MATCH Primer Ignorance

[cowboy]

It's my understanding, at least with Federal, the only difference between regular primers and match primers is…..the "match" primers go through an additional inspection process!

Though, I have been wrong before! memtb

You are not wrong this time. Years ago Federal was a client of ours and I was in their facility a number of times. I asked years ago what was the difference between a regular primer and an M or match primer.

Here's what the take away was.

When Federal first started making the M primer it was a designation that signified "Military" and it had to go through an additional federal mandate to qualify inspection versus a regular primer. The Federal marketing geniuses then redesignated the M to mean match versus military. If this has changed with time I have no personal hands on knowledge ,

I've interchanged regular and match for many years and see no difference of accuracy on paper at distance nor velocity ES or SD differences on the Chrony.

 

[memtb]

You are not wrong this time. Years ago Federal was a client of ours and I was in their facility a number of times. I asked years ago what was the difference between a regular primer and an M or match primer.

Here's what the take away was.

When Federal first started making the M primer it was a designation that signified "Military" and it had to go through an additional federal mandate to qualify inspection versus a regular primer. The Federal marketing geniuses then redesignated the M to mean match versus military. If this has changed with time I have no personal hands on knowledge ,

I've interchanged regular and match for many years and see no difference of accuracy on paper at distance nor velocity ES or SD differences on the Chrony.

Well, I guess it's true…..even a blind squirrel can find a nut now and then! memtb

 

[Fullbore92]

Everyone uses 215s without even trying a Win Mag primer...too bad. Also, often, the 215 and Win Mag are too hot, so this is where a cci 250 loves to shine.

The idea you can work up the same accuracy (small group) by adjusting the powder charge per primer is very ill- informed.

I recently started using the 250 in a few of my loads in 7mm rem mag and was very surprised at the results on my chrono. Lowest SD and ES I personally have ever had. Thought maybe it was just luck but I tried them again 2 different times afterwards and still had the same great results.

 

[memtb]

I recently started using the 250 in a few of my loads in 7mm rem mag and was very surprised at the results on my chrono. Lowest SD and ES I personally have ever had. Thought maybe it was just luck but I tried them again 2 different times afterwards and still had the same great results.

Many years ago I used CCI's with some very good luck. But, about 20 years ago I wanted to join the parade with the "kool kids" …..so now it's Fed's! memtb

 

[quigley257]

I tried to locate the video, but no luck. There was a "factory tour" style of video of the Federal primer making process a number of years back where the interviewer asked the same question. The tour guides answer to the interviewer was simply that the person making the match grade primers was a seasoned employee who had been filling the cups with primer slurry for a long time, ensuring consistent and accurate fills with few if any rejects in the batches that they made. The primers, 205/205M, 210/210M and 215/215M were otherwise identical. I don't remember them stating that there was an additional inspection for the "M"s over the standards, but there very well could be.

 

[VinceMule]

My first eye opener was with two cases:

243 AI shooting 70g Nosler Ballistic tips at 4030 fps on a 29", 12T, changed from cci 250

7 Rem Mag, 150-168g bullets, R#25, remarkable accuracy at speeds 100 fps over book max, SD less than 10 fps.

 

[tribb]

It's my understanding, at least with Federal, the only difference between regular primers and match primers is…..the "match" primers go through an additional inspection process!

Though, I have been wrong before! memtb

I heard it was the more "experienced" employees made the match primers !!!

 

[Hugnot]

Lotza info out there but most not quantitative, like "they told me that" or results determined with many other factors included such as powder type/amount, bullet, case, and environmental conditions.

I like this:

https://arxiv.org/ftp/arxiv/papers/1203/1203.2701.pdf

because it shows actual blast wave pressures measured by transducer.

I have become a fan of the tiny but zippy Rem 7 1/2 (table 1) because it sets off 40 grain (or about) charges of various, suitable ball powders in my 6MM CM, 6.5 CM, .243W (reformed SRP .260 Rem brass) and other SRP brass and my LGS has lots of them.

Observe just like how zippy the Rem 7 1/2 is ( hi kilo Pascals). Is a "bench rest primer" as good as a "match primer"?? My casual shooting standards can accept the relatively hi SD's of the Rem 7 1/2 in comparison with other SRP's and are comparable with other LRP kP measurement SD's.

CCI 41's work good for 5.56 AR loads and have proven to be more than adequate for .20P, .204R, & .223 R rodent rifle loads, often producing 1 hole groups at 100 and less than 1 MOA accuracy at 300.

During the current primer availability crisis I use what ever I can buy. One of my LGS' had 1,500 Fiocchi LRP for $199.99 - I was about to buy but somebody else got them. The Fiocchi LRP has proven to work good in all my rifles shooting loads having less than 60 grains of powder.

My limited stash of Fed 215M's (the king of all primers) are used for .300WM loads.

 

[Coyote Shadow Tracker]

You hear a lot on Primers through this Thread. I did post an article on primers in post #9.
I didn't bring up anything about the Brass Case where the Primer is Seated and sends an ignition to set off the charge in the Case.
I personally look at my Brass at the start of everything.
I make sure the that "Flash hole" is free of any burrs or defects from the brass manufacturing process. I turn the Flash Holes and have a clean hole with a "Cone" to have the primer ignition Flash have equal distribution into the powder charge. Then there is the Primer Pocket. I use a Primer Pocket Uniform Tool to make sure each and every case has the same pocket diameter & depth. Then I use a Primer Seating Tool to seat each primer at the depth/crush that gives the best performance.
So, when you are looking at which "PRIMER" to use-please think about the case that you are putting the Primer into also.

 

[leclairk]

I just started load development on a 7PRC and I'm interested to see how different primers work out. I started with 215's but figured I would try some 210's just to see which perform better. I have never tried or even considered CCI 250's. It's hard to know when enough is enough though. I have 2 different bullets, 2 different powders, 2 different primers, and now maybe a 3rd primer.

 

[VinceMule]

leclairk, shoot three shot groups with different primers, there will be NO mistaking which is better and worse.

 

[Phil Rizzo]

I've got 71/72 grain cases that do best with 215 and 80+ grain cases that prefer 210.
It can be a dice roll

 

[98s1lightning]

Is tumbling cases paramount after each firing?

Got to wondering if you had a squeaky clean case, fired once, is there anything wrong with brushing the neck, and reloading said case?
Depending on which primer/powder combo was burnt the cases can be quite clean inside even once fired.

I suspect tumbling every firing to be unnecessary labor?

 

[Frank in the Laurels]

..in my opinion NO ! HUNTING IS NOT BENCHREST SHOOTING...your target is from a Volleyball to a Beachball in size and it doesn't make a bit of difference where the ball is hit, blood and air come out. A half inch or an inch and a half rifle have the same affect and effect...NOT WORTH DRIVING YOURSELF NUTS OVER..