50cal WSM

Discussion in 'Rifles, Bullets, Barrels & Ballistics' started by 7ultra, Nov 26, 2004.

  1. 7ultra

    7ultra Well-Known Member

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    Just floating this idea, just want to know if it is even possible. Could one take a WSM case and blow it out to accept 50cal BMG bullets. Designed intent would be to dublicate the performance of a 50 cal Whisper, but do so in a more economical package. Again, just wondering If it would fly (biggest problem seems to be the shoulder, or lack thereof) thanks
     
  2. Fiftydriver

    Fiftydriver <strong>Official LRH Sponsor</strong>

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    7Ultra,

    I have looked into using the RUM case blown out and necked up to .510" but never felt comfortable enough with the small shoulder, even with a max blown out case to try it.

    The WSM will have considerably less powder capacity then the Whisper and it used the big Wby hulls. Still the 500 Whisper is designed to work at 1050 fps and I would think the WSM case could provide that with top loads.

    Still, the shoulder issue will be a concern.

    A better case would be the Lazzeroni Short Magnum case as it is basically the same capacity but in a bit shorter and even fatter case.

    I personally do not care for the quality of Lazzeroni brass so this is why I would not go that direction but it would provide a more positive shoulder, especially if sharpened up to 40 degrees or so.

    Also, at the price of the Lazzeroni brass, the big Wby hulls are cheaper by a fair margin and much better in quality in my opinion.

    Goog Shooting!!

    Kirby Allen(50)
     
  3. jb1000br

    jb1000br Well-Known Member

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    the 50 on the 460wby case is the peacekeeper, not the whisper isnt it? and well capable of about 3/4 of a BMG in performance from the numbers i've seen.

    2400 with a 750amax IIRC.

    what case is the whisper on anyway? short 460wby?

    JB
     
  4. Fiftydriver

    Fiftydriver <strong>Official LRH Sponsor</strong>

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    The Peacekeeper is basically a 500 A-Square throated to accept the long 50 BMG bullets.

    It is built on the full length 460 Wby case.

    The 500 Whisper is also built on that same case but is shortened to I believe a bit under 2" in case length but I do not have the exact length in front of me right now.

    It is true the 50 PK is a great round but at extreme range the 50 BMG is still the king of the 50's by a fair margin.

    Considering the savings in powder for the PK compared to the spendier brass of the PK and I would rather have the 50 BMG if your looking for a high performance 50 cal round.

    Recoil of the PK in typical weight rifles is nearly identical to the 50 BMG in their 30 lb rifles, just less performance.

    There was alot of fuss about the PK when it came out but the interest has since died off, especially with the idea of the 408 class rounds coming out.

    Good Shooting!!

    Kirby Allen(50)
     
  5. Brent

    Brent Well-Known Member

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    The 500 Jeffery case has a smaller rim diameter than the big Weatherby or Rigby cases, (slightly larger than the WSM) it has more water capacity and is shorter ta boot... a good choice, with Horneber brass.

    I wouldn't trust the little itsy-bitsy shoulder that would be left with a 510/300 WSM... if you could even call it a shoulder.

    Economical being cheaper brass, it don't get much better than the big Weatherby stuff for $2.00 each, well, besides surplus 50 BMG ammo.
     
  6. 375rifleman

    375rifleman Well-Known Member

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    A 510/300 WSM sounds like a interesting idea, especially if it could be loaded to handle the 800 grain Barnes Bore riding bullet at around 1100 fps. Someone could put it in a tube style chassis that's compatible with folding AR-15 stocks and an barrel length 50 caliber suppressor that's 16.5" and AICS magazines they would have a rifle that would be good out to a mile with around 1000 ft lbs of energy remaining and collapse to around a suitcase in size and be almost silent. However with as much drop as subsonic cartridges have you would have to have some sort of adjustable scope base like a cold shot Moab with 300 MOA of adjustment. If I'm thinking correctly that is.
     
  7. Mikecr

    Mikecr Well-Known Member

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  8. Lefty7mmstw

    Lefty7mmstw Well-Known Member

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    my gun smith has built one of these... I haven't heard much from him yet on it, but he's been working on loads for it....
     
  9. TXAoudadKlr

    TXAoudadKlr Well-Known Member

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    I'm more interested in a 458WSM
     
  10. 375rifleman

    375rifleman Well-Known Member

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    I know of or at least have heard that for extreme range shooting a person is limited by the maximum supersonic range of the cartridge that he or she is shooting out of their rifle that is exactly why I am trying to find the maximum accurate range of subsonic cartridges. The problem I have noticed with using subsonic cartridges is : 1. They never have the high muzzle velocity or energy levels of their supersonic counterparts. 2. They generally do not have the flat trajectories of their supersonic counterparts so someone would have more drop to take into account. 3. They do however hold their energy levels very long especially when high BC bullets are used. 4. I have not tested how far subsonic cartridges will maintain sub-moa and moa accuracy (if anyone has for their setup I'd like to know). Thanks for any thoughts, opinions, or answers.
     
  11. RockyMtnMT

    RockyMtnMT Official LRH Sponsor

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    I had a long conversation with a fellow using the 300 Blackout. He was talking about a group of guys that were competing with each other long range. They were able to keep some fair accuracy to 200y. That was their threshold. My thought on this is it will take a different bullet design to get better accuracy down range.

    Steve
     
  12. 375rifleman

    375rifleman Well-Known Member

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    Does anyone think that MOA accuracy at a mile could be achieved with the 510 WSM or any other 50 caliber (.510) subsonic cartridge ? I know that one of the first obstacles would be to deal with the extreme drop that subsonic cartridges have, that's the reason for the cold shot 300 MOA MOAB adjustable base. But even at a mile if using high BC bullets like the 750gr Hornady A-Max it still retains around 1000 ft lbs of energy. And being subsonic it doesn't undergo the accuracy and stability stealing transonic zone because it was never supersonic to begin with. Thanks for any thoughts, opinions, or answers.
     
  13. Lefty7mmstw

    Lefty7mmstw Well-Known Member

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    I highly doubt it on the mile; if nothing else time of flight would kill you. I would think of this as a hard hitting mid range round that might be adapted to a auto loading platform well.
     
  14. jfseaman

    jfseaman Well-Known Member

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    :D:D:D

    A "Cold Shot M.O.A.B 300" would be very cool. Does it exist?:cool::cool:

    The 150 MOA base does exist.

    Starting sub sonic 1101fps with a 750 A-Max, JBM says at 1 mile (1750 yards) you would need 266 MOA or just under 5,000 inches. Would it still hold sub MOA? No wind, no thermals, no birds flying by to disturb the air, an ES of 3, SD if 1. Sure.lightbulb

    Starting with as fast as you can go from a 32 inch barrel. Seat .300 of shank. Stuff the case full of H335 for 1850fps. JBM says at a mile you will need only 124 MOA. 2,200 inches.

    Of course this is all QB and JBM numbers and may not represent anything real.gun)