current 22" barrel to 18" or just buying a Bergara B14 Ridge Wilderness 18". I'm in the same situation as you. Adding a suppressor and hunt the same situations.

Bayou Teche guns on Arnaudville, LA does great barrel work.

 

[sierracharlie338]

Cut it down you will be fine at those ranges to hunt. Won't be a speed demon by any stretch but will get the job done. I've killed plenty of animals with an 18" 308.

 

[jlarose85]

Following... I'm looking at cutting my current 22" barrel to 18" or just buying a Bergara B14 Ridge Wilderness 18". I'm in the same situation as you. Adding a suppressor and hunt the same situations.

Bayou Teche guns on Arnaudville, LA does great barrel work.

That's good to know. Will they do a full rifle build or just basic gun smithing?

 

[Cajun Hunter]

I'm not 100% sure on the full builds but I believe they do it all. They have been the go-to gun smith in our area for years. Great reputation.

 

[Bucklowery]

My favorite gun is my short 20" 308. 2555 FPS mild but very accurate load and I carry it to about 600 yrds no problem. It will shine to 300 yrds. Don't worry about chopping it off but like mentioned above extra fluting etc you may want to start over

Thanks

Buck

 

[jlarose85]

I'm not 100% sure on the full builds but I believe they do it all. They have been the go-to gun smith in our area for years. Great reputation.

Thanks for the info. I'll have to give them a call and see what their capability is.

My favorite gun is my short 20" 308. 2555 FPS mild but very accurate load and I carry it to about 600 yrds no problem. It will shine to 300 yrds. Don't worry about chopping it off but like mentioned above extra fluting etc you may want to start over

Thanks

Buck

Yea, I didn't realize fluting after the fact would be such an issue but it does make sense with the stress relieving and heat treating that has to be done when the barrel is manufactured initially. I might just have to deal with the extra weight of not being able to flute for a while until I'm ready to rebarrel it and just take what I can get by chopping some length off. When I'm ready to rebarrel I might just go with a 16.5" Proof and call it done but I need to do some more research on steel barrel contours and weights because I definitely wouldn't have a problem with a fluted steel barrel for half the price as long as it was decently close to the weight of the Proof.

 

[whhood]

The weight advantage of carbon fiber goes away with shorter barrels. My 18" stainless fluted barrels weigh the same as my cf barrels. The stainless barrels are heavier at the muzzle though. It's weird putting them on the scale and they weigh the same but holding them you would swear the stainless is heavier.

 

[jlarose85]

The weight advantage of carbon fiber goes away with shorter barrels. My 18" stainless fluted barrels weigh the same as my cf barrels. The stainless barrels are heavier at the muzzle though. It's weird putting them on the scale and they weigh the same but holding them you would swear the stainless is heavier.

That's where I have a lot more research to do is on barrel contours on steel barrels and their associated finished weights because I definitely have no problem sticking with a steel barrel if I can get the weight close to carbon especially considering the price difference. If and when I rebarrel this .308 I'd definitely stick with steel if I could get the weight close to a carbon unit with enough heft to still handle a suppressor on the end of it. Are you comparing steel and carbon barrels of the same length?

Do you think that holds true for say a 20" barrel as well? I'm starting to plan out my first full custom build and want to do a 300 WSM with a 20" barrel and can't decide if it would be worth it to go carbon or not or if I could still get a decent weight with a steel barrel. My general know nothing rule of thumb is that if I can get the finished, in the woods weight at 10lbs. that I'd be happy with that. This isn't really a concern with the .308 but with the 300 WSM I think that'd give me enough weight to make recoil plenty manageable and also make it light enough that I wouldn't mind carrying it all day as the WSM would be my gun to use hunting out west and would live its life in a shooting house in MS.

 

[whhood]

My 300 WSM has a 24" Proof Sendero Light and weighs 6.5 pounds bare and 8.9 pounds scoped and suppressed. I'm building a 20" stainless barreled WSM and the barrel is 2lbs-14oz but will lose some weight when it gets chambered and threaded. A 20" Proof Sendero is 2lbs-11oz. I don't want to be any lighter than my 24" rifle. I have 5lb rifles in non-magnum cartridges and I'll keep it that way.

 

[jlarose85]

That's why I was thinking 10# would be a good goal weight for my WSM build. What SS barrel are you using for your 20" WSM build? Are you going to be shooting suppressed with that one?