"I LOVE FREEDOM" I am sorry for the loss of your/our freedom. Scientific research and evidence have been infected by politics, and I see no cure on the horizon.I've been contemplating even to post in this discussion because fundamentally it's inflammatory and divisive.
That said, masks don't work. Period. They never have. I would challenge you to find a single study published prior to 2020 that demonstrated on a large scale that they were effective. They don't exist. Furthermore most studies published in 2020 don't support their use either. Most of them are based on mechanistic models/simulations and not real world data. Sorry to burst peoples bubbles, but science existed prior to 2020. The only "mask" that can prevent transmission is a plastic bag because it will permanently prevent respiration. The purported "science" behind mask wearing started with HAMSTERS that were separated by a wall of mask material and they had access to fresh air vented through the top of their container, because they would have otherwise suffocated. They might as well have been in separate containers. That type of study doesn't prove or support anything. It's not even the correct species of animal and they weren't humanized hamsters. It's absolute garbage.
Furthermore, it doesn't take something like the Danish study that was cited here to actually know that masks and other social containment measures don't work. Case in point, look at California. The most populous state in the country with 40,000,000 people. They have been locked down and under a mask mandate since April and look at their coronavirus numbers in comparison to states that haven't been locked down or under a mask mandate. If any of that worked, then California should have rid itself of COVID 19 in like June. Hasn't happened. Same with New York. Combined with states that haven't implemented such mandates, that means that in a real time population based study of over 100,000,000 people, neither masks nor social distancing nor destroying people's livelihoods have influenced the incidence or prevalence of the disease. To the contrary you can make a legitimate argument that they have made it worse and the data would be on your side. The only thing they have definitively done is increase the incidence of depression, suicide, poverty, domestic violence, violent crime to include murder, and substance abuse, and have destroyed 10s of millions of peoples livelihood to the point that they may not ever be able to recover financially. They have literally become destitute. That is an unequivocal fact.
However, what is also a fact is that COVID 19 DOES KILL some people. No question. That number is also much lower than the reported deaths attributed to it. The CDC even published real data, from real Americans, in America which demonstrated that on average people dying from COVID 19 had on average 2.8 other diagnoses listed as a cause of death. In most cases COVID 19 wasn't the primary cause of death. What does that mean? It means that most people didn't die from respiratory failure or COVID related cardiomyopathy. They died from the other thing(s) that brought them to the hospital such has a "regular" heart attack, stroke, bacterial pneumonia unrelated to COVID 19, urinary tract infection, gunshot wounds, getting hit by a car, etc and they happened to test + for COVID. Have you noticed that ever since CNN or MSNBC started putting up their little death and infection counters that they calculated mortality rate keeps going down? Do you think that's because COVID is a) becoming less dangerous b) that we are exponentially better at treating it c) because we are just testing a lot more people? The answer is a combination of b&c. With a 40+% a symptomatic "carrier" rate it's just the tip of the iceberg. The other thing to think about though in relation to wearing masks etc is that currently there have been 27 million cases of documented COVID 19 infection in America. Given that most people in one way or another are only 6 degrees of separation from knowing/being socially connected to everyone else in America that means that EVERYONE is going to contract COVID 19 at some point. EVERYONE. Let that sink in. That's not to take away whatsoever from the people who have died from COVID 19, thats just the reality of the data. The fact that we have a novel mutation of a virus that now presents a new threat to the mortality of some people is tragic. However, people die from all sorts of stuff, COVID 19 is no exception. What's exceptional is the rabid response that was immediately implemented by many state, and now our federal government. Take Washington state for example. They had fewer than 1000 cases and the governor wanted to implement martial law...makes you wonder.
That brings me to my final point, which may come as a surprise after reading what I just wrote, you know what works against protecting yourself from viral illness? VACCINES and either using an alcohol based hand sanitizer or washing your hands multiple times/day, and not spitting in each others mouth/nose/eyes. Masks don't prevent the latter. They actually concentrate viral particles and make them and the air passing over them more infectious. You touch it and touch a door knob etc and you create a concentrated spot of viral particles. Whereas if you openly breath into the atmosphere UV radiation destroys the viral DNA almost immediately. Our knowledge of molecular biology and immunology has increased more than 1,000,000,000 times since the first vaccine was created. That's why what used to take 10 years now takes a couple weeks. In my lifetime, I've yet to have a vaccine that was worse than the disease that it was administered to prevent. Opting to wear a mask and avoid interacting with people for eternity is stupid, especially considering all evidence to date doesn't support that as being even remotely effective.
