I hunt with 2 different rifles using the same paper patch bullet. A 30" swede rolling block chambered for .405 win shoots my 420 gr. slick patched to .412" at 1320 fps with 1.5F Old Eyensford. My model 1917 bolt action 24" barrel .405 shoots the same bullet at 2065 fps with Benchmark. Both barrels are McGowen .412" groove diameter. They both kill emphatically. I cast pure lead, and the paper jacket keeps the bores shiny. 2 molds, one old school Ideal adjustable style and one Steve Brooks custom
Who cast and load lead for big game?
- Thread starter Old Rooster
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comen so no antimony or tin?
Thats what I needed to hear.The softer lead obturates better than hard cast.Thanks for first hand knowledge
Thats what I needed to hear.The softer lead obturates better than hard cast.Thanks for first hand knowledge
Getting into casting is kind of like making your own beer. Once you start doing it, you can't quit. I shoot cast bullets in a lot of my guns. Most of my handgun shooting is done with cast bullets. 32-20, .44 Mag/Spl, .357 Mag/Spl, 9mm, .40 S&W, 10mm, .45 ACP. More economical and excellent accuracy. Use the same bullets in my handgun caliber rifles. .30 Carbine, .308W, 30-30W, 30-06, .338WM, 40-65, .45-70. Gas checks on the 30's and .338. Cold lubes are easier to work with, but heated lubes are less messy to load. Haven't used liquid lube except on my 45-70. Jury still out on them. I use WSF powder in my auto pistols and 296 in my magnums, recommended powders for .30 Carbine and 32-20. SR 4759 was my powder for my rifles until it was discontinued. I used 5744 until I discovered Shooters World Buffalo powder. Identical loads to 5744, meters better and much cheaper. I have used the same Lyman bottom pour pot since 1975. I have Two of each, Lyman and Magma Engr. lubersizers. The Lyman works better with gas checks. I have two so I have dedicated cold and heated lube presses. Commercial lubes work fine and you can find many recipes especially on the Cast Boollets web site. I've had best results sizing bullets .001 inch larger than bore. IE .309 inch for .308 calibers, and so on. I use mostly straight wheel weights. Although adding tin makes the cast easier. Start with a completely clean bore for best results. Keep your velocities below 1600 to 1700 FPS and you shouldn't have leading problems. Harder bullets can be pushed faster. Paper patched bullets can be pushed much faster. Round nose and flat nose bullets seem to work better for me than spritzer types. Ive never used cast bullets on big game, but I wouldn't hesitate because i've killed deer with the .30-30 with 150 grain bullets. I'm sure that a .30 caliber 180 to 200 grain bullet at 1800 to 2000 FPS would be more than adequate up to 150 yards. Cast bullet shooting is more enjoyable. Muzzle blast and recoil are substantially reduced. I don't mind the heavy recoil of my larger rifles, but I don't relish it. Also, with todays prices, you can either save and lot of money or shoot a lot more. Look on EBay for used equipment. Even buying new equipment, you could get set up for less than $600 to $700. But with powder prices, in a .30-06, you could use 20 grains of 5744 or Buffalo powder instead of 56 grains of 4350. You could cast cast bullets using scrap wheel weights or you can buy jacketed bullets. Savings in powder and bullets are substancial and neck size and anneal the necks occasionally and brass will last for many firings. I also think that keeping reduced load fired brass separate is a good idea. Good Luck!
NCWshooter
Well-Known Member
I have been thinking about trying cast bullets for a long time. I would be thinking of using a couple of 30-40 Krags and a 30-06. I have used lots of hard-cast bullets over the years, but I wonder what kind of powder would you use in .30 rifles to, I suppose, to reduce velocity. Whatever you can suggest and inform me would be appreciated.
NCWshooter
Well-Known Member
Thanks for all the tips and details! I would really like to try this but wondered about powders and gas checks. You pointed me in the right direction now.
