Primer Issue

[sxssixteen]

I loaded some target ammunition for my 223 Remington bolt gun using RP nickel brass and CCI BR4 primers. After shooting them, I noticed that most of them stuck in the chamber and had to be tapped out with a cleaning rod. I found no signs of high pressure that might cause this, and the extractor was in good shape. After polishing the chamber, the same loads still refused to be removed by the bolt. Further testing found that RP nickel brass, using either Rem 7-1/2 or Fed 205M primers, did not stick in the chamber. Also unplated brass (brass) did not stick with CCI BR4 primers. What I learned was that this rifle did not like RP nickel brass loaded with CCI BR4 primers, but it did like any other combination. Have you found anything like this?

 

[Dmagna]

Never had a primer causing extraction issues, I have also never had a bolt gun not extract a piece of brass. I have used a rubber mallet to extract an over pressure piece and it never dropped the brass. I am wondering if you either bumped the shoulder too much causing a headspace issue or the Nickle brass is doing something weird.

 

[Black Hat]

I suspect the brass to be of different thickness, possibly causing a pressure problem, it's not the nickel, different primers will affect pressure also.
How close to max are you loaded?

 

[sxssixteen]

I found it odd that the nickle brass loaded with the CCI BR4 primers were the only ones that stuck in the chamber. None of the others, regardless of the brass, primer, powder, or charge had the problem. One responder suggested that since the nickle brass was harder than brass (brass), it may not retract enough for easy extraction after firing. Why would that happen even with the lightest test loads?
The target ammunition was loaded with 52/53 grain bullets propelled by N133, Benchrest, and 8208 powders of increasing amounts (still below maximum). The nickle brass were all full length resized, exactly like all of the other brass I was testing.
The problem is resolved in that I won't load the nickle brass with CCI BR4 primers. I will continue to use the nickle brass but load them with Fed 205M primers, or switch to brass (brass). I will use the CCI BR4 primers for other load testing. I was just curious if this was a common occurrence.

 

[wolffo]

what rifle ?

 

[lyle2231]

I loaded some target ammunition for my 223 Remington bolt gun using RP nickel brass and CCI BR4 primers. After shooting them, I noticed that most of them stuck in the chamber and had to be tapped out with a cleaning rod. I found no signs of high pressure that might cause this, and the extractor was in good shape. After polishing the chamber, the same loads still refused to be removed by the bolt. Further testing found that RP nickel brass, using either Rem 7-1/2 or Fed 205M primers, did not stick in the chamber. Also unplated brass (brass) did not stick with CCI BR4 primers. What I learned was that this rifle did not like RP nickel brass loaded with CCI BR4 primers, but it did like any other combination. Have you found anything like this?

Do you full length resize the nickel brass?

 

[Mike Matteson]

Fallowing

 

[sxssixteen]

The rifle is a Weatherby Vanguard (Howa) varmint. Again I note that I have no problems with other brass/primer combinations in that rifle. Also, regardless of the specific test loads being fired, accuracy was 1 MOA or less.

 

[Mike Matteson]

I have know of and read about using nickel plated brass, isn't the best idea. There been problem in the sizing die, and chambers. I don't remember all the details about them. I quite using them over 20 years ago.

 

[Rflshootr]

Did you do all of your homework and check trim length, neck diameter of a loaded and fired round, measure the base of a fired case and one as it comes out of the full length die? Did you check to see if a bullet will side in the neck of a fired case?

 

[nksmfamjp]

Have you measured fired CBTD for both nickel and brass? What are you seeing?

Have you measured CBTD for both after sizing? What are you getting? 5-10 measurements of each?

 

[sxssixteen]

Thanks for all the help and ideas. Perhaps I wasn't very clear about the nickle plated brass sticking in the chamber. What I hoped to say was that I loaded a number of test loads in both nickle and brass. All were sized the same way (FL in the same die), all were set to the same overall cartridge dimensions, all had safe bullet seating depths, etc. Some were loaded with CCI BR4 primers, some with other primers. All were shot in the same rifle. No pressure signs were seen for any of the fired ammunition (even after measuring). The only difference was that the nickle brass, with CCI BR4 primers, had a tendency to stick in the chamber. My question was only to learn if this is normal, and did others find the same results.
Sorry for any confusion.

 

[DUSTY NOGGIN]

soot a nickle case before sizing and see where the hangup is

i would have bet the brass , would have stuck before the nickle did

i doubt its primer related

trim to lengths all the same ?? long ones swelling and snagging a carbon ring while the other are shorter and caused the ring ???

 

[Rflshootr]

Thanks for all the help and ideas. Perhaps I wasn't very clear about the nickle plated brass sticking in the chamber. What I hoped to say was that I loaded a number of test loads in both nickle and brass. All were sized the same way (FL in the same die), all were set to the same overall cartridge dimensions, all had safe bullet seating depths, etc. Some were loaded with CCI BR4 primers, some with other primers. All were shot in the same rifle. No pressure signs were seen for any of the fired ammunition (even after measuring). The only difference was that the nickle brass, with CCI BR4 primers, had a tendency to stick in the chamber. My question was only to learn if this is normal, and did others find the same results.
Sorry for any confusion.

We get what you are saying. I myself never had a problem with nickel brass sticking regardless of primers. We are trying to help you find the problem. Measuring everything is a good place to start. Closely inspect the cases that stuck in the chamber to the ones that didn't get stuck. Maybe you will find something abnormal. Any telltale marks on the cases that got stuck? Do they measure the same as the ones that didn't get stuck? Different components can act very differently. Without being able to see it, I'm betting that you are getting different pressures with the BR4's, but it could also be something entirely different. Mind telling us the load/bullet combination that you are using?