Ok I am not a big fan of the 6.5 Creedmore

[jreagle]

just me... I have always used sectional density to compare bullet ballistics between calibers that are close to each other

 

[Tidus56]

Manipulation is a good point. Data changes when loads change. Bullets and powders make a difference but so does barrel length. Also as was said, doing a fair comparison if doing a factory gun comparison, it is true that the .270 factory barrels are 10 twist not allowing the 170s to make range before instability occurs. Guessing it may even happen at 100 yards. The charts look good but in reality, the 170 wouldn't make the 500 yard line with those numbers.

This was my point in the above post. When I put in my load info with a 140 grain Hybrid Berger in my 6.5 the 270 falls way off. When you put in your data(no idea where you are getting it from) it will change again. If I put my load data on the 147 it changes again. My point being it depends on the combo being put in and where the data comes from. I prefer using my own once I verify the drop out to 1000 then I believe the data.
You're correct the 170 will need a custom barrel and would be an awesome bullet if stabilized.

 

[VLD Pilot]

The 6.5 craze has captivated the shooting world! May well be the shell of all time. But lest we forget......what is it's purpose? Why h okas it been created? Let's get back to reality.... would you use a 1 wood to putt 15 feet and try to use your putter to hit a golf ball 300 yards? The 6.5 was developed for the long range TARGET market...not to shoot anything else....ok...gophers at 800 yards are targets... I will give you that! But the stories of these great hunters shooting at Elk at 1100 yards with 6.5....you should be ashamed....not flaunting it

Back when Jim Carmichael developed the 6.5/308 or 6.5 panther turned .260 Rem, was a time when match bullets may have ruled for that diameter bullet. Today to say you'd be ashamed to shoot a 6.5 bullet at a large game animal is a statement made without full knowledge or confidence in either your shooting ability or bullet manufacturer ( 1100 yards is a hell of a poke with any cartridge on a live animal). The 26 Nosler wasn't developed for match shooting. The 6.5-284 cartridge is is offered in the Savage Long Range hunter rifle as well as Nosler and Cooper hunting rifles as is the .260. Nosler makes premium hunting ammo for both also. Step into the present and out of the past. The 6.5 has ethically taken deer and elk way past 600 yards with one well placed bullet in ideal environmental conditions. That pretty much is a decision made by the shooter. The cartridge isn't responsible for a bad placed shot due to range or conditions. Hunter responsibility needs to be in place.

 

[VLD Pilot]

This was my point in the above post. When I put in my load info with a 140 grain Hybrid Berger in my 6.5 the 270 falls way off. When you put in your data(no idea where you are getting it from) it will change again. If I put my load data on the 147 it changes again. My point being it depends on the combo being put in and where the data comes from. I prefer using my own once I verify the drop out to 1000 then I believe the data.
You're correct the 170 will need a custom barrel and would be an awesome bullet if stabilized.

Sounds like we're on the same page. It's hard to beat the BCs of the 6.5 bullets for weight without getting into the .284 or 338 bullets. Some cartridges better serve the 147/150/156 LR bullets in the 6.5 better than the Creedmoor or .260. In some cases it may be best to stick with the 130/140 offering keeping velocities up there bettering the heavier bullet option in those cartridges. It's a fine line tho. Wind being a major factor if using the round in wind. Either way sounds like these premium bullet options are going to keep showing up offering us great choices for various shooting scenarios.

 

[Tidus56]

Sounds like we're on the same page. It's hard to beat the BCs of the 6.5 bullets for weight without getting into the .284 or 338 bullets. Some cartridges better serve the 147/150/156 LR bullets in the 6.5 better than the Creedmoor or .260. In some cases it may be best to stick with the 130/140 offering keeping velocities up there bettering the heavier bullet option in those cartridges. It's a fine line tho. Wind being a major factor if using the round in wind. Either way sounds like these premium bullet options are going to keep showing up offering us great choices for various shooting scenarios.

I think for LRH 6.5 creedmoor wouldn't be my first choice either. I use mine for load devolopment, shooting, long range at targets and for fun. I would hunt with it for certain but if we are talking optimal for LRH it is not nor is the 260.
I do find annoying those who claim it can't do anything. I have heard the silliest nonsense about this cartridge both in claims for and against it. But with a little reloading it will do pretty good speeds. Still not optimal for LRH.

 

[WY02K]

The weekly Creed bash......blah blah blah!
No one in their right mind is going to take a STW or 300 Win to the dog town. And no one is going to take a 223 on a grizzly hunt.

300 WM on prairie dogs between 500-1200 is a ton of fun!!! One of my favorite pastimes. Not very cost effective though

 

[WY02K]

Perhaps this is true if you poke holes in paper. However, you can never change the basic (Energy equals Mass times Velocity Squared).

