Reduced loads bad groups

Discussion in 'Reloading' started by Elkriver, Dec 29, 2013.

  1. Elkriver

    Elkriver Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    95
    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2013
    I have a 25-06 making a reduced load instead of buying a 22 mag or 17 hmr ..... Only. Issue is I can't get a group better than 1.5 at 50 yds went up & down powder scale all about same ... Any advice would be good ... All the holes in paper are clean
     
  2. CWPINST

    CWPINST Member

    Messages:
    8
    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2004
    I would not reduce a 25-06 greatly.....especially if it is an AI.
     
  3. RT2506

    RT2506 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,676
    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2008
    Go buy a 22 mag.
     
  4. jimbires

    jimbires Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,160
    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2008
    did you play with seating depth ? what powder did you try ? did you try different bullets , flat base , boat tails ? Hodgdon has some good info on using H4895 in reduced loads . use caution with reduced loads . you can get hang fires , overpressure from detonation .

    I was working with a reduced load in a 30.06 for a young boy , and was having hang fire problems . I switched powders and things are ok now . I'd have to look at notes for these powders .
    I did a 308 for a young shooter that shot pretty good . I did work with seating depth to dial it in . if I remember right I used IMR4198 powder . this powder was recommended in an older speer book .
    I'm using H4895 in a slightly reduced load for my girlfriends 7mm-08 that shoots pretty good .

    here is the 7mm-08 from 100 .
    [​IMG]


    here are a few pics of the 308 and how seating depth tightened the groups . the only change made was seating depth .
    all from 100 yds
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2013
  5. Elkriver

    Elkriver Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    95
    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2013
    I'm going off load data from a Speer #14
    I need a reduced load for a cougar hunt I'm going on but also need long range ...we'll for me 2-30o -/+ yds ......case I see a big toothie crider that travels in packs .. Don't want to Carrie 2 guns I'm using a 75 gr Speer flat nose with 14.5 to 17.5 Of iMr sc 4759 coal 2.940 didn't play with coal at all .. I went in 1 gr increments form 15.5
     
  6. Elkriver

    Elkriver Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    95
    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2013
    A fire hang fire ...??? Like a slight pause when primers hit ... If be happy if I could get it to shoot like yer 7-08 at 50 yds my reg loads I shoot 3/4 at 100 witch is good enough for me for now
     
  7. jimbires

    jimbires Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,160
    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2008
    yes , a hang fire is a pause between the trigger squeeze and the round going boom .
    I'll take a look at my old speer book and see what it recommends . you can always try H4895 . here is the info on how to do it .

    http://www.hodgdon.com/PDF/H4895%20Reduced%20Rifle%20Loads.pdf





    don't forget to try seating depth .
     
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2013
  8. benchracer

    benchracer Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,503
    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2009
    How far are you trying to reduce your velocity? Knowing that might improve the quality of advice and suggestions that can be offered.

    Two possible courses of action I can think of, depending on what velocity range you are after, are:

    1. Go with a slower burning powder than is normally appropriate for the cartridge. Doing this will typically provide high load density and reduced velocity because the limits of case capacity are reached before the powder can generate full pressure.

    2. If your velocity goals are low enough, use Trail Boss. It is a very bulky powder that supports reduced loads by its very nature. Most Trail Boss loads I have seen produced less than 2000 fps.
     
  9. Elkriver

    Elkriver Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    95
    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2013
    Trail boss is my favorite lead load for 44..45..357..38 .....I just want a redused load so I don't damage the hide if I have a chance to shoot a cougar max range I'm thinking 50 yds. Since we're using dogs to track & tree them off top of my head wanna say it started at 1450 went to 19?? With the powder I listed above I used a different type of bullet to tell right off the bat reduced load my goal is to shoot a cougar & not drive a car thew exit wound
     
  10. g0rd0

    g0rd0 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    588
    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2012
    if you cannot get a good reduced load for your rifle STOP banging your head against the wall. Your rifle is telling you that it wants and needs to operate at higher preasures and speeds.
    Get yourself a bmag and have some gopher bursting fun
     
  11. Elkriver

    Elkriver Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    95
    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2013
    I'm not buying a rim fire I reload & b mag 22 ammo is hard to find if I played the lotto I'd hit that before I found ammo ... Thanx for the help if u can find load data for trail boss that would be great thanx again
     
  12. benchracer

    benchracer Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,503
    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2009
    There is no need for load data. It is a simple formula:

    http://www.imrpowder.com/PDF/Trail-Boss-data.pdf
     
  13. jfseaman

    jfseaman Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,172
    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2012
    Light flat base bullets. Don't bother with boat tails.

    Follow the guidelines for H4895 or Trail Boss depending on how fast you need to go.

    I use Speer Hot-core for my reduced loads.
     
  14. benmarine

    benmarine Member

    Messages:
    9
    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2012
    I have used sr 4759 in 270 win 308 win and 762x54 with great success. Lots of good load data on the internet for this powder. For 270 win with 140 gr noslers I am currently using 25gr of 4759 and getting dime sized groups at 100. I estimate velosity around 1800 to 2100fps next time i shoot i will chrony it. I get more consistent accuracy with sr4759 than than using h 4895 as a reduced load.. Oh all the loads kick like a 223 or 3030 ...

    Trail boss is good to...



    gun) excuse my spelling.. Have fun good luck!