7mm-08 vs. .338 Federal

[Sauer 150]

First off all - Hello from Norway

Since I have some experiance with both calibers at both Short Medium and LR with both I was originally thinking of answering the guy's questions. But as reading through the thread it boils down to a ****ing contest that I from my standpoint have a hard time understanding.

I know from personal experiance the joy and feel of accomplishment to hit a 6" gong 1st cold barrels shot at 600m and a 8x8" steel square at 800 and beyond - but after having been on youtube and looking at the many morons shooting at live game at extended range making poor hits, gut shooting and requireing 3-4 shoots at a previously unharmed animal makes me question the ethics of many hunters state side.

I have many friends in the industry since I'm making my daily living from selling guns and accessories - I have to put some questionmarks with some of the practice and the lack of ethical discussions on the forum.

From what I can read on this forum you are happy with a 90% successrate for 1st shot kills. In my book these are terrible figures - If 1 out of every 10 animals are wounded well then I can personally understand that there is a large growing anti hunter movement in the general non hunting public.

When I personally pull the trigger I want to be at least 99% sure I bag the animal. You can never be 100% sure since things happen in the field but to statistically leave 2-3 red deer and moose in the woods every year would effectively shut me out of all hunting anywhere in my country.

Maybe I'm getting week hearted at almost turning 40 - but seeing wild game animals gutshot, shot of legs, or being alive for minutes after shots being taken with both rifles and archery actually turnes my stomack.

So since the tread has already taken off to another direction -my question is easy. Are the many vids you can find on youtube at present within what you on this forums think is fair chase an consider to be ethical ??

I appologize for being very blunt and may come off as unpolite. I'm actually not but my language skills are not up to the level I can fully utilize the many nuances in the english language

 

[Joe King]

First off all - Hello from Norway

Since I have some experiance with both calibers at both Short Medium and LR with both I was originally thinking of answering the guy's questions. But as reading through the thread it boils down to a ****ing contest that I from my standpoint have a hard time understanding.

I know from personal experiance the joy and feel of accomplishment to hit a 6" gong 1st cold barrels shot at 600m and a 8x8" steel square at 800 and beyond - but after having been on youtube and looking at the many morons shooting at live game at extended range making poor hits, gut shooting and requireing 3-4 shoots at a previously unharmed animal makes me question the ethics of many hunters state side.

I have many friends in the industry since I'm making my daily living from selling guns and accessories - I have to put some questionmarks with some of the practice and the lack of ethical discussions on the forum.

From what I can read on this forum you are happy with a 90% successrate for 1st shot kills. In my book these are terrible figures - If 1 out of every 10 animals are wounded well then I can personally understand that there is a large growing anti hunter movement in the general non hunting public.

When I personally pull the trigger I want to be at least 99% sure I bag the animal. You can never be 100% sure since things happen in the field but to statistically leave 2-3 red deer and moose in the woods every year would effectively shut me out of all hunting anywhere in my country.

Maybe I'm getting week hearted at almost turning 40 - but seeing wild game animals gutshot, shot of legs, or being alive for minutes after shots being taken with both rifles and archery actually turnes my stomack.

So since the tread has already taken off to another direction -my question is easy. Are the many vids you can find on youtube at present within what you on this forums think is fair chase an consider to be ethical ??

I appologize for being very blunt and may come off as unpolite. I'm actually not but my language skills are not up to the level I can fully utilize the many nuances in the english language

Well spoken

 

[flashhole]

What is a Sauer 150? I have a Sauer 202. Remarkably accurate for a light weight sporter.

 

[Sauer 150]

Sauer 150 - is not a gun as far as I know - just a user name taken from two of my favorite things.

