New to reloading...issue with FL RCBS die

[Bigeclipse]

Hey guys.
I have just started reloading for my 300WSM, 3006, and some pistol rounds. My 300wsm and pistol reloads were great. However, I have noticed that some of my full length re-sized brass for the 3006 will not chamber OR it will.... but takes a good deal of effort/force with the bolt. I have read up on this and it seems the "shoulder" needs to be bumped back maybe .001-.002. I thought the RCBS FULL LENGTH dies were supposed to do this? What am I doing wrong here as out of 25 pieces of brass, 7 will not chamber or chamber with great difficulty. These are once fired brass from a friends rifle. Any thoughts here?

 

[MontanaRifleman]

How do you set your sizer dies up?

You might just need to screw your die down more.

What I do is to run the ram all the way up with shell holder in place and screw the die all the way down until it bottoms out on the shell holder. Then back of maybe 1/4 turn. A full turn is about .075". Size the brass and try it in the chamber. If it is loose, turn the die down slightly and size another (don't size the same one because you will work harden the brass if you size it multiple times). Do this fine tuning process until you get an easy bolt. Then re-size any other case that will not chamber easy.

 

[live2huntmt]

+ 1 to this.....the only thing I might add is to remove the firing pin from your bolt when chambering the resized brass.

How do you set your sizer dies up?

You might just need to screw your die down more.

What I do is to run the ram all the way up with shell holder in place and screw the die all the way down until it bottoms out on the shell holder. Then back of maybe 1/4 turn. A full turn is about .075". Size the brass and try it in the chamber. If it is loose, turn the die down slightly and size another (don't size the same one because you will work harden the brass if you size it multiple times). Do this fine tuning process until you get an easy bolt. Then re-size any other case that will not chamber easy.

 

[MontanaRifleman]

+ 1 to this.....the only thing I might add is to remove the firing pin from your bolt when chambering the resized brass.

Curious as to why remove the firing pin?

 

[Bigeclipse]

How do you set your sizer dies up?

You might just need to screw your die down more.

What I do is to run the ram all the way up with shell holder in place and screw the die all the way down until it bottoms out on the shell holder. Then back of maybe 1/4 turn. A full turn is about .075". Size the brass and try it in the chamber. If it is loose, turn the die down slightly and size another (don't size the same one because you will work harden the brass if you size it multiple times). Do this fine tuning process until you get an easy bolt. Then re-size any other case that will not chamber easy.

I have been placing ram all the way up with shell holder in place and then screwing the die down. My friend explained to not back the die out at all, which i have been doing...so the die is essentially all the way down...could this be the problem somehow? If anjything, wouldnt that make the shoulders pressed farther in which would make them fit even looser in my rifle...not more tight?

 

[Bigeclipse]

Curious as to why remove the firing pin?

as long as the brass wasnt charged/primed...why would you need to remove the firing pin?

 

[MontanaRifleman]

I have been placing ram all the way up with shell holder in place and then screwing the die down. My friend explained to not back the die out at all, which i have been doing...so the die is essentially all the way down...could this be the problem somehow? If anjything, wouldnt that make the shoulders pressed farther in which would make them fit even looser in my rifle...not more tight?

Correct, with the die all the way down onto the shell holder you are getting the loosest sizing. Sooo... either your die or your chamber is out of spec. I have just recently had to deal with this myself.

What I did was to continue to screw the die down so now you have to cam over to make a full stroke. Continue same process as above until you have an easy chamber case. At this piont you have a few options.

Rechamber the barrel.

Lap down the bottom of the die, or

Lap off the top of the shell holder.

I like my shell holders to be uniform in the event they need to be used for other cartridges or dies, so I had the bottom of my sizing die machined down a few thou.

 

[MontanaRifleman]

BTW, if you have your other sizing dies screwed all the way down, you might have more head space than you "need" with your sized brass. I always fine tune mine so they barely fit with an easy bolt.

 

[Bigeclipse]

Correct, with the die all the way down onto the shell holder you are getting the loosest sizing. Sooo... either your die or your chamber is out of spec. I have just recently had to deal with this myself.

What I did was to continue to screw the die down so now you have to cam over to make a full stroke. Continue same process as above until you have an easy chamber case. At this piont you have a few options.

Rechamber the barrel.

Lap down the bottom of the die, or

Lap off the top of the shell holder.

I like my shell holders to be uniform in the event they need to be used for other cartridges or dies, so I had the bottom of my sizing die machined down a few thou.

I think my chamber is fine as I have shot factory ammo through it with no tight bolts or any issue like that so maybe it is the die. If it is the die...why cant you simply "overcam" from now on...why the need to grind it down? Also, couldnt I simply call RCBS and tell them their die isnt sizing my brass properly...shouldnt they make it right?

