Canada blames us...
- Thread starter JonL
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Let me clear up a couple of things.
1) Only a select few scumbag liberal politicians blame the U.S. for the "gun" problem they have identified.
2) Most Canadians have nothing bust respect for our southern neighbors.
Please don't lump us together by saying we all blame the U.S., this crap that has come up recently is due to a rash of gang-related killings in Toronto. The politicians and Mayor of Toronto are trying everything in their power to blame everybody but themselves. I wish the people who keep voting for our liberal party would give their head a shake and realize what they are doing.
-John
1) Only a select few scumbag liberal politicians blame the U.S. for the "gun" problem they have identified.
2) Most Canadians have nothing bust respect for our southern neighbors.
Please don't lump us together by saying we all blame the U.S., this crap that has come up recently is due to a rash of gang-related killings in Toronto. The politicians and Mayor of Toronto are trying everything in their power to blame everybody but themselves. I wish the people who keep voting for our liberal party would give their head a shake and realize what they are doing.
-John
TheCanuck
Well-Known Member
thats all because of wendy cukier and her co-conspirators
i hop eshe chokes on her breakfast and dies a horrible painfull death
i hop eshe chokes on her breakfast and dies a horrible painfull death
DaddyRabbit
Well-Known Member
99.9% of all Politicians are scum bags, be it liberal or conservative. Too sorry to do an honest days work, (not that they ever needed to). There may be an exception to the rule it's just I've never heard of one.
[ QUOTE ]
Let me clear up a couple of things.
1) Only a select few scumbag liberal politicians blame the U.S. for the "gun" problem they have identified.
2) Most Canadians have nothing bust respect for our southern neighbors.
Please don't lump us together by saying we all blame the U.S., this crap that has come up recently is due to a rash of gang-related killings in Toronto. The politicians and Mayor of Toronto are trying everything in their power to blame everybody but themselves. I wish the people who keep voting for our liberal party would give their head a shake and realize what they are doing.
-John
[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Let me clear up a couple of things.
1) Only a select few scumbag liberal politicians blame the U.S. for the "gun" problem they have identified.
2) Most Canadians have nothing bust respect for our southern neighbors.
Please don't lump us together by saying we all blame the U.S., this crap that has come up recently is due to a rash of gang-related killings in Toronto. The politicians and Mayor of Toronto are trying everything in their power to blame everybody but themselves. I wish the people who keep voting for our liberal party would give their head a shake and realize what they are doing.
-John
[/ QUOTE ]
johnny5,
I have a friend who has hunted in Alberta. He told me that the folks in that province are nothing like the folks in Quebec as far as respecting folks as individuals. He is returning to Alberta in the spring for a goose/bear hunt.
I just returned from Nova Scotia (cruise with wife before caribou hunt), the guide had the same words you have said for the folks in your goverment positions.
Why can't we all just get along and let those ego's die. Hunting seasons are tooo short.
I have a friend who has hunted in Alberta. He told me that the folks in that province are nothing like the folks in Quebec as far as respecting folks as individuals. He is returning to Alberta in the spring for a goose/bear hunt.
I just returned from Nova Scotia (cruise with wife before caribou hunt), the guide had the same words you have said for the folks in your goverment positions.
Why can't we all just get along and let those ego's die. Hunting seasons are tooo short.
Ballistic64
Well-Known Member
Reminds me of the South Park movie,in reverse. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Fiftydriver
Official LRH Sponsor
Living in Central Montana about 80 miles from the Canadian boarder and traveling to that country often, at least to Alberta, I can tell you for a fact that apart from actually crossing an international boarder, there is not difference in the people on either side of the boarder. At least not with the ones I deal with.
Some of my most respected friends are Canadians and share the exact same view of life as most Americans do.
Please remember that The USA is the same way. Most on the east and west coasts feel there is no need for firearms in civilian hands. They are a very small percentage of the entire US population but unfortunately they are the LOUDEST!!
THis is also true in Canada.
Unfortunately its hard to boycot the Canadian government without hurting the Canadian Citizens which for the vast majority are pro USA. ITs really a catch 22. TO make a statement to the ones that need it we really hurt only our friends and true allies.
Kirby Allen(50)
Some of my most respected friends are Canadians and share the exact same view of life as most Americans do.
Please remember that The USA is the same way. Most on the east and west coasts feel there is no need for firearms in civilian hands. They are a very small percentage of the entire US population but unfortunately they are the LOUDEST!!
