Objective of LRH and personal preferences

Discussion in 'The Basics, Starting Out' started by longrangehunter, Feb 14, 2002.

  1. longrangehunter

    longrangehunter Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    110
    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2002
    It seems some LRH's are very interested in the maximum distance they can take game. More of a technical focus on equipment.

    Even if I was 100 percent confident I could make a particular LR shot I would opt for the SR shot if possible. Now of course, we don't always get what we want in the field and that's why I'm here; to learn the skills and methods for the longer shots. I guess I'm more interested in the hunt, game, and harvest then the actual shot itself.

    Anybody else share this philosophy?

    LRH
     
  2. Brent

    Brent Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,537
    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2001
    I enjoy the whole process of any type of hunting, some types more than others for differant reasons. What got me into LRH is what you said "Now of course, we don't always get what we want in the field".

    Although I don't relish in the killing I DO get equal satisfaction from the shot as I do the hunt, I't seems some have a problem with that but it's true.

    Until I bought a computer I never knew anyone else hunted like I did, anything beyond a couple hundred yards was just taboo to anyone I knew, problem was I just found it so easy (to 500yds then) to hit out there and the possibilities were much greater at harvest I couldn't justify not learning more.

    Myself, I'm interested in meat in the freezer, not a trophy. Every hunt presents a differant challenge, as does every shot also. The wind or my ability to recover the game is the only reason I can think of why I would want a shot closer, it really makes no differance to me. If it's within range, It's within range, if the wind is gusting, that changes things and if very hard that sucks.

    Where I hunt, if shots are 800yds and beyond the retrieval is closer to the trail and MUCH easyer to get to, If they're 300-700yds it's HELL to pack, but meat is meat and I'm still young. "Generaly" the longer shot is definatly an acomplishment over a shorter one, the target is smaller. If you are not confident in the range or conditions, don't shoot, if you are, range is not an issue IMHO.
     
  3. Darryl Cassel

    Darryl Cassel Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,757
    Joined:
    May 7, 2001
    LRH

    Yes, we as longrange hunters opt for the longer shots and maybe that comes from years of hunting the Longrange way.

    I hunt a lot with my wife and she and I are always looking for the nicer buck or bull elk and at extreme range. We don't want a short shot.
    I also have hunted many years with my good friend Jim Berfield. He and I have a VERY good understanding everytime we go out hunting.
    We NEVER shoot doe deer or cow elk. We never shoot spike bucks or fork horns and we put a horn point limit on what we will attemt to kill. It starts at a full NICE 6 Point and goes up from there.

    We get much more satisfaction in a longer shot of say at least 1200 yards plus, then a short shot of 500 or 600 yards.

    Jim and I would rather kill a nice 6 point at 1500 yards then an 8 or 10 point at 100 yards anyday. It's the challenge that is the important factor. A 500 or 600 yard shot with the equipment we use is NOT a challenge at all.

    I guess I'm a true LR hunter but, still walk my land with a carry rifle to see what is there. I took a break from using the bigeyes while LR hunting last season and to stretch my legs on my 100 acres. I left 4 legal bucks go last year because they did not have nice racks. They will be there next year and be even bigger. I won't kill a buck unless he is a nice rack.

    Maybe I can go on the far mountain across from my land and shoot LR back onto mine, if those bucks are there next year?

    I really don't want a short range shot if I can take the animal Longrange. That includes deer, elk and bear.

    To each his own but, I guess at my age, I can be much more selective plus I have the equipment to reach out and touch something at extreme longrange.

    Darryl Cassel

    [ 02-14-2002: Message edited by: Darryl Cassel ]
     
  4. longrangehunter

    longrangehunter Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    110
    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2002
    I guess I'm not a true LRH. [​IMG]

    OK, I'll admit I'm old fashioned in that I would rather get close to game where I can watch them and study them. It's just a real thrill to be super close to a Huge Bull Elk and his harem. Hearing them bugle and knowing one wrong move and they'll scatter. Just not the same thang 1000 yards away looking through a rifle scope. Doesn't give me the same sense of awe. The hunts I remember most are the ones which where the most difficult.

    I DO enjoy a challenging shot, but not as much as being in the woods and stalking close to game. Darryl, I bet with your target competition experience that sneaking in to 50 yards would be much more challenging for you then a 1200 yard shot.

