webs
Well-Known Member
Running it over a chronograph might help determine accuracy over longer ranges.
9 inches low on first shot!
- Thread starter 8andbait
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Yeah the most accurate rifle I ever owned was a 308, I was speaking of more long range energy rather than accuracy.
That was a typo, meant 1 1/2" at 300
Glad to hear you had similiar experiences with different ammo, that was really what I was trying to figure out, if a round could be sub moa at 100 and well over moa at longer ranges.
thanks, gary
Gary, what your OP states seems in line with your descriptions of events, first low shot was most likely the bore oil, and the lack of copper in it. Next couple shots a little eratic till it fouled up some. None of that would alarm me. It then sounds like the gun grouped to your satisfaction.
You moved to 300 and now the groups were not to your liking, well you stated you were a new shooter and that recoil seemed to get worse. and that was likely the combination that effected your paper. A little wind here or there and the anticipation of the shot is most likly the cause, it is possible you got the barrel hot and that can cause a factory tube to get a little squirlly as well. I had some similar problems years ago shooting factory guns as I tried to stretch my distances.
You moved to 300 and now the groups were not to your liking, well you stated you were a new shooter and that recoil seemed to get worse. and that was likely the combination that effected your paper. A little wind here or there and the anticipation of the shot is most likly the cause, it is possible you got the barrel hot and that can cause a factory tube to get a little squirlly as well. I had some similar problems years ago shooting factory guns as I tried to stretch my distances.
etisll40
Well-Known Member
My instinct says the barrel is either not broken in or is too thin. You are not using consistent ammunition session to session either. Buy a 100 of the best ammunition from a professional loader. There are some out there, explain the problem and I'll bet he'll help you. I have a name if you can't find one. People on here probably know many. Ask...
Secondly, a former 1000 yard bench shooter currently doesn't clean his barrel until about 100 rounds. He used to clean like you. So, you may be cleaning it too much.
Good Luck
Secondly, a former 1000 yard bench shooter currently doesn't clean his barrel until about 100 rounds. He used to clean like you. So, you may be cleaning it too much.
Good Luck
bowhunthard88
Well-Known Member
First shot is definitely the oil in the barrel, no worries there! Usually give your barrel 3 - 4 shots to foul the barrel before you shoot for group size (NOTE: DO NOT take a clean barrel out in the field, unless you know EXACTLY where it shoots from EXPERIENCE!). I usually clean, check zero and then put in gun cabinet if it's hunting season, or I might have reason to need it. For deep storage lol, I would just clean and store.
Sorry to note, a 7mm Rem Mag is going to kick. It will not be as bad as some of the other magnums, but I know quite a few people who can't handle the recoil. Not saying you can't, but it is something you need to expect (not anticipate), and deal with.
Ammo can do whatever it wants lol, don't categorize it until you have shot it. However, were the groups horizontal, vertical, or round @ 300 yds.? Group size can be affected by multiple factors, especially at an extended distance. Does that scope have adjustable parallax? If not, you need to make sure your head position/cheek weld is the same every time! If so, you should adjust it for best accuracy. Wind (Self explanatory lol)? Last thing is your scope perfectly inline to the axis of your bore? This can make groups go right or left as you extend you ranges, but shouldn't really affect group size, just point of impact.
Good luck! And enjoy every minute... It's a learning curve, but we've all been there at one point or another. I'm still learning
.
Sorry to note, a 7mm Rem Mag is going to kick. It will not be as bad as some of the other magnums, but I know quite a few people who can't handle the recoil. Not saying you can't, but it is something you need to expect (not anticipate), and deal with.
Ammo can do whatever it wants lol, don't categorize it until you have shot it. However, were the groups horizontal, vertical, or round @ 300 yds.? Group size can be affected by multiple factors, especially at an extended distance. Does that scope have adjustable parallax? If not, you need to make sure your head position/cheek weld is the same every time! If so, you should adjust it for best accuracy. Wind (Self explanatory lol)? Last thing is your scope perfectly inline to the axis of your bore? This can make groups go right or left as you extend you ranges, but shouldn't really affect group size, just point of impact.
Good luck! And enjoy every minute... It's a learning curve, but we've all been there at one point or another. I'm still learning
.Thanks for all the responses, I really appreciate it.
Just to recap I also believe the lubed bore had alot to do with the first shot just thought 9 inches was really low but that would only have been 4-5 at 100 so no biggy.
I am familiar with fouling just never had a rifle that needed this many foulers to shoot well so that was sort of freaking me out.
I am a new shooter at longer ranges never shot over 200 yards before this year because I never had to need for it.
I tried 3 types of ammo at 100 yds and took the best shooting round to 200 and 300 but I believe the factor, as others have said, was the clean and oily bore.
So today I picked up a couple different kinds of ammo at wal-mart (I know but it was the only place open this morning) to just see how it shot with cheap ammo. I got a box of winchester super X and Federal power shok in blue box.