In Norway one of the most popular types of competition shooting is a field marksman type where we shot at animal targets. Vitals equals 3 points - center X's equals 5 points. 30 shots total. Prone sitting and standing. All positions are non supported a.ka no slings, bipods etc. A clean round with 30x's = 150 points. Hence the 150

For a Sauer - well I have had quite a few 200's/202's and SSG 3000's, more than 15 since they first came on the market here in -89. I currently own 6 rifles with different barrels in calibers ranging from 6mm XC, 6,5x47 Lapua, 6,5x55, 6,5x284, 280 AI,308 , 30-06, 30-06 AI, 9,3x62 and a 300 Wby. All of the shot better than I'm capable of. Usually they shoot 5 shot groups without any special load development much less than 0,5 MOA right out of the box.

My Medium weight 280 AI (28"- 5/8" muzzle) is my MR hunting gun and shoots 150 Scirocco II's at 3100f/s in approx 3" at 400m. 162 A-Max shoots better - but I hunt for meat so fragile target bullets I leave up to you guys to use.

Most LR hunters here in Norway and Sweden uses a Sauer STR 200 (Skandinavian Target Rifle equals a SSG 3000 with a laminated 3 position stock) in either 6,5x55 or 6,5x284.

I remember telling D Tubb that he needed to get his hands on the distributor ship for these guns in the US since he would wipe the floor with the competition. This was before the 6,5 craze hit you guys- and we knew much sooner than you how much better a slick 6,5 bullet was under difficult conditions than a heavy 220 MK/300 Win was. Unfortunately I say he was already well on his way with his 2000 tube gun - which is probably better suited to you HP shooting than the SSG is. But still many of you should try this gun. You will be amazed what it is possible to get right out of the box for about 3 grand. Barrels replacement is done in a pinch - read 2 minutes and barrels on my side is around 500$ retail

 

[Sniper1004]

I don't know why everybody keeps saying the 338
Fed is a short range round. Of couse it has more drop than a magnum high velosity round. But, the trajectory is very simular to a 308 wim which is used in many long range shooting events. I had the opportunity to shoot a Whitetail with mine at 480yds and the deer did not go 40yds. Now on bigger game I would pass up a shot of that distance do to the reduced energy/penetration at 500yds. Just a sidenote, I was amased the Nikon BDC (tested before hunting) was spot on for the 338 Fed out to 500yds. Good combo. And out of my Tikka, after some bedding, stock work, trigger work, ect. I can shoot under a 4 inch group at 300 yds. I have had more accurate sniper rifles but, never in a light weight, inexpensive, hunting package.

 

[bard]

I use 7-08 for all scandinavian game and 338 winmag if big moose or bruin is on the plate. I have missed something else though especially for boar even though my 7-08 never have any problem taking them out. As the forum starter i look at 338 fed but also 356 win probably built on a Seven with hitech stock. It could be it really, a short light rifle with a heavy big bullet knocking them out without the winmag recoil.

 

[flashhole]

Part of the conversation here is on the Sauer 202, mine is a 7mm RM as shown in this boar hunting video. I wish I could shoot like this guy.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKh_13zOGFc]SAUER 202 - Hunter video - YouTube[/ame]

 

[FEENIX]

I hope the OP (03-17-2010, 12:48 PM) is still not waiting to make a decision.

 

[J E Custom]

Dear all,

many thanks again for all your input.
Concerning the .325 WSM: two potential drawbacks as far as I can see:
- standard short actions are mostly too slim, are they not?
- short barrels (22'') are probably not the best thing to go for?


thanks for your thoughts.

M

I went with the 338 RCM (More bullet choices) I built mine on a Mod 7 Remington action and it fits/works great,

It is almost the same as the 338 win mag Ballisticly but in a short action.

The 325 WSM is almost the same as the 338 RCM but as I said bullets are even larger in the 338.

My barrel length is 23'' and it pushes a 225 grain bullet to 2760 and almost 4000 ft/lbs of energy.

The model 7 Remington is very compact and handy, and with the 338 RCM very powerful.

look up the ballistics and you will be surprised.

Just another choice.