    Only 6 point bulls or better? hmm, I can just see myself sneaking up on a nice elk herd, getting right in with them, and BOOM....
    Darryl drops the biggest Bull with a shot from his 338-416 howitzer from 4.3 miles.

    Brent, thanks for the reply. I'm with you when you say a "shot is a shot" if it's within your personal range. But my reason for getting close wouldn't necessarily be to make the shot easier (or so I don't have to pack so far), but to see how close I can get to the game. That's not to say that I wouldn't take a long shot on a nice buck or bull if I thought sneaking closer would be too risky or I just didn't want to take a chance on them getting away.
     
  5. Ian M

    Ian M Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,410
    Joined:
    May 3, 2001
    Last Sept. I had the opportunity for shots at both ends of my current spectrum - which is about 6-700 yards under ideal conditions with the .308 Win. rifle that I am hunting with a lot.
    First caribou wandered over a big hill into view, eventually bedded down. About 45 minutes later I was in position for a shot. Took wind readings with the Kestral 3000, lasered at 510 yards, checked the come-up on the chart taped on the side of the rifle, adjusted the parallax on the NXS, settled the Remingtion into a comfortable, very steady position and killed him. As we approached him he kept looking bigger and bigger. The excitement happened when I kneeled beside him and saw how huge and incredible he was. ALL THE CHALLENGE WAS TECHNICAL, correct scope settings, elevation and wind, good rest, good trigger control, boom.
    Second bull walked into us the next day. Hiding behind a big boulder he walked into 18-20 yards and he was all points - stood bug-eyed staring at me. Most magnificent sight, huge bull, points going everywhere, triple bez and double shovels, water in the background, perfect light. He was just a magnificent animal and I could not believe my good fortune to see him so close. 9 other bulls in the background, maybe 50 to 70 yards back. Not too much excitement, more thanks to the hunting gods for giving me this wonderful memory. I just watched him for several minutes, he ran back, came in, ran back, came in as he just couldn't figure out what we were. Wished that I had a big lens along, would have made incredible photos or video. Finally after several minutes he started to walk away, I decided that I would be foolish not to take such a fine bull. Kill shot was anticlimatic, I simply put the reticle where it had to be and broke the trigger. No finess, no real challenge, the target was huge, he died very quickly.

    Which was better. I have no idea. They were both hunting opportunities that I am fortunate to have experienced.

    Fact is, the whole HUNT was what I came away with - traveling such barren country with the Inuit for the first time, sharing so much of their culture. The bulls were the frosting on some fine cake.

    Some talented people drive special cars at 200 hundred miles an hour for 500 miles at Daytona. Some folks drive mini-vans to Walmart. Its all driving.
    Maybe that is what long range shooting is about. We enjoy our challenges with the equipment that we can afford. It's still hunting.
     
  6. Darryl Cassel

    Darryl Cassel Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,757
    Joined:
    May 7, 2001
    LRH

    That was 6 Point Bucks (deer) I was refering to here in PA and West Virginia.
    Not bull elk. Sorry if I didn't explain that enough.
    I really didn't complete my hunting likes and dislikes either.

    I am also a Bow hunter and Spring Turkey hunter. I have killed many deer at close range in the early days while still hunting in the woods with my carry rifle.
    I certainly know what it's like to get close to animals and the Bow hunting has taught me that. I use to hunt with a pistol also. Still go out from time to time with a muzzle loader too.

    As far as my "rathers" are, I MUCH prefer the LONG shots over watching a fine bull and his ladies at close range. I can do that with my bigeyes at 5000 yards if I want to. As a matter of fact not long ago I had 8 Bull elk in my back yard here in PA. There were 20 of the Damn things (mostly cows) over at the feeder on my 100 acres yesterday.
    So you see, I do know what getting close is and have MANY times with deer in PA and elk in Colorado. I have been hunting for almost 50 years now and still enjoy all ways but, Longrange is the way I perfer.
    Maybe that's why I frequent this forum "Longrange hunting" so much?

    That's why we can hunt any way or style we choose.

