Video On Bump sizing cases.

[J E Custom]

Well, since all bolt guns, pump guns and most semi-autos fire from closed bolts, you were taught wrong. When the bolt on a rifle is cycled, it is cocked-either on opening or closing. This pulls the firing pin back inside the bolt face and the firing pin doesn't touch the casing. The only weapons that allow the firing pin to protrude from the bolt face and contact the cartridge's primer on closing are weapons which fire from an open bolt and have fixed firing pins. And not all weapons that fire from open bolts have fixed firing pins, since those that fire high power cartridges need time for the bolt lugs to go into battery, which a fixed firing pin wouldn't allow. Examples of an open bolt gun are the H&K MP5, the M3 Cal. .45Acp, and the Uzi 9mm. They are blowback or delayed blowback actions and the M3 has a fixed firing pin. The M60 machine gun and the M240/M249 fire from open bolts, but the firing pin isn't fixed because the bolt has to have a fraction of a second to rotate closed in the action, so the firing pin is delayed slightly in contacting the primer.

The reason for pulling the firing pin assembly Is safety and feel. the cocking piece will engage with the trigger and give a false sense of feel. As described, the bolt should be free of any out side influences to get the best results and consistent readings. The reason we leave the extractor in the bolt is for extraction and it does not effect the cartridge/case.

Also to deal with fixed firing pins all gauges should have a firing pin relief drilled in the case head portion of the gauge that allows the bolt to go into battery with the exposed firing pin without contact with the head space gauge. Some leave the firing pin assembly In but don't attach the trigger, but unless you un cock the bolt. it is still cocked and at minimum can/may/damage the firing pin if it fell by accident, so It is best to remove the firing pin anyway.

Sometimes when setting head space, a loaded round is used for reference to see how tight you can set the head space with the go gauge for that brand of ammo. So it is always a good practice to remove the firing pin and and trigger because, (Sometimes the manufacture of the ammo sizes to the max length and if the chamber is cut to the minimum length, chambering this type of a round can be difficult.

So when setting head space it is best to remove any component that can effect the reading.

J E CUSTOM

 

[greenejc]

The reason for pulling the firing pin assembly Is safety and feel. the cocking piece will engage with the trigger and give a false sense of feel. As described, the bolt should be free of any out side influences to get the best results and consistent readings. The reason we leave the extractor in the bolt is for extraction and it does not effect the cartridge/case.

Also to deal with fixed firing pins all gauges should have a firing pin relief drilled in the case head portion of the gauge that allows the bolt to go into battery with the exposed firing pin without contact with the head space gauge. Some leave the firing pin assembly In but don't attach the trigger, but unless you un cock the bolt. it is still cocked and at minimum can/may/damage the firing pin if it fell by accident, so It is best to remove the firing pin anyway.

Sometimes when setting head space, a loaded round is used for reference to see how tight you can set the head space with the go gauge for that brand of ammo. So it is always a good practice to remove the firing pin and and trigger because, (Sometimes the manufacture of the ammo sizes to the max length and if the chamber is cut to the minimum length, chambering this type of a round can be difficult.

So when setting head space it is best to remove any component that can effect the reading.

J E CUSTOM

Thank you, sir, for that clarification. I didn't know that. I get to learn something new every day. And that's good information to know.

 

[Andrew Cowling]

I use this method, sort of. Since I have several rifles of the same caliber I set the die to touch the standard shell holder and lock down the locking ring in place. I use redding dies with competion shell holders. This way the die is set up exactly the same every single time and use a corresponding shell holder that matches the particular rifles chamber I am loading for.
There are 5 competion shell holders in each set that start at .002" to .010" under full length size specks. Using these I find it much easier to get a tight full length sizing the same every time a do a batch regardless of which rifle it is for. So easy to set up too.
Cheers
Andrew

 

[J E Custom]

I have great respect for J E Custom, and believe everything he says. I'm not sure this was the perfect video to prove his point however. For one, the setting (I know it's a stereotype) and his lack of attention to detail, etc cause me to question it more that anything.

Jerry, can you please describe the best way to size my brass (with as much detail as you are willing to take the time for)? I have full length Redding Dies (expanders removed), Sinclair Mandrels and Redding Comp Shell holders.

Thanks for all you contribute to this awesome forum Sir!

Steve

When possible I start with new brass to get the most life and accuracy from it. Some times This is impossible so I treat the fired brass like it was new after I anneal it.

First I do a full case prep by sizing it, uniforming the flash hole in the primer pocket, Trimming the case mouths all the same Case length, use a Mandrell style case neck turner to turn all of the case necks the exact same thickness. and then weight sort, or volume test if the cases are not the best quality. (This takes A lot longer and is more trouble than weight sorting, but can be more precision in some cases) The reason "I" do it this way is if the case is physically the same dimensions on the out side any differences on the inside in volume will/should show up and they can be sorted in batches for best accuracy/consistency.