THis is also true in Canada.
Unfortunately its hard to boycot the Canadian government without hurting the Canadian Citizens which for the vast majority are pro USA. ITs really a catch 22. TO make a statement to the ones that need it we really hurt only our friends and true allies.
Kirby Allen(50)
nelson
Well-Known Member
AMEN
ricka0
Well-Known Member
>> blaming their crime problems on guns smuggled in from the United States
Well it's partially our fault. You can thank the NRA for making sure criminals have the right to buy guns without going thru the state like you would with a car. Guns are liquid and easy to get in the states. Require every gun transaction to go thru the state (just like cars) and you dramatically reduce the liquidity of guns and criminals trading them.
While your at it prosecute (misdemeanor crime) irresponsible gun owners who let criminals steal their guns ( 400% value of gun fine). Then treat gun theft like a violent gun crime (long sentence with federal prosecution).
Well it's partially our fault. You can thank the NRA for making sure criminals have the right to buy guns without going thru the state like you would with a car. Guns are liquid and easy to get in the states. Require every gun transaction to go thru the state (just like cars) and you dramatically reduce the liquidity of guns and criminals trading them.
While your at it prosecute (misdemeanor crime) irresponsible gun owners who let criminals steal their guns ( 400% value of gun fine). Then treat gun theft like a violent gun crime (long sentence with federal prosecution).
ricka0
Well-Known Member
Hate to pea on the "Preaching to the Choir" but that report is a logic crime.
[ QUOTE ]
The British government banned handguns in 1997 but recently reported that gun crime in England and Wales nearly doubled in the four years from 1998-99 to 2002-03.
[/ QUOTE ]
OK so gun crime in the UK has gone from 1/200th of US gun crime to 1/150th.
Crime economists have dismissed this false causality years ago, crime is far to complex to reduce it to your favorite variable.
[ QUOTE ]
You don't have to live next to the United States to see how hard it is to stop criminals from getting guns.
[/ QUOTE ] Absurd. Try to by a handgun in the UK. Anyone can look in the paper and go buy one here, thanks to the NRA. The seller is not obligated to confirm you're not a criminal.
Now this fact is sure to offend all the god fearing, 1st amendment hating, 2nd amendment loving Christians. The only proven correlation between the dramatic drop in violent crime in the US (starting in the 90's) is Roe V. Wade. Unwanted children often turn out to be criminals.
[ QUOTE ]
Australia has also seen its violent-crime rates soar immediately after its 1996 Port Arthur gun-control measures
[/ QUOTE ] Two jynormous logical flaws. The above statement would hold true if Violent-crime (VC) rates went from 1 in 10 million to 3 in 10 million. 2nd logic crime, compare gun violence in the state to Australia
I like this forum because it stays away for politics, from preachen to the choir. It usually doesn't have such useless opinions as [ QUOTE ]
99.9% of all Politicians are scum bags, be it liberal or conservative. Too sorry to do an honest days work
[/ QUOTE ] - which contribute nothing to a political debate and certainly nothing to long range shooting.
The most ridiculous and thoroughly exposed logic crime: [ QUOTE ]
so-called right-to-carry laws that let law-abiding adults carry concealed handguns after passing a criminal background check and paying a fee. Only half the states require some training, usually around three to five hours. Yet crime has fallen even faster in these states than the national average.
[/ QUOTE ] NAS has shown the data on CCW is inconclusive. I know a well respected economist who published a paper with the same results several years ago. He works with the ACLU (Educating them on gun rights and why they should protect legal gun owners rights).
Jon Lot is a well know gun advocate playing fast and loose with the facts. His articles are easy to discredit and I believe he does a huge disservice to lawful gun owners by publishing such easily exposed rubbish.
[ QUOTE ]
The British government banned handguns in 1997 but recently reported that gun crime in England and Wales nearly doubled in the four years from 1998-99 to 2002-03.
[/ QUOTE ]
OK so gun crime in the UK has gone from 1/200th of US gun crime to 1/150th.
Crime economists have dismissed this false causality years ago, crime is far to complex to reduce it to your favorite variable.
[ QUOTE ]
You don't have to live next to the United States to see how hard it is to stop criminals from getting guns.
[/ QUOTE ] Absurd. Try to by a handgun in the UK. Anyone can look in the paper and go buy one here, thanks to the NRA. The seller is not obligated to confirm you're not a criminal.