To the contrary, the COVID 19 vaccine is extremely effective. Whether or not you believe COVID 19 is more lethal than anything known to man or no worse than influenza, the vaccine works. Johnson and Johnson tested their vaccine in 60,000 people, against multiple strains of the virus, and it was 100% effective against hospitalization and death. 100%! With no deaths or anything ridiculous like that from the vaccine. Despite my perception that the danger of COVID 19 is conflated, the reality is that the vaccine is still exponentially safer than contracting the virus, even in people who aren't at risk of death to begin with.
Personally, I LOVE FREEDOM and I believe in private enterprise and peer reviewed science, far more than I trust Uncle Sam. I don't want to give the government any other excuse whatsoever to infringe on our personal sovereignty and so if that means that I have to get a vaccine every year then so be it. What's the excuse for continued lockdowns etc when you are immune? I'd rather have my livelihood and freedom. Vaccination is the only real hope for that. Cut the head off the snake and eradicate it. If you think that .gov is going to let you roam free without getting it in the near future you're fooling yourself.
I will not be getting 'the vaccine'...
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"I LOVE FREEDOM" I am sorry for the loss of your/our freedom. Scientific research and evidence have been infected by politics, and I see no cure on the horizon.
Hand Skills
Well-Known Member
It blows me away how little respect healthcare workers are given when they are putting their jobs and even licenses on the line by simply sharing their experience.
I guess some people prefer getting their information from faceless websites. look, it says 'fact checked' right there!
Hint: just follow the money. Who funds Politifact?
www.gatesfoundation.org
I feel so many of us are living in a virtual world. I once thought that Virtual Reality would require techno-goggles, or neurolink, but I now realize it's already here!
I guess some people prefer getting their information from faceless websites. look, it says 'fact checked' right there!
Hint: just follow the money. Who funds Politifact?
Committed Grants | Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation
This database includes grant commitments made by the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation and previous foundations of the Gates family (William H. Gates Foundation, Gates Library Foundation, and Gates Learning Foundation) from 1994 onward.
I feel so many of us are living in a virtual world. I once thought that Virtual Reality would require techno-goggles, or neurolink, but I now realize it's already here!
antelopedundee
Well-Known Member
Maybe it's better than nothing until a "real" vaccine comes along.
At the end of the day the choice is, do I take my risk/chance with the vaccine or do I take the chance that if I get the virus that it will be asymptomatic or have no lasting effect. And that's all I got to say about THAT!
So it seems
Hand Skills
Well-Known Member
Thanks for your input. I wish it were that simple. Unfortunately, I must point out what I believe to be a 'false dilemma'
By taking the injection, one's chances of contracting the virus do not change.
While it's shown to lessen the possibility of our immune system reacting to the virus, this means someone having received it has a greater chance of being asymptomatic when they contact the virus.
The 'vaccine' is not shown to prevent transmission of the virus.
It says so right on the label.
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I thought that was so. So getting the vaccine is only of benefit to me, and not all of my fellow citizens? It's for me and me alone? Then maybe the government has no excuse for imposing mandatory injections, or "else". Whatever the "else" is, that they might have in mind.
I worked for a State regulatory agency (the government) for 34yrs. I always enjoyed saying "Trust me, I work for the Government, and I'm here to help" amongst my co-workers. Always good for some giggles. Never dared say it outside the office, other than amongst 'friends'. No need to pick a fight...
Anyhow, if I pose the same threat of communicating the virus (that seems to be the admission of the manufacturers), then my opting out of the shot shouldn't be as big of an issue to others.
