Rick Richard
Well-Known Member
I just purchased one of these also and very pleased with the quality and simplicity to use.
Some brass not bumping back
- Thread starter bultinkle
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So just size em down a bit more...I sometimes cut the bottom of the die down as few thousandths, so they all fit...002", .003" to 004" doesn't matter, they all chamber in every 308 I own, bolt or auto... military LC, Lapua, or Winchester, although Winchester takes a different size bushing. Thousands of 308s never annealed one...and don't plan to. Even form brass from other calibers...the only one that required annealing is Starline Grendel basic...cause they do not anneal the straight wall case...and tell ya so on their website. Today I'm forming straight wall .500 dia to 30 cal, one homemade die and one factory die. No annealing, no lube on half the case where the new shoulder forms, perfect shoulders with just 2 dies...45 to 30 caliber, trim and ready to shoot , but I'll skim neck turn them. I used the new chamber reamer to make a chamber gauge. Waiting on the new AR bolt to measure against the barrel extension, for clearence and headspace. This being a semi wildcat the newly formed brass will be used as a go gauge, as it consistently .001" below the newly made chamber gauge, with the same reamer that will chamber the barrel.
M1A1ABRAMS
Well-Known Member
So you're saying I need to BUY a neck trimmer now ? Cmon Man I don't earn money that fast. Lol
I cheat,... I have 2 lathes, & a Bridgeport mill, one lathe is fully tooled, a Hardinge Toolroom lathe with collets to neck turn, very easy, accurate, and fast...aleady paid for ...so no high interest loan to consider. So zero cost to turn necks...now,.. but the initial cost was very high, and took years to accumulate...the only advantage to being an old machinist...so you can probably buy or find a tool for your neck turning and trimming operations somewhat more economical then my $100,000 expenditures, ...probably much more, if tooling and measuring equipment is added...there is nothing of value to steal in the house...the treasures are all in the shop. 4 rollaway with top boxes full of tools...steel shelves full of milling accessories...all this, so that I can turn my case necks!
M1A1ABRAMS
Well-Known Member
I was considering a mini lathe in the future to play with. My neighbor has a Grizzly. Fairly nice size. He makes shotgun barrels and chokes
LOL...It's another rabbit hole to dump money in...but it can pay off in time, as you can make parts, chamber your own barrels, etc. I'd get one large enough to do that, and have your neighbor help ya. There are books and videos on general lathe operation and rifle chambering. I find it totally fun in my old age, when you are not doing it as a job... I started a 5 yr apprenticeship program in a union shop building parts for refuling nuclear reactors, for 24 yrs with 15 yrs on nuclear weapons, and submarines, cluster bombs, & government contracts. Finished up 11 yrs in robotics and computer industry, and back to college to learn CNC programming. So I realize things are easy for me are difficult for others...but ya got to start somewhere, if you have the desire you will succeed. Learn from you mistakes, and you will never know it all, I'm still learning all the time. Explore the limits of your imagination, if you have the tools you can build it.
Rflshootr
Well-Known Member
It's a huge rabbit hole....some big enough for an elephant to live in.
You'd probably be better off sweet talking your neighbor into teaching you on his machine and buying your own inserts, reamers and anything that you might fubar of his. If you do enough machine work, it's not a matter of if it'll happen, it's a matter of when. Stupid mistakes are the worse....especially if it's on a $400 barrel.
If you really want a lathe, start pricing tooling, chucks, cutters, reamers, drills gauges and so forth. You might think a bit differently, especially if you think a neck turner is expensive.
You'd probably be better off sweet talking your neighbor into teaching you on his machine and buying your own inserts, reamers and anything that you might fubar of his. If you do enough machine work, it's not a matter of if it'll happen, it's a matter of when. Stupid mistakes are the worse....especially if it's on a $400 barrel.
If you really want a lathe, start pricing tooling, chucks, cutters, reamers, drills gauges and so forth. You might think a bit differently, especially if you think a neck turner is expensive.