Are you sure that's true??? I thought the BC is what killed animals?

 

[VLD Pilot]

I think for LRH 6.5 creedmoor wouldn't be my first choice either. I use mine for load devolopment, shooting, long range at targets and for fun. I would hunt with it for certain but if we are talking optimal for LRH it is not nor is the 260.
I do find annoying those who claim it can't do anything. I have heard the silliest nonsense about this cartridge both in claims for and against it. But with a little reloading it will do pretty good speeds. Still not optimal for LRH.

I started hunting with a .308. As a young hunter it was passed down from grandfather to father to me. Worked well and still does. With a bit more knowledge started using a 7 mag because it was Bigger !!! Bigger is always better at that age and recoil is manageable as well. Once I started reloading and shooting alot, bullets got better so did powders. I started shooting in competition and built a 6.5-284 which at the time was top dog in 1000 yards. Winds caused the 140s trouble so many 30s came out and then .284s. I built a couple 284s after I built the 6.5-284 and it seemed to solve all the wind issues I encountered in LR (1000 yards) shooting. Recently I built a SA .284 for use with only 162s for hunting. That has been my go too rifle for deer and IF I elk hunted, would use it with no hesitation. The .284 IMO is the best of all worlds...For a deer size game rifle.

 

[Tidus56]

I started hunting with a .308. As a young hunter it was passed down from grandfather to father to me. Worked well and still does. With a bit more knowledge started using a 7 mag because it was Bigger !!! Bigger is always better at that age and recoil is manageable as well. Once I started reloading and shooting alot, bullets got better so did powders. I started shooting in competition and built a 6.5-284 which at the time was top dog in 1000 yards. Winds caused the 140s trouble so many 30s came out and then .284s. I built a couple 284s after I built the 6.5-284 and it seemed to solve all the wind issues I encountered in LR (1000 yards) shooting. Recently I built a SA .284 for use with only 162s for hunting. That has been my go too rifle for deer and IF I elk hunted, would use it with no hesitation. The .284 IMO is the best of all worlds...For a deer size game rifle.

.284 is my preferred as well. I shoot a 280 AI and a 28 Nosler. They have everything covered. I do have a 375 Ruger for Bison but I am sure the 28 Nosler would do the job. The ranch I am hunting on requires 30 cal and up so I went up!

 

[VLD Pilot]

.284 is my preferred as well. I shoot a 280 AI and a 28 Nosler. They have everything covered. I do have a 375 Ruger for Bison but I am sure the 28 Nosler would do the job. The ranch I am hunting on requires 30 cal and up so I went up!

Seems like those are old rules. They need to see the performance facts on todays .28 caliber cartridges. Most of them out perform most of the 30s.

 

[WY02K]

Actually, I would say that the 6.5CM supporters are more of the liberal progressives...

They are newer (18 to mid-20's). They all believe anything you tell them about it without facts or proof, no matter how outrageous it sounds. They refuse to believe anything that an outsider tells them about it (the truth). They chant and hold rallies and try to silence any naysayers. They worship it. And anyone who doesn't like it and refutes their falsities with actual facts sends them spiraling into a safe space to go paint, and use coloring books, and have a good cry.

Now add in a Ruger Precision rifle and we are set up to wound some elk!!!

 

[WY02K]

My bad, I will lay the sarcasm on thicker next time. Good explanation though. I will add that BC doesn't mean a **** thing out to 500 yards.

 

[VLD Pilot]

Are you sure that's true??? I thought the BC is what killed animals?

Tissue damage and organ destruction kills. The BC is how slippery the bullet is flight or how well it defies gravity. The BC does have a direct result on the energy/velocity on the target animal. The Sectional density is probably the best way to determine best bullet diameter/weight for the job. Sectional density is the bullets weight ( in pounds )divided by the square of it's diameter ( in inches). Basically a long thin bullet weighing the same as a shorter fatter bullet has a higher SD. For larger game, the highest SD is what has been said to be best.

 

[WY02K]

Manipulation is a good point. Data changes when loads change. Bullets and powders make a difference but so does barrel length. Also as was said, doing a fair comparison if doing a factory gun comparison, it is true that the .270 factory barrels are 10 twist not allowing the 170s to make range before instability occurs. Guessing it may even happen at 100 yards. The charts look good but in reality, the 170 wouldn't make the 500 yard line with those numbers.

I have never been able to stabilize a 150 Berger out of a factory .270 barrel. Tried it in 3 different guns. The 170s will be impossible. You will definitely see instability at 100 yards with this recipe. If I remember right I could get 5" groups. Step down to the 140 Berger and they shot sub MOA. The 150's are too long.