Now this fact is sure to offend all the god fearing, 1st amendment hating, 2nd amendment loving Christians. The only proven correlation between the dramatic drop in violent crime in the US (starting in the 90's) is Roe V. Wade. Unwanted children often turn out to be criminals.
[ QUOTE ]
Australia has also seen its violent-crime rates soar immediately after its 1996 Port Arthur gun-control measures
[/ QUOTE ] Two jynormous logical flaws. The above statement would hold true if Violent-crime (VC) rates went from 1 in 10 million to 3 in 10 million. 2nd logic crime, compare gun violence in the state to Australia
I like this forum because it stays away for politics, from preachen to the choir. It usually doesn't have such useless opinions as [ QUOTE ]
99.9% of all Politicians are scum bags, be it liberal or conservative. Too sorry to do an honest days work
[/ QUOTE ] - which contribute nothing to a political debate and certainly nothing to long range shooting.
The most ridiculous and thoroughly exposed logic crime: [ QUOTE ]
so-called right-to-carry laws that let law-abiding adults carry concealed handguns after passing a criminal background check and paying a fee. Only half the states require some training, usually around three to five hours. Yet crime has fallen even faster in these states than the national average.
[/ QUOTE ] NAS has shown the data on CCW is inconclusive. I know a well respected economist who published a paper with the same results several years ago. He works with the ACLU (Educating them on gun rights and why they should protect legal gun owners rights).
Jon Lot is a well know gun advocate playing fast and loose with the facts. His articles are easy to discredit and I believe he does a huge disservice to lawful gun owners by publishing such easily exposed rubbish.
TheCanuck
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Hate to pea on the "Preaching to the Choir" but that report is a logic crime.
[ QUOTE ]
The British government banned handguns in 1997 but recently reported that gun crime in England and Wales nearly doubled in the four years from 1998-99 to 2002-03.
[/ QUOTE ]
OK so gun crime in the UK has gone from 1/200th of US gun crime to 1/150th.
Crime economists have dismissed this false causality years ago, crime is far to complex to reduce it to your favorite variable.
[ QUOTE ]
You don't have to live next to the United States to see how hard it is to stop criminals from getting guns.
[/ QUOTE ] Absurd. Try to by a handgun in the UK. Anyone can look in the paper and go buy one here, thanks to the NRA. The seller is not obligated to confirm you're not a criminal.
Now this fact is sure to offend all the god fearing, 1st amendment hating, 2nd amendment loving Christians. The only proven correlation between the dramatic drop in violent crime in the US (starting in the 90's) is Roe V. Wade. Unwanted children often turn out to be criminals.
[ QUOTE ]
Australia has also seen its violent-crime rates soar immediately after its 1996 Port Arthur gun-control measures
[/ QUOTE ] Two jynormous logical flaws. The above statement would hold true if Violent-crime (VC) rates went from 1 in 10 million to 3 in 10 million. 2nd logic crime, compare gun violence in the state to Australia
I like this forum because it stays away for politics, from preachen to the choir. It usually doesn't have such useless opinions as [ QUOTE ]
99.9% of all Politicians are scum bags, be it liberal or conservative. Too sorry to do an honest days work
[/ QUOTE ] - which contribute nothing to a political debate and certainly nothing to long range shooting.
The most ridiculous and thoroughly exposed logic crime: [ QUOTE ]
so-called right-to-carry laws that let law-abiding adults carry concealed handguns after passing a criminal background check and paying a fee. Only half the states require some training, usually around three to five hours. Yet crime has fallen even faster in these states than the national average.
[/ QUOTE ] NAS has shown the data on CCW is inconclusive. I know a well respected economist who published a paper with the same results several years ago. He works with the ACLU (Educating them on gun rights and why they should protect legal gun owners rights).
Jon Lot is a well know gun advocate playing fast and loose with the facts. His articles are easy to discredit and I believe he does a huge disservice to lawful gun owners by publishing such easily exposed rubbish.
[/ QUOTE ]
Alright, now show me a statistic or a study or anything that says that registering guns(read guns owned by law abiding citizens, namely us) will make gun violence go away.
Heck, in finnland, they are even allowed supressors(might not be a big deal to you yanks, but it is for us canucks since we are not allowed to owened em. being in possession of a supressor equals attempted murder here)
I'm not typically politically right-wing oriented, but the freaking liberals have no freaking clue what the heck they are talking about. I guess they are too busy sponsorising, a.k.a. ad scandal(read, bribing), each other /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif
Hate to pea on the "Preaching to the Choir" but that report is a logic crime.