Yep, just pure lead. I have Three recovered bullets fired from the .405 M1917, two shot through a box of wet paper and dug out of the snow berm from the range being plowed, and one I chopped out of an old larch stump.. The 1st paper test bullet weighs 391 grains, and the mushroom is 1.060x.895". The 2nd from the paper test weighs 385gr and measures 1.048x.882" The one I chopped out of the stump was shot at 200 yards, and weighs 381 gr, and measures .926x.746". Pure lead doesn't fragment much at moderate velocities
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Ckgworks
Well-Known Member
Another tip is to look at Pewter.......adding a bit of that to your mix will harden it up a bit, and make it flow better. Look for old pewter dishes at yard sales and such, much cheaper than buying online.
I also would love to start casting for my 9.3x62, anyone here have a 9.3 mold they don't use?
I also would love to start casting for my 9.3x62, anyone here have a 9.3 mold they don't use?
I am a student of the cast bullet. Read Glen E Fryxell's work and that of Veral Smith/LBT. So much info.
Fitment is one of the biggest issues, then alloy and pressure and lube. Round nosed bullets often feed best and if they dont deform make terribly small wounds in flesh. Pointy bullets are rare in the realm of cast, but I do have some; same story. Flat noses (flat meplats - french for 'flat surface of a cylinder') hit hard and create wide, leaky wounds. They have lower bcs than what is usually discussed in this forum. But they kill quickly and cleanly.
I prefer aluminum moulds, whether 2 or up to 5 cavity. Iron rusts and brass is heavy.
I prefer LBT moulds; they will make you most anything you want in their standard shapes: LFN, WLN, WFN, etc. nothing drops bullets easier nor rounder than LBT. NOE has great products in stock shapes. They add more shapes via group buys, mostly. Seek those at the peril of your bank account, as one just isnt enough. Accurate makes great moulds and offers many variables. MP moulds of Slovenia makes great stuff. I have a few Lyman that are good. I cut my teeth with Lees, both 2 and 6 cavity. They are ok for the money. I have and have had some customs on Lee blanks; Lee is price point and a decent value. I just like nicer stuff now.
I mostly use wheel weights or dilute them with pure-ish lead. Lots of work to smelt and refine - like a marriage, a labor of love.
I like soft alloys and soft lubes. I shoot 7, .30, 8, .338, .35 handguns and rifles, .375, 10, .41, 44 rifles and revolvers, .45 both, 480, and 500 rifle. Nothing big yet. I dont shoot cast in anything small but not sure why.
I use a bottom pour pot more than ladle, though the ladle gives better consistency in my experience.
I expect 2" or smaller groups at 100 from a rifle or contender. I can shoot some much better. A lapped revolver can do one big hole at 25 yds with sights; they are often 4" shooters before lapping.
YMMV
PM me if you want to chat about it - I love it!
Fitment is one of the biggest issues, then alloy and pressure and lube. Round nosed bullets often feed best and if they dont deform make terribly small wounds in flesh. Pointy bullets are rare in the realm of cast, but I do have some; same story. Flat noses (flat meplats - french for 'flat surface of a cylinder') hit hard and create wide, leaky wounds. They have lower bcs than what is usually discussed in this forum. But they kill quickly and cleanly.
I prefer aluminum moulds, whether 2 or up to 5 cavity. Iron rusts and brass is heavy.
I prefer LBT moulds; they will make you most anything you want in their standard shapes: LFN, WLN, WFN, etc. nothing drops bullets easier nor rounder than LBT. NOE has great products in stock shapes. They add more shapes via group buys, mostly. Seek those at the peril of your bank account, as one just isnt enough. Accurate makes great moulds and offers many variables. MP moulds of Slovenia makes great stuff. I have a few Lyman that are good. I cut my teeth with Lees, both 2 and 6 cavity. They are ok for the money. I have and have had some customs on Lee blanks; Lee is price point and a decent value. I just like nicer stuff now.
I mostly use wheel weights or dilute them with pure-ish lead. Lots of work to smelt and refine - like a marriage, a labor of love.
I like soft alloys and soft lubes. I shoot 7, .30, 8, .338, .35 handguns and rifles, .375, 10, .41, 44 rifles and revolvers, .45 both, 480, and 500 rifle. Nothing big yet. I dont shoot cast in anything small but not sure why.
I use a bottom pour pot more than ladle, though the ladle gives better consistency in my experience.
I expect 2" or smaller groups at 100 from a rifle or contender. I can shoot some much better. A lapped revolver can do one big hole at 25 yds with sights; they are often 4" shooters before lapping.