With the cases properly prepped loading can begin, after fire forming (First time in that chamber) the fired cases will/should be concentric when checked with a good concentricity gauge. After fire forming, I always check every case for concentricity before loading. as loading begins I check each case during each step unless I get .000 runout after 6 or 8 cases are ran/dimension'd so If I have a steep that Is creating runout I can change the steep to try and eliminate runout as it happens.

I have found that sizing is one place that can alter concentricity, but bu turning the necks this is minimized because of the same thickness condition. The worst step/place I have that effects concentricity is when seating bullets. The type of dies makes a difference , a floating shell holder and die also make a difference. Some find it prudent to rotate the case 120 degrees 2 or 3 times during the bullet seating operation.

I also use many different types of dies to load for the use and accuracy of the ammo,
and I also make sure there is no oil or lubricant on the case and in the chamber. (Clean and dry).

J E CUSTOM

 

[RYEWSKY25284]

Thanks, JE. Very informative and useful information. The Cameo appearance by Fog-Horn, Leg-Horn was icing on the cake!

gotta love ol'Foghorn...lol

 

[J E Custom]

Here is another good objective Video that has some good points and recommendations



J E CUSTOM

 

[bigedp51]

For those of you who enjoyed the above Australian video on reloading, I sell an Australian accuracy aid for shooting under very dim lighting conditions.

For only 7 payments of $19.95 you can own a Paul Hogan Magnum Roo light.

If you only wound the animal and it charges, please remove the light and stab the animal with the bayonet. You will only need to use the bayonet if the bolt is hard to work because you didn't bump the case shoulder back far enough.

Notice, no koala bears were hurt or injured during the filming of this posting.

 

[Riflehunter1776]

bumping sizers get so irate when you question the supremecy of their method that it seems to be a religion to some of them. Bump sizing jihadists. I wonder if the worship rituals involve rat turds in violin cases

 

[gohring3006]

Lady's and gentlemen please welcome bolt lug galling!!
Ha! I have a open mind, a lot of good points in the video, so much that I'm going to test it and see if my SD lowers.

 

[DUSTY NOGGIN]

i didn't read read through the whole thread yet ..

but .. at 2:15ish into the video he shows a cartridge laying in the chamber. the extractor plunger spring would have taken up that slack and those shoulder angles would be touching and centered putting the gap at yhe back ...
although i understand the point of the thread .. all about a good fit

take your ejector and spring out and size to match

 

[J E Custom]

Yet another Video.



It appears that there are more re loaders that prefer neck sizing over full length sizing foe there rifle.

J E CUSTOM

 

[Chase723]

@J E Custom thanks for posting this. I do the same thing. I'm not an expert at all, but I think that people get lost in the weeds about this kind of stuff all the time. Some people are dogmatic about it and for them they have to set it back to a certain number. That's losing sight of the big picture and purpose. I used to neck size only because in the early days when I was young that's what people preached. I ran into problems with that like is inevitable. Now I FL resize like you describe and like Broz from LRO has a video on. Brass fits perfect for the chamber it's shot in, always chambers and ejects easily, and seems to be part of the equation that has reliably resulted in rifles that consistently shoot sub 1/2 MOA and often shoot 1/4-1/3 MOA...which in my mind is the point of all of it. Like you mention, it's a requisite part of long range hunting and shooting. Personally, if I decide to take the shot, the rifle can't be the limiting factor. I think everything you have said has been spot on and I've learned a lot over the years reading your posts. Keep it up.

 

[J E Custom]

@J E Custom thanks for posting this. I do the same thing. I'm not an expert at all, but I think that people get lost in the weeds about this kind of stuff all the time. Some people are dogmatic about it and for them they have to set it back to a certain number. That's losing sight of the big picture and purpose. I used to neck size only because in the early days when I was young that's what people preached. I ran into problems with that like is inevitable. Now I FL resize like you describe and like Broz from LRO has a video on. Brass fits perfect for the chamber it's shot in, always chambers and ejects easily, and seems to be part of the equation that has reliably resulted in rifles that consistently shoot sub 1/2 MOA and often shoot 1/4-1/3 MOA...which in my mind is the point of all of it. Like you mention, it's a requisite part of long range hunting and shooting. Personally, if I decide to take the shot, the rifle can't be the limiting factor. I think everything you have said has been spot on and I've learned a lot over the years reading your posts. Keep it up.

Thanks.
What I try to do Is pass on what has worked for me and that there are more than one way to do something. What works for me may be different than what works for others. Every re-loader may have a different way that He likes to do things for his rifles, but that doesn't mean his way will work in a different rifle.

Some think there is only one way to do something and as opinionated as I am, I still realize that different rifles respond to different things. I load different for many of my firearm because they respond differently.

J E CUSTOM

 

[RYEWSKY25284]

Yet another Video.



It appears that there are more re loaders that prefer neck sizing over full length sizing foe there rifle.

J E CUSTOM

Just a question here.. Would it make any difference + or - if he was using a better grade die.?
I.E. Wilson or Redding, RCBS,Forester. I'm not under the impression that Lee Dies are high quality.

Thank you.