[ QUOTE ]
The British government banned handguns in 1997 but recently reported that gun crime in England and Wales nearly doubled in the four years from 1998-99 to 2002-03.
[/ QUOTE ]
OK so gun crime in the UK has gone from 1/200th of US gun crime to 1/150th.
Crime economists have dismissed this false causality years ago, crime is far to complex to reduce it to your favorite variable.
[ QUOTE ]
You don't have to live next to the United States to see how hard it is to stop criminals from getting guns.
[/ QUOTE ] Absurd. Try to by a handgun in the UK. Anyone can look in the paper and go buy one here, thanks to the NRA. The seller is not obligated to confirm you're not a criminal.
Now this fact is sure to offend all the god fearing, 1st amendment hating, 2nd amendment loving Christians. The only proven correlation between the dramatic drop in violent crime in the US (starting in the 90's) is Roe V. Wade. Unwanted children often turn out to be criminals.
[ QUOTE ]
Australia has also seen its violent-crime rates soar immediately after its 1996 Port Arthur gun-control measures
[/ QUOTE ] Two jynormous logical flaws. The above statement would hold true if Violent-crime (VC) rates went from 1 in 10 million to 3 in 10 million. 2nd logic crime, compare gun violence in the state to Australia
I like this forum because it stays away for politics, from preachen to the choir. It usually doesn't have such useless opinions as [ QUOTE ]
99.9% of all Politicians are scum bags, be it liberal or conservative. Too sorry to do an honest days work
[/ QUOTE ] - which contribute nothing to a political debate and certainly nothing to long range shooting.
The most ridiculous and thoroughly exposed logic crime: [ QUOTE ]
so-called right-to-carry laws that let law-abiding adults carry concealed handguns after passing a criminal background check and paying a fee. Only half the states require some training, usually around three to five hours. Yet crime has fallen even faster in these states than the national average.
[/ QUOTE ] NAS has shown the data on CCW is inconclusive. I know a well respected economist who published a paper with the same results several years ago. He works with the ACLU (Educating them on gun rights and why they should protect legal gun owners rights).
Jon Lot is a well know gun advocate playing fast and loose with the facts. His articles are easy to discredit and I believe he does a huge disservice to lawful gun owners by publishing such easily exposed rubbish.
[/ QUOTE ]
Alright, now show me a statistic or a study or anything that says that registering guns(read guns owned by law abiding citizens, namely us) will make gun violence go away.
Heck, in finnland, they are even allowed supressors(might not be a big deal to you yanks, but it is for us canucks since we are not allowed to owened em. being in possession of a supressor equals attempted murder here)
I'm not typically politically right-wing oriented, but the freaking liberals have no freaking clue what the heck they are talking about. I guess they are too busy sponsorising, a.k.a. ad scandal(read, bribing), each other /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif
ricka0
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
<font color="purple"> Alright, now show me a statistic or a study or anything that says that registering guns(read guns owned by law abiding citizens, namely us) will make gun violence go away. </font>
[/ QUOTE ] That's logically flawed black and white thinking. No one is proposing that gun registration will make all violence go away - it will just make it MUCH more expensive for criminals to obtain a gun - just as it's very expensive to buy heroine (when it could be produced for pennies a gram if legal).
I have two good friends here from Sweden now. In Sweden under The Swedish National Home Guard You can even have a full auto at home. You can have long guns. You can sell long guns, but when you sell a gun you need to verify the buyer has a licence. There is no gun crime in Sweden as is the case in much of Europe, Austral, NZ ( it's more complicated than guns tho, I won't simplify it like the discredited John Lot does, I'm too honest and educated )
The last gun crime committed in Sweden was by a military person who took a gun and went berserk. There is no way to completely prevent that type of incident.
We can drastically minimize guns getting into the hands of criminals by calling the NRA on their BS mission to protect criminals rights to obtain cheap guns by promoting straw purchases and circumventing all purchaser checks.
Gun registration won't solve our gun problems overnight, it will just help over time as the supply dries up and black market prices skyrocket.
I'm also not saying we should go to the Draconian lengths the Europeans have gone, or that our gun crime would be as low even if we had. But the NRA attitude that <font color="brown"> any </font> gun law is a bad law is pure religion and the opposite number of the knee jerk left that guns are evil and all gun laws are good laws.