Last night I completely cleaned the bore of copper and powder and ran several dry tight patches through it so I knew it was clean and dry. Then I backed off the action torque to 55 in lbs.
So at the range this morning I shot the winchester ammo first at 200 and it was pretty eratic but was expected because it needed to be fouled. after six rounds I switched to the Federal and got nice 1.5" groups at 200. I was happy with that so I shot a couple more winchester rounds and still getting oddly shaped wide groups so I will just save them for future foulers.
So moved to 300 yards with the federal, made my 2.5 MOA adjustment and had a 2.5 inch linear group that was about 2 inches left. One shot about 1" left, one shot about 2.5" left and about 1/2" high and third shot about 3.5" left. Very happy with that so I made a right adjustment of .5 MOA and then shot the handloads which shot the best the day before and had a nice 2.75" triangle shaped group that was centered about 3" high and good left to right. Funny how the 160 grain handloads hit higher than the 150 grain federal but the 160's were accubonds and the others are lead soft points so the BC is probably drastically different.
Anyway, with some more practice and technique improvement I feel I can keep this rifle under MOA at longer distances and that is all I can ask for.
Thanks, Gary
Just to recap I also believe the lubed bore had alot to do with the first shot just thought 9 inches was really low but that would only have been 4-5 at 100 so no biggy.
I am familiar with fouling just never had a rifle that needed this many foulers to shoot well so that was sort of freaking me out.
I am a new shooter at longer ranges never shot over 200 yards before this year because I never had to need for it.
I tried 3 types of ammo at 100 yds and took the best shooting round to 200 and 300 but I believe the factor, as others have said, was the clean and oily bore.
So today I picked up a couple different kinds of ammo at wal-mart (I know but it was the only place open this morning) to just see how it shot with cheap ammo. I got a box of winchester super X and Federal power shok in blue box.
Last night I completely cleaned the bore of copper and powder and ran several dry tight patches through it so I knew it was clean and dry. Then I backed off the action torque to 55 in lbs.
So at the range this morning I shot the winchester ammo first at 200 and it was pretty eratic but was expected because it needed to be fouled. after six rounds I switched to the Federal and got nice 1.5" groups at 200. I was happy with that so I shot a couple more winchester rounds and still getting oddly shaped wide groups so I will just save them for future foulers.
So moved to 300 yards with the federal, made my 2.5 MOA adjustment and had a 2.5 inch linear group that was about 2 inches left. One shot about 1" left, one shot about 2.5" left and about 1/2" high and third shot about 3.5" left. Very happy with that so I made a right adjustment of .5 MOA and then shot the handloads which shot the best the day before and had a nice 2.75" triangle shaped group that was centered about 3" high and good left to right. Funny how the 160 grain handloads hit higher than the 150 grain federal but the 160's were accubonds and the others are lead soft points so the BC is probably drastically different.
Anyway, with some more practice and technique improvement I feel I can keep this rifle under MOA at longer distances and that is all I can ask for.
Thanks, Gary
Topgun 30-06
Well-Known Member
You've really lost me now as you said you took two new boxes of different ammo that you have never zeroed in the rifle and started at 200 yards. Why did you not rezero from close in, move to 100 and finalize zero, and then move to the longer distances. I hate to say it, but it seems to me you need to go back to shooting 101 or am I missing something here? It is very normal for a rifle to shoot to different zeros with different ammo, especially of varying weights and style, so I am also questioning why you made the statement wondering about why the two were shooting to different POIs!
I guess I have my own way of doing things, as I am sure you do to. It worked out great so thanks.
Gary
I don't think he was worried about hitting POA as much as he was making sure his group sizes were where they should be. If I were him I wouldn't have been wasting a bunch of time and ammo getting my gun exactly zeroed when the only real thing I am trying to verify is whether my gun is shooting tight groups like it used to or if something somewhere has gone wrong, ie scope, mounts, bedding, etc.
Scot E.
Dr. Vette
Well-Known Member
I'd still bed it, and I suspect he'd see up to a 50% improvement in all of his groups.
8andbait, if you get a chance post photos of the groups next time. As they say, they're worth 1000 words and can help us determine what may be going on.
8andbait, if you get a chance post photos of the groups next time. As they say, they're worth 1000 words and can help us determine what may be going on.
Topgun 30-06
Well-Known Member
Scot E---Yep; I understand now why he was doing what he did. I was thinking more of it being a starting load than that he was just trying to see what the gun would do no matter where the shots were landing. Thanks!!!
Exactly right, I didn't know how to post that without sounding rude. You did a fine job.
Gary
I actually have a Mcmillan on order and will be selling this stock so I will probably bed the mcmillan but wanted to keep this one clean for resale.
I meant to bring the camera with me because it is alot easier to just show a pic. Wait, I think I have the 300 yarder in the truck.
Negative, must have tossed it at the range.
Gary