YMMV
PM me if you want to chat about it - I love it!
RUFFIAN R - NY
Well-Known Member
Have only used LYMAN molds and have some 40 different ones from 22 up to 45 cal .See you with the Lever , I also have a few Win Levers 30 WCF , 44-40 , 44 Mag and 45 LC, 30-30 , 45-70 and load my cusin's 444 Marlin. A lot of the Lyman molds are out of production. You after a gas check bullet ? Looking for a single , double or a gang mold ? My better molds are single & double - gang ones use for pistol- ppc-bowling ball . In the 44 you using .429 " or .430 " or .431 " I use the same ones as for the pistol's . Pure lead loads are too soft - I like 95-96 % pure then some Tin and antimony along with a check. Mold # 429215-210gr-GC SWC , # 429244 - 255gr-GC SWC , # 429303 -205 gr GC spire point this one is a very interesting bullet. # 429422 - 235 gr - SWC , # 429640 250 gr-HP-GC , # 429650 300 gr -SWC-GC, 429667 240gr FRN # 429421 245gr - RN FLAT If you can find # 446110 - 315 gr HP-FP great hunting bullet. Need to get correct top punch and seating steam !!!!!Also will need LUBE .
Good molds are hard to find along with top punches & seating steams. sizing die also.
Good molds are hard to find along with top punches & seating steams. sizing die also.
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In 44 mag I use 429 in my pistol and 430 in my Marlin 1894 but a 431 would be nice too.I like wide meplats as the only 2 animals I have killed with cast bullets are with Cast Performance 45-70 420 gr in my Marlin 1895 45-70 (459) were wide meplats.
I was hoping to find a 30 cal mold for my 308 and 30-06,150 gr to 180 gr.GC would be easier to get velocities with little to no leading
I was hoping to find a 30 cal mold for my 308 and 30-06,150 gr to 180 gr.GC would be easier to get velocities with little to no leading
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Forgot to add that I make my own lube,an old recipe a fellow shooter shared with me many moons agoI have Lee sizing dies in 44 but only go to 430,45 452 and 451 as well as 357 mag but can't remember the size and 45-70 but am not close to the shelves they rest upon so I can't remember.
I have been casting for pistols since 1977 so I have a few basics.I also powder coat as it makes cleaning the barrels much easier.
Quality molds are hard to find and expensive when found
I have been casting for pistols since 1977 so I have a few basics.I also powder coat as it makes cleaning the barrels much easier.
Quality molds are hard to find and expensive when found
memtb
Well-Known Member
I've mentioned this before, but some may have missed it before! A very interesting read and a little lengthy.....but, there is a very good section pertaining to cast bullets! memtb
LINK:
LINK:
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RUFFIAN R - NY
Well-Known Member
old rooster : what you considering big game ? Also check out the different types of lube . All mine are Lyman molds. Have a few furnaces also made one to melt lead keel's from old sailboats when using lead back then and with the recent hurricane's the towns decided it was time to clean up the old junks, made out ok with that call and helped them clean up for the pickings. Some of the older molds are discontinued may need to find in auctions-garage sales remember that you'll need the top punch for that die. Not all seating stems are the same.
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memtb
Well-Known Member
If anyone decides on powder coated bullets, and not requiring lube/sizing,take a look at what the folks have to offer for sizing dies. You can use your loading press ,much stronger and more leverage than your sizer/lubricator!
Somewhat similar to the Lee system, but you can push bullets through the die tip or base forward. You can specify exactly what size die you need for your application! Once you have the basic system, adding additional calibers is very inexpensive....making the system much cheaper than the Lee system!
The website generally gives me heck....but with luck and patience you can navigate it! They make molds as well as the sizing system! memtb
noebulletmolds.com
Somewhat similar to the Lee system, but you can push bullets through the die tip or base forward. You can specify exactly what size die you need for your application! Once you have the basic system, adding additional calibers is very inexpensive....making the system much cheaper than the Lee system!
The website generally gives me heck....but with luck and patience you can navigate it! They make molds as well as the sizing system! memtb
NOE Bullet Moulds |
noebulletmolds.com