Which begs the question, why the pressuring from some that we should all get the juice, for the benefit of our common good??? Other than I might occupy a hospital bed... For those that wanna object based on that argument, go ahead and get the juice. Then you won't need the hospital bed I might occupy. You'll not be afflicted. And me abstaining means there's an extra dose for you.
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the way I understand how the vaccine works is by teaching our body to attack the virus before it can enter our cells because it is when it enters the cells is when things get real dangerous but you have to contract the virus for it to work.
it don't stop you from getting it or spreading it, it just helps to keep you alive if you do get infected with it
it don't stop you from getting it or spreading it, it just helps to keep you alive if you do get infected with it
The majority of " fact checkers " are nothing more than left wing propaganda machines. I saw a post on facebook the other day. It was a picture of the crazy buffalo guy that was at the capitol building on jan.6th and beside it was a pic of the one eyed cartoon character on futurama , an adult cartoon . It said something to the effect that the buffalo guy was really the one eyed cartoon girl. It was stamped with facebooks fact checker warning stating it had been investigated and found to be false ! Really ? Im glad they were there to clear that one up for everyone . I really think these social media sites are using computer programs that automatically dispute anything that goes against their narrative. In that case the program was unable to differentiate between a fictitious cartoon character and a real person and didn't want the post to take away from the buffalo guy being a trumper . It was later shown the buffalo guy has been a part of several antifa protests as well.It blows me away how little respect healthcare workers are given when they are putting their jobs and even licenses on the line by simply sharing their experience.
I guess some people prefer getting their information from faceless websites. look, it says 'fact checked' right there!
Hint: just follow the money. Who funds Politifact?
Committed Grants | Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation
This database includes grant commitments made by the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation and previous foundations of the Gates family (William H. Gates Foundation, Gates Library Foundation, and Gates Learning Foundation) from 1994 onward.
I feel so many of us are living in a virtual world. I once thought that Virtual Reality would require techno-goggles, or neurolink, but I now realize it's already here!
Its getting real crazy out there !
What's your definition of Freedom?
On another matter, I just finished glass bedding two barreled actions into expensive stocks. Without gluing them in "permanently" and no lasting 'ill' affects or communicable consequences.
So like Bill Murray said in Caddie Shack, at least "I got that going for me".
So like Bill Murray said in Caddie Shack, at least "I got that going for me".
Pfizer is actually showing that it prevents transmission right now and I would bet that they will absolutely advertise that their vaccine reduces transmission as soon as they can demonstrate it objectively.
I wont be getting this vaccine / immune system mutator . The only way would be if i was rendered unconscious and was injected without my knowledge . I can survive without anything that would require i have it . Id rather give up conveniences than turn my immune system over to the drug czars and vaccine profiteers . Bill Gates is a lunatic and responsible for many deaths across the world . He would be in prison now if not for his wealth. He was caught dead to rights and was on the verge of being ruined a few years back . Do you know how he made this miraculous come back ? He started the Bill Gates foundation , stuck a billion dollars in it and was washed clean as a rocky mountain snow shower . It would be nice to see just who has benefited from those dollars . Id say that list would be a whos who of the crooked beurocrats in this country.
The way these vaccines work is by inducing cells to produce the "Spike" protein sequence from COVID 19. Your body naturally recognizes these as pathogen associated molecular patterns and makes antibodies against them. There are a couple cell pathways through which it does this. It then destroys the facbricated Spike protein sequence and the remnants of the mRNA sequence. Your immune system then maintains memory of this in B/plasma cells. Then when confronted by the same or similar type Spike protein in the natural environment these plasma cells immediately make antibody and destroy the virion. The same technology is being used to attempt to create vaccines to kill cancer cells.
Defiantly not this
"Personally, I LOVE FREEDOM and I believe in private enterprise and peer reviewed science, far more than I trust Uncle Sam. I don't want to give the government any other excuse whatsoever to infringe on our personal sovereignty and so if that means that I have to get a vaccine every year then so be it. What's the excuse for continued lockdowns etc when you are immune? I'd rather have my livelihood and freedom. Vaccination is the only real hope for that. Cut the head off the snake and eradicate it. If you think that .gov is going to let you roam free without getting it in the near future you're fooling yourself."
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