Culpeper
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Sep 5, 2008
- Messages
- 197
Wow, this should not happen to once fired Lapua brass. For whatever reason it is the brass. The die is fine. Do a complete FL size on the suspect brass and an equal number of brass that bumped okay measure and see what you get. If the suspect brass is still different just cull them and call Erik and ask for a refund. If they FL size fine than just start over with them and see if the problem persists. It is too soon so it is a simple matter of indexing the suspect cases to identify them and start from scratch.
Last edited:
Yep this was all full length sizing.
Since last update I wondered about a post from @dcpreston with screwing the die in further than instructions suggested due press flex. 1/4 turn past metal contact without brass was doing nothing to those further expanded cases.
I got the die a full turn past metal contact (without a case) and held the ram down for a good 6-7 seconds each and it got me to a thousandth bump at the shoulder comparator on those cases.
I think I've got a mean combo of a select few cases that weren't fully annealed from the factory, perhaps a chamber that's a touch larger or a die that could benefit from being shaved a bit and my full house pressure loads popped them out nice tight, and an old Lee press that's flexing a lot when it needs to work this hard. I've never put this much pressure into it. Luckily my bench top is made of home cut white oak 2x12s!
I have marked these cases well as suggested and set them to the side. I'll see about annealing them next time or when I have a larger batch of brass that could use the investment. Before spending a ton of money fixing things I'll reload all the cases that didn't have an issue and see if we have any more problems. Maybe tell the family member I could use an annealer for Christmas
Appreciate the help from the forum and even a pm offering to anneal them for me. Lots of people willing to help!
Culpeper
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Sep 5, 2008
- Messages
- 197
Just so there is no confusion I was referring to a complete FL size and not a partial FL just to bump the shoulders. If I'm understanding correctly you have already done this and the suspect brass didn't cooperate? If so, contact Lapua as long you weren't working up a load with virgin brass. There should be no need to anneal a few suspect Lapua cases after one firing. All that is going to do is change the properties of your suspect cases so they will still be different and possibly introduce a new variance. Right now, after only one firing, it is too soon to really come to any conclusion.Yep this was all full length sizing.
Since last update I wondered about a post from @dcpreston with screwing the die in further than instructions suggested due press flex. 1/4 turn past metal contact without brass was doing nothing to those further expanded cases.
I got the die a full turn past metal contact (without a case) and held the ram down for a good 6-7 seconds each and it got me to a thousandth bump at the shoulder comparator on those cases.
I think I've got a mean combo of a select few cases that weren't fully annealed from the factory, perhaps a chamber that's a touch larger or a die that could benefit from being shaved a bit and my full house pressure loads popped them out nice tight, and an old Lee press that's flexing a lot when it needs to work this hard. I've never put this much pressure into it. Luckily my bench top is made of home cut white oak 2x12s!
I have marked these cases well as suggested and set them to the side. I'll see about annealing them next time or when I have a larger batch of brass that could use the investment. Before spending a ton of money fixing things I'll reload all the cases that didn't have an issue and see if we have any more problems. Maybe tell the family member I could use an annealer for Christmas
Appreciate the help from the forum and even a pm offering to anneal them for me. Lots of people willing to help!
Jeffpatton00
Well-Known Member
I once owned a huge boat, ignoring all the anecdotal advice that it's better to have a friend with a boat than to buy one yourself.... so it's probably good to let your neighbor do your lathe work, rather than trying to get into it yourself. On the other hand, if you have some money and the time, it'd be a cool ability to learn and exercise. This is coming from a guy who just had to own a mill, but has never really had a good answer for those who ask "what do you need it for?" My answer has always been that I need it for whatever comes along, and it's been surprising how often I've needed it for something.
This was a VERY good question. The answer is "runout reduction".
Zactly!!
In your case, what other people said about taking some metal from the mouth of the die, has to be done. Not all dies come out to spec and somebody's off day on Quality Control can land you in a bad place.
Me? I'd never try taking that metal away from the die mouth. Ensuring a flat angle is there after you've finished is beyond my skill set. Might be worth asking other people just how to go about it though.
DoneNOut
Well-Known Member
I lucked out and the .002 + shell holder was .0015 shorter than the shell holder I was using. So, I just have enough to get the brass to chamber freely to slight touch.
