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BARREL VELOCITY (SS vs CM)

elkaholic

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I know this must have come up at some time, but I have never seen anything published on it. Does anyone have any hard data as to whether or not there is an advantage of one over the other? It would stand to reason, IMO, that a different hardness of metal with different abrasive characteristics, would cause different pressures, in turn causing different velocities. This would seem to bear up with people, including myself, experiencing increased velocities with melonite treatment, although that might require a whole different study. i.e. Is the increase due to more pressure from the same load, or less resistance from the surface? I would like to think less resistance but since I don't have any way to measure pressure that closely, I am not sure? I would also be curious as to whether or not meloniting has different affects (velocity wise) between Stainless and Chrome moly? Food for thought!.....Rich
 
I've seen cm barrels gain speed as they wear a bit more than ss, but they weren't the same caliber so it wasn't anywhere scientific. My bdl 7rum gained nearly 100 fps with a 140 sierra and rl25 as the barrel aged. As my last 7stw aged she held steady with 140 nos ab's and rl25...
 
First these were all AR barrels. We had barrels pulled with the same button in both 4150 CM and 416 SS and chambers wers cut with the same reamer as well (to the same headspace using the same set of gauges. We tended to see higher vel especially when new from the SS than CM. This did not suprise us as we tended to always see more copper streak fouling in the CM. If we handlapped the CM to the same finish which took 2x as long vel seemed to be very close. We ended up going to chrome lined for the CM and offering the SS as marketed more towards higher accuracy becuase of the history of CL effect on accuracy. This ended the apples to apples comparison.

I will add that soon after based on research and testing we switched over to nitrocarborizing with a qpqp process (q=quench p=polish) with the bore and chamber final polish done by hand as the media was not very effective in the small diameter space of the bore. With that change it ended any differences other than CM tends to be tougher. Given the choice I would always have my barrels melonited/nitrocarborized.
 
just some random thoughts on the bore and these two steels.

* it's common knowledge in the machining culture that under a microscope the finish from the two steels will be vastly different, even with the same micro number. Stainless steel often gives a pretty and shiny surface finish, but we can also get the samething out of chrome moly. Kind o depends on the final finish and hone job on the bore.

An easier example of this to see is the bore of an automobile engine. Try and get the rings to seat with a polished bore. Never will happen. Now take that same bore and run a hone thru it a couple times to break the glaze. Bingo we're good to go. Yet a rough hone job can take awhile to seat the rings. How does this apply to a rifle barrel? It's a cylinder with a bullet used to plug the bore. The brite and shiny bore will have much more friction even though it doesn't seal as well.

* I'm not sure about the heat expansion properties of chrome moly verses stainless steel, but it's a little different. Add to this the fact that almost all C/M steels expand and contract in a similar fashion. Stainless steels are different. Not talking a lot here, but a couple tenths might mean a lot.

* another issue is accuracy in machining. We've came a long way in working with stainless steel, just like we did with C/M steel. Just that SS came on later. Fifteen years ago, there was no way you could cut SS as accurately as C/M. Yet now days they're close. I have always found I could get the last couple tenths out of C/M verses SS, but kind of a moot point when your honing the bore to a finish size anyway. The amount of steel you cut when rifling the bore is minor and not enough to even begin to get excited about. Still there is some due to tool pressure alone. The real issue will come later, and few folks even know about it.

* SS still does change a little more under heat, and barrel steels are normally high martensitic making them even more prone to changing. C/M steels are still hot rolled ingots in the beginning. If you have a bore that is perfectly strait, and finish is the same; both types will change under heat. The more they change the more they hand out resistance to the travel of the bullet. Big diameter of course change less, but longer barrels tend to move more. Movement of the barrel thus reduces speed of the bullet a little bit too
gary
 
First these were all AR barrels. We had barrels pulled with the same button in both 4150 CM and 416 SS and chambers wers cut with the same reamer as well (to the same headspace using the same set of gauges. We tended to see higher vel especially when new from the SS than CM. This did not suprise us as we tended to always see more copper streak fouling in the CM. If we handlapped the CM to the same finish which took 2x as long vel seemed to be very close. We ended up going to chrome lined for the CM and offering the SS as marketed more towards higher accuracy becuase of the history of CL effect on accuracy. This ended the apples to apples comparison.

I will add that soon after based on research and testing we switched over to nitrocarborizing with a qpqp process (q=quench p=polish) with the bore and chamber final polish done by hand as the media was not very effective in the small diameter space of the bore. With that change it ended any differences other than CM tends to be tougher. Given the choice I would always have my barrels melonited/nitrocarborized.

How are you Tim? Give me another call sometime.........Rich
 
Will do. sorry I have been very busy with the kids but have been wanted to drop you a line for some time now. Was finally able to track down the RUM cases I wanted to use for that wildcat.
 
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