    Darryl
     
  7. Brent

    Brent Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,537
    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2001
    LRH,

    I guess I still need the meat a little more than you all do, or I still think I do anyway. [​IMG] I stalked a little bull to within 30 feet last year after he ran off twice. It's a long story but I couldn't tell if he was legal (too many points to be a forkhorn).

    I kept a tree between us the last stalk and kept grunting as I aproached.
    All I had was my Taurus 454 and no bino's so I had to get close. What a rush it was, he was a 3x3 though. It all started when the cow I was watching spooked TWARD us, so I knew a bull was pushing her to get out of there.

    Sure enough he was 100yds away 180° of the direction she ran, just out of sight. When I first seen him he was 75yds away and I almost shot but I forgot my bino's in the truck and couldn't be sure, glad I waited!

    Wouldn't you have to shake Darryls hand if he just finished the animal you were watching from 4.3 miles though! One more reason to get competitive. Kinda like the old days when the guy with the 30-30 and iron sights was stalking in on one and another hunter with the 30-06 and new scope doubled him over from 300yds away.

    F&G actually confiscated a moose (temperarily) my friend shot because a guy said he shot it from the drivable road surface (not legal) when come to find out he was just jelous and simply waiting for the moose to come closer, the moose was huge. Tony pulled over, saw him from the road jumped out the passenger side in the ditch and dropped him. The other guy was on a hill behind him. Fair? Both do have their advantages. [​IMG]
     
  8. longrangehunter

    longrangehunter Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    110
    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2002
    Darryl,

    ???????

    I didn't mean to imply that you couldn't get close to game. I've read all of your posts and know you've bowhunted, etc.

    I was giving you a compliment on your shooting skill. I was saying that you are such an accomplished shooter that a 1200 yard shot isn't the challenge for you that it is for the rest of us. I don't know if 1200 is a sure thing for you, but of course staking to within 50 yards of a herd is never a sure thing.

    LRH [​IMG]
     
  9. Steve Shelp

    Steve Shelp Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    351
    Joined:
    May 3, 2001
    longrangehunter,
    One thing I would like to comment on about your statements above and please correct me if I'm wrong, but it almost sounds as though you think this is unsafe?? I'm specifically talking about your statement that reads...

    "Only 6 point bulls or better? hmm, I can just see myself sneaking up on a nice elk herd, getting right in with them, and BOOM.... Darryl drops the biggest Bull with a shot from his 338-416 howitzer from 4.3 miles.

    Believe me when your standing behind a set of bigeyes you can see everything. Most of the time 20x wide angles lenses are used and the peripherial vision all around the animals your looking at is tremendous. If I can see bullet holes in paper at 1000yds (not under all conditions though) seeing another hunter within 200-300yds of an animal isn't a problem. So if I saw you stalking a herd, the shot isn't taken.. bottom line. But you would be surpised of how many times I've watched hunters walk right by bedded down animals and they never saw them. But I knew the animals were there and the hunter also. It's actually a very good learning tool to watch animals with humans close by through good glass like this. You learn things that aren't taught in books or magazines.

    If I'm wrong I apologize. Everyone has reasons for hunting the way they do. I enjoy LR hunting under certain circumstances, but not just for the long shot. Squirrels with a 22 is probably my favorite or spring gobblers. So I get my stalking in also.

    Steve
     
  10. longrangehunter

    longrangehunter Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    110
    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2002
    No, I don't think it's unsafe. Plus, myself I always wear plenty of bright orange.

    Might want to be extra careful around dawn or dusk though.

    I've used some expensive spotting scopes and some huge military optics and they are impressive, but I don't know that I would go so far as to state you can see everything. It really depends a lot on the light, mirage, and weather don't you think? It can be impossible to see into the shadows sometimes.

    There are those guys with their 3-9x Walmart Tasco's that will shoot 700 yards at an Antelope and they ARE scary.

    LRH

    [ 02-15-2002: Message edited by: longrangehunter ]
     
  11. Brent

    Brent Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,537
    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2001
    My father always said "don't aim at something unless you KNOW what it, what's behind it and intend on pulling the trigger on it." He had two friend shot by other friends in the woods hunting when they were young, if they knew what they were shooting at they wouldn't have killed their friends pure and simple. If I shoot at a stump, I KNOW it's a stump not something that looks like one.