PS: after posting I saw Feenix's post so I to hope he is not still waiting to decide. Oh Well

J E CUSTOM

 

[FEENIX]

I went with the 338 RCM (More bullet choices) I built mine on a Mod 7 Remington action and it fits/works great,

It is almost the same as the 338 win mag Ballisticly but in a short action.

The 325 WSM is almost the same as the 338 RCM but as I said bullets are even larger in the 338.

My barrel length is 23'' and it pushes a 225 grain bullet to 2760 and almost 4000 ft/lbs of energy.

The model 7 Remington is very compact and handy, and with the 338 RCM very powerful.

look up the ballistics and you will be surprised.

Just another choice.


PS: after posting I saw Feenix's post so I to hope he is not still waiting to decide. Oh Well

J E CUSTOM

Perhaps someone else considering the same could use the info, cheers!

 

[bard]

The 325 wsm has fat cartridge giving less mag space fat bolt and as every higher capacity volume cartridge you need a longer barrel to take advantage of the round due to the propellant speed. If I understand what the starter of the topic want it is a short light rifle firing heavy bullet then 338 Federal kr 358 Winchester is excellent choices. If he wanted a long action or fat action with a long barrel I guess the topic would be otherwise.

Go for the 338 Federal or the 358 Winchester as its just a necked jo 308 you get a short round meeting those criterias.

 

[kc]

I have an old friend who killed two Elk with the 7MM08 and used it in Africa kill a Zebra,
a Giraffe, and a Wart hog.
Not to bad I would say. He uses it all the time for Deer hunting.
I believe his Grand daughter uses it for hunting also.

 

[bard]

This year my 7-08 took down a ten point 320 pound red stag, a 200 pound European wild boar and a 242 pound wild boar, plus a few other smaller red deers and roe deers. On boar I use Hornady GMX loaded with 45grs Norma URP and it is extremely deadly and gives a fantastic penetration. Fore red deer I have used 139grs SST and 139grs Interbond but I might just go fully over to GMX when I have used up the SST and Interbond bullets.

Mine is a model 7 with 20" barrel with a Docter Unipoint 2,5-10X50 mounted on it. I love it because it's just under 1 meter in lenght so it's extremely nice in blinds and tight areas. It's very very light to carry and the recoil is almost non existing, it is my favorite gun due to its light, accurate, short as a carbine, manageable recoil and it is extremely efficient on game. The 10 point fell 1 yard from where I hit, the Largest boar ran 15 yards from where I hit it and the heart was fluid and was pouring out of the animal. What a great round.

This is exactly why I am also interested in what else the 308 is good for, the 338 federal sounds like a winner, or maybe the 358 winchester. A short light gun not kicking much sending a thump. For me most of my hunting is at pretty short range, less than a 100 yards. I do hunt reindeer where the range is longer but reindeer is a match in heaven for the 7-08 loaded with 139grs SST and it's safe to say it shoots more than flat enough for this hunt. I have used my 338 winmag for hunting large animals however it's a lot of gun to carry and it's best for hunting from a blind not to far to walk really. This caliber flattens what it hits, it's very good for large animals, what I don't like is the length of the system, the weight of it and the recoil of it. Max loaded 250grs bullets is felt and it's easy to develop a flinch unless you train a lot and get used to it. I don't care what anyone say heavier recoil makes you shoot worse unless you work very hard at it, and it's not fun shooting 100 rounds on the range at the time with it. I am used to it, but I prefer less recoil. The way I see it is the 338 Federal is very good use of the 308 cartridge, but maybe 35 whelen is a better match for the 358 cal. Not sure really. I know the 358 Norma Magnum use the same basic design as the 338 winmag however it is more powerful. It actually matches the 375 H&H in some loads, why I have no idea but maybe it's more optimum bullet for the case? It seems to me that 338 Federal is perhaps more optimum than even the 308 itself, just as the 35 whelen is more powerful than the 30-06 even though the case is the same. Could be a better match with bullet to case.