<font color="purple"> Alright, now show me a statistic or a study or anything that says that registering guns(read guns owned by law abiding citizens, namely us) will make gun violence go away. </font>
[/ QUOTE ] That's logically flawed black and white thinking. No one is proposing that gun registration will make all violence go away - it will just make it MUCH more expensive for criminals to obtain a gun - just as it's very expensive to buy heroine (when it could be produced for pennies a gram if legal).
I have two good friends here from Sweden now. In Sweden under The Swedish National Home Guard You can even have a full auto at home. You can have long guns. You can sell long guns, but when you sell a gun you need to verify the buyer has a licence. There is no gun crime in Sweden as is the case in much of Europe, Austral, NZ ( it's more complicated than guns tho, I won't simplify it like the discredited John Lot does, I'm too honest and educated )
The last gun crime committed in Sweden was by a military person who took a gun and went berserk. There is no way to completely prevent that type of incident.
We can drastically minimize guns getting into the hands of criminals by calling the NRA on their BS mission to protect criminals rights to obtain cheap guns by promoting straw purchases and circumventing all purchaser checks.
Gun registration won't solve our gun problems overnight, it will just help over time as the supply dries up and black market prices skyrocket.
I'm also not saying we should go to the Draconian lengths the Europeans have gone, or that our gun crime would be as low even if we had. But the NRA attitude that <font color="brown"> any </font> gun law is a bad law is pure religion and the opposite number of the knee jerk left that guns are evil and all gun laws are good laws.
Nomosendero
Well-Known Member
big_bore
Sir, I will say this, at least you have used some logic in
this & I would not exactly call it Liberal. But I feel a
major component of the problem is morality in general. I will offer this as an example, I remember prior to 1968 I would look at Sears & other catalogs as a kid & drool over the Rifles & Handguns that were for sale. All you had to do was order them. Was it more dangerous on the streets than now? We all know the answer to that, don't we. I grew up in rural AR. & the School parking lots were full of cars that belonged to the teenage boys. Many would hunt after school & they had rifles & pistols in their often unlocked cars. Yet in those days, we had no school shootings! One day my cousin decided that he would take his 8mm Mauser to school so that he could walk home through the woods & hunt. We were in the 8th grade & too young to drive, so we got on the bus, that's right the driver had no problem with it. When we got to school my cousin handed the rifle to the Principal & asked him to keep it in the office until school was out. Are we safer now? I could give examples all day, but my point is obvious to anyone if they are open minded. This is why our FOUNDING FATHERS stated that the kind of freedoms that we have enjoyed can only be maintained by a moral people. And this is also why Christians that you mentioned are frustrated because they understand this very simple principle, but many non-Christians understand it as well.
I think that we should be careful who we sell a weapon to, but as far as restricting me or others who are law abiding
without society problems, this does not interest me, I will buy handguns, AR's etc. whenever I want to try one, I play
by the founder's rules.
Sir, I will say this, at least you have used some logic in
this & I would not exactly call it Liberal. But I feel a
major component of the problem is morality in general. I will offer this as an example, I remember prior to 1968 I would look at Sears & other catalogs as a kid & drool over the Rifles & Handguns that were for sale. All you had to do was order them. Was it more dangerous on the streets than now? We all know the answer to that, don't we. I grew up in rural AR. & the School parking lots were full of cars that belonged to the teenage boys. Many would hunt after school & they had rifles & pistols in their often unlocked cars. Yet in those days, we had no school shootings! One day my cousin decided that he would take his 8mm Mauser to school so that he could walk home through the woods & hunt. We were in the 8th grade & too young to drive, so we got on the bus, that's right the driver had no problem with it. When we got to school my cousin handed the rifle to the Principal & asked him to keep it in the office until school was out. Are we safer now? I could give examples all day, but my point is obvious to anyone if they are open minded. This is why our FOUNDING FATHERS stated that the kind of freedoms that we have enjoyed can only be maintained by a moral people. And this is also why Christians that you mentioned are frustrated because they understand this very simple principle, but many non-Christians understand it as well.
I think that we should be careful who we sell a weapon to, but as far as restricting me or others who are law abiding
without society problems, this does not interest me, I will buy handguns, AR's etc. whenever I want to try one, I play
by the founder's rules.