    It can be impossible to see into the shadows sometimes. My reply is DON"T SHOOT in the shadows then.

    but I don't know that I would go so far as to state you can see everything. depends on how you define "everything" but if you can't DON"T SHOOT again.

    There are those guys with their 3-9x Walmart Tasco's that will shoot 700 yards at an Antelope and they ARE scary. I agree 100% and is why we try to explain that is not what we are doing and alot more goes into it than that. I would rather be petting Darryls bull as he shot it than be in the timber with someone that takes sound shots, as some do. It is dangerous during hunting season, bullets are being shot. Be safe.

    Back to the topic of objectives. To see as many animals as I can, enjoy the scenery and take the largest animal I can home with me if he presents himself.
     
  12. RBrowning

    RBrowning Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    247
    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2002
    I'm not a "Long Range" hunter either ...yet! I started hunting wood chucks with a 22LR. I thought it was great when I got a 22WMR and could consistantly hit them at 125+ yds. Then I got a 22-250 and found that 200 yds wasn't hard at all. Then I went to KS to shoot prarrie dogs and found the thrill of a 500 yd hit. The tactics and equipment have changed but both ends of my spectrum of experience are very fun. It is all a matter of what you define as "long" range too. A 100 yd shot with a 22LR is a stretch. I see how the same applies to the bigger critters and the bigger equipment. I look forward to learning and refining the techniques even more. Then I look at what you folks are doing and shake my head in wonder. Some friends can't believe you could hit a prarrie dog at 500 yds, just like I can't believe you can hit anything but the ground at 2000 yds. Just lack of experience doing it! But that is going to change... in due time.

    RB [​IMG]

    [ 02-16-2002: Message edited by: RBrowning ]
     
  13. Darryl Cassel

    Darryl Cassel Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,757
    Joined:
    May 7, 2001
    LRH and RBrowning

    Very nice replies from both of you.

    Rbrowning
    As to the way you have progressed from the 22 Rim fire days up to the 500 yard shots of today is the start of your LR hunting interest. The distance will increase as will your equipment to do so.

    LRH
    I think that every hunter knows his distance limitions as to the equipment and skill level he or she has developed or obtained and that's the way it should be. I think it's great that you like to sneak up to a herd of elk and watch them. I promise I will NEVER fire a shot if you are within 1000 yards of those animals. I will see you in my bigeyes if you have your orange on like all States require now.

    I know through many years of defending our way of hunting that, many people don't believe the distance we shoot, can be done.
    Trust me, it can and is being done more and more every year.

    I also believe that, if a person likes to Longrange hunt, he won't be satisfied till he beats his previous best longrange shot on an animal.

    I was feeling real good with a 2100 yard elk kill for about three years. Then a group of my friends at Williamsport got their bull elk at 2890 yards in Colorado. My objective since then has been to beat that mark. If I can do it, fine if not I'll just be #2 I guess till someone beats the 2100 yard mark.

    I am seriously thinking of the 408 CHY-Tac with a 40" barrel except for the fact that the fellows that beat me at 2890 yards was shooting the SAME caliber as mine. The 338/ 416 Rigby Imp. To make things equal, possibly I should try with what I have, to beat that mark?

    I guess you can say, the further the yardage
    the better for most longrange hunters in my area here in Northern PA.
    The first question another LR hunter will ask you when he finds out you killed a buck or bull is, "How far did you kill it" ?

    To each his own though as to hunting preferance and as long as the animal dies as quick as possible. [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    I'm just glad that you and everyone new to the LR sport on this forum are learning how it is done safely and effectivly.

    With Butch, Boyd,Brent, Dan, Dave, Steve, Warren, Coyote slayer, myself and others here, most of those new to LR hunting should get all the information they are seeking concerning the sport.

    Darryl Cassel
     
  14. jhendri2

    jhendri2 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    180
    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Darryl,

    Not to nit pick, but Texas does not require hunters to wear orange (only encouraged). But as stated many times do not fire until you are absolutely sure of the surrondings of your game.

    Out at my ranchette I only alow hunters to hunt from specific places and I designate the firing angles so I can force the safety issue. I imagine on public land (which is very scarce here) the awareness level needs to be much higher.

    Jim