Questions about annealing, brass and primer pocket longevity

[DartonJager]

Once again looking to increase my reloading knowledge.
Was wondering if there is any rules of thumb on how much longer annealed brass will last VS brass that's never annealed.
And even if as I suspect annealing will significantly increase brass life expectancy am I correct in thinking annealing does nothing for primer pocket longevity and if correct won't the primer pockets wear out eventually especially if you as I do tend to reload using close to maximum safe pressures?

 

[Bob Wright]

Too many variables.
Generally, annealing benefits consistency in reloading, reduces split necks. Some swear never to anneal. Others anneal alot, or every time.
Primers pockets going away are not an annealing issue. One should never anneal the case entirely anyway. Plenty of info online.
Nosler brass among others are softer in the case head and cannot take high end pressure, long if at all. That, you have to monitor yourself, decide if other brass works longer in your application.

 

[Cemetery21]

Yes, my experience (however limited) tracks with your assumptions. I was losing brass due to split necks until I started annealing. I have not split a neck since. Now, brass lasts until the primer pockets can no longer hold a primer. So, although there is likely a consistency/accuracy potential in annealing, my use is for preservation of necks on brass that I have time and money invested in prep.

 

[Dosh]

The two aren't related. I anneal for neck consistency and longer life. The primer pockets depend on load charge and brand of brass. Some pockets go quicker on the softer brass and usually last on the more pricier. Don't care to start a brass bashing war, but it is what it is. Many opinions and current availability are big factors.

 

[Seabeeken]

I agree with all above. Primer pocket endurance is dependent on softness of the brass and the pressure you are running. I anneal after 3 loadings and use bushing dies and shoulder bump to minimize working of the brass, especially the necks. Most people tend to over anneal brass by overheating it which burns off since from the case. If you are heating to the point that it glows or an orange flame is coming off the case then you are over heating. Heat to just below the point you see the flame or glow.

 

[can1010]

if you load redline and only get a handful of reloads out of your brass then annealing is a waist of time. now if you load down to a lower node and go for consistency and brass life annealing is your friend. the whole case hardens after multiple firing/reloading cycles this also means the case head and primer pocket. if you give a case time to work harden by using a lower node and annealing the necks for better consistency the primer pocket will harden and stabilize allowing it to last longer and you will have better neck tension and usually better accuracy. I have had Hornady and even Federal brass last 12-15 reloads and some make 18-20
you have to decide weather velocity or consistency is more important, and having to replace brass all the time is expensive

 

[Seabeeken]

Good point can. I found this years ago with 7RM. brass became unusable.

 

[MagnumManiac]

^^^^this^^^^
I have lost count on how many loads my Lapua and Norma brass has been loaded in my comp gun barrels (3).
The Lapua brass was bought in the 80's, haven't kept track of number of firings past 20, this was way back in 2001.
Norma brass is softer than most, this is due to very thin webs, but thick walls, and you need to load it to suit. If you are getting book velocities in Norma brass, you are most likely overloading it and will get poor case life, even if you anneal.

Cheers.

 

[Hugnot]

Annealing reclaims work hardened necks. As the necks are expanded by firing, then resized, the brass is work hardened and the brass crystalline structure gets smaller & thinner as work hardening progresses. Annealing ensures more consistent neck tension - work hardened brass has some spring back and annealing fixes this. Progressive work hardening, expansion upon firing, followed by sizing of necks will result in split necks. The degree of neck expansion upon firing can be affected by neck wall thickness/neck turning, the more movement the more work hardening from expansion then sizing.

The hardness of brass heads results from mechanical forming of the heads or work hardening. Like don't anneal the entire case including the head. I don't know of any published data on brass head hardness but I could guess that Lapua would be the hardest. The small primer pocket Lapua 6.5X47L can handle high pressure loads with little or no expansion.

Generally, I toast my necks about every 3 firings. I avoid primer pocket expansion by keeping pressures down.