 

[MontanaRifleman]

I think my chamber is fine as I have shot factory ammo through it with no tight bolts or any issue like that so maybe it is the die. If it is the die...why cant you simply "overcam" from now on...why the need to grind it down? Also, couldnt I simply call RCBS and tell them their die isnt sizing my brass properly...shouldnt they make it right?

Factory ammo is typically going to be on the safe side of spec.... for that matter, factory chambers will also "usually" be on the "safe" side, unless there was some sort of screw up on that particular chamber?. So you are speculating at this point which is out of spec until you do some actual measuring. Calling RCBS would be a good idea. If you have a factory barrel, you might also call the manufacturer if you can't get it figured out with RCBS.

If you have a way to measure your sized case shoulder length, and it is out of spec, then IMO, RCBS should send you a new sizer. If you have to mail it in to determine the problem, then which is more cost effective? I paid my smith $25 to turn the bottom of the die down.

Camming over as a routine, is not a good idea IMO. You are putting undue stress on the press and die.

 

[Bigeclipse]

Factory ammo is typically going to be on the safe side of spec.... for that matter, factory chambers will also "usually" be on the "safe" side, unless there was some sort of screw up on that particular chamber?. So you are speculating at this point which is out of spec until you do some actual measuring. Calling RCBS would be a good idea. If you have a factory barrel, you might also call the manufacturer if you can't get it figured out with RCBS.

If you have a way to measure your sized case shoulder length, and it is out of spec, then IMO, RCBS should send you a new sizer. If you have to mail it in to determine the problem, then which is more cost effective? I paid my smith $25 to turn the bottom of the die down.

Camming over as a routine, is not a good idea IMO. You are putting undue stress on the press and die.

It is a factory remington 700 Mountain SS I bought october of 2013. I hope it is not a chamber issue! I have no idea how I would go about measuring the chamber...or the brass shoulders. As far as gun smiths...we are in VERY limited supply where I am located in NY. I think there is one...and not sure id even call him one as I think a good deal of the work they do is sent out. I asked to have a muzzle break installed on my browning X-bolt and they said they dont work on brownings and would have to send it out. Id think brownings would be one brand of what they definitely WOULD work on....this really STINKS and is getting me really discouraged. Can they measure my chamber dimensions or maybe I can bring them a couple cases and see if they can determine of the shoulders are too far out. Is there a guage I can buy to do this myself?

 

[MontanaRifleman]

It is a factory remington 700 Mountain SS I bought october of 2013. I hope it is not a chamber issue! I have no idea how I would go about measuring the chamber...or the brass shoulders. As far as gun smiths...we are in VERY limited supply where I am located in NY. I think there is one...and not sure id even call him one as I think a good deal of the work they do is sent out. I asked to have a muzzle break installed on my browning X-bolt and they said they dont work on brownings and would have to send it out. Id think brownings would be one brand of what they definitely WOULD work on....this really STINKS and is getting me really discouraged. Can they measure my chamber dimensions or maybe I can bring them a couple cases and see if they can determine of the shoulders are too far out. Is there a guage I can buy to do this myself?

First thing I would do is call RCBS and see what they say. You might get it figured pretty quick.

In the mean time if you want to load up a few rounds by camming over to size, it should be a big deal, depnding on how far you have to cam over. It sounds like you are close since the factory ammo fits.

Actually, from what I've read, Brownings can be a bit of a PITA to work on. Machining back the bottom of a die is one of the simplest of shop functions to do. Just chuck the body square into a lathe, then take a cutter across it. Same as squaring the face of a barrel or action. Any maching shop shop should be able to do it.

 

[live2huntmt]

If you remove the firing pin you will have a way better feel for the cartridge chambering "easily" because you are relieving all pressure off the bolt face ..... I am not good with words so my only advice would be to chamber a fired case both with the firing pin and without the firing pin so you can feel the difference yourself. If the bolt can close with little to no pressure with no firing pin, you will never have any problems chambering a round. With no firing pin in the bolt, and adjusting your FL die down until the brass chambers with no pressure, your headspacing will be perfect for hunting situations IMO

Curious as to why remove the firing pin?

 

[MontanaRifleman]

If you remove the firing pin you will have a way better feel for the cartridge chambering "easily" because you are relieving all pressure off the bolt face ..... I am not good with words so my only advice would be to chamber a fired case both with the firing pin and without the firing pin so you can feel the difference yourself. If the bolt can close with little to no pressure with no firing pin, you will never have any problems chambering a round. With no firing pin in the bolt, and adjusting your FL die down until the brass chambers with no pressure, your headspacing will be perfect for hunting situations IMO

OK, I get it, thanks