Factory ammo blowing out primers?

Discussion in 'Rifles, Bullets, Barrels & Ballistics' started by RyanG, Feb 7, 2012.

  1. RyanG

    RyanG Well-Known Member

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    Today I went to shoot my son's Savage 25-06 mod 111 after we had bedded the plastic stock.... I first attempt at that.... it worked really well... anyway we had been shooting my reloads and trying to work up a load from what I had on hand. The rifle was showing some major improvement over the previous times.

    He wanted to shoot some factory ammo so after returning home to get a couple of boxes I had he shot 3 rounds of Federal Premium 110 grain Accubond stuff.... the group was horrible.... 2+ inches at 100 yards... When he walked up range I took the rifle to pull a snake through it and I opened the bolt and noticed two primers floating around in there.... 2 of the three rounds blew the primer clear out....

    I have NEVER seen factory ammo do this..... I hope that I got the pic to upload so you can see....

    Ryan
     

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  2. Loner

    Loner Well-Known Member

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    Doesn't take many of those to cut your bolt face up. Email the manufacturer photos
    and ask for a new box. They frequently send extras.
     
  3. RyanG

    RyanG Well-Known Member

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    It actually broke the ejector... I got a lot of great advice here tonight on how to get it out of the bolt... kind of bummed.... but learned a TON
     
  4. backwoods83

    backwoods83 Well-Known Member

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    You may say I'm crazy but check or have a gunsmith check the headspace and firing pin protrusion, some times if the firing pin wears or somehow gets backed off and just is hitting hard enough to light off the rounds this can happen, excessive headspace that may have not been on your reloads due to the amount you bump the shoulder back ( or lack of ) can also do this.
     
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  5. lloydsmale

    lloydsmale Well-Known Member

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    I have a ruger hawkeye 264 that did the same thing. I sent it back to ruger and they said there was rough scaling in the first part of the barrel. They ended up rebarreling it and its fine now.
     
  6. Johnboy

    Johnboy Well-Known Member

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    this is one of the main reasons I started reloading some 20 years ago.I hate the fact that all factory ammo is loaded hot.I still grit my teeth when some one wants me to sight in their rifel for hinting season.they all bring me factory ammo to shoot.

    we all know that speed isn't the most important part of reloading.but will add that some do along with accuracy.another thing I hate about a fast round is barrel life.it just ends up being to short a life for the barrel for me.

    ok I know none of this had to do with the OP's post but had to say it.but will say again that all factory ammo is loaded hot.why I do not know.I am sorry the OP had to go through this.its hard for one to own a nice rifel and something like this to happen.if it was me I would make the maker of the ammo pay for the bolt to be fixed.i think they owe that to him.it was their ammo that did the damage in the first place.he has the proof to show it was their ammo.again sorry to here about your range day.
     
  7. backwoods83

    backwoods83 Well-Known Member

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    Johnboy I'm not sure how you are finding this to be true, I'm not bashing but I have only run a couple factory loads through a chrony that were as fast as stated on the box or in a shooters bible. Most factory loads come up 100fps short and some even more. Even rimfire ammo, I have chronied cci stinger 22lr rated at 1625 and 1460 was the fastest of ten shots with 1288 being the low. From what I have seen only double tap, corbon, and weatherby will fly at or above stated velocities. I chronyed some fed 30-06 150grn accubonds rated at 2940 and they ran an average of 2811, and hand loading the same bullet in the same rifle with better accuracy I get an average of 3022.
     
  8. bigdaddyWSM

    bigdaddyWSM Active Member

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    my son just bought a factory Savage GRS rifle in 6 mm creedmoor that blows factory primers or even reduced reloaded ammo, barrel issues as I checked headspace with go/no go gauges & was fine. it also messed up ejector but bolt face is fine. ordered a new Shilen stainless select match & installing today.
    had a few options, dealer offered full refund, or send it back to factory hoping it gets a new ( reliable barrel) or just buy new barrel & start again, dealer did give a nice store credit then for reloading items.
     
  9. MudRunner2005

    MudRunner2005 Well-Known Member

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    While its at the smith, have him pull the barrel magnaflux the receiver, bolt, and chamber part of the barrel for hidden stress fractures. When something like that happens, it's better safe than sorry. If you don't, and there is a fracture, next time, it could be catastrophic or even hurt someone.

    When my .25-06 AI disintegrated a primer on its first trip to the range, I called the smith, he said bring it back, and he magnafluxed everything, and said it was fine, but keep a watch to ensure it doesn't happen again.
     
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  10. Guinness

    Guinness Active Member

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    I’ve seen Hornady Superformance ammunition crater and blow out primers in more than one cartridge loading and rifle. Because of this I’m more apt to believe its the actual factory load causing the issue in lieu of a rifle issue, in these specific instances. I personally steer clear of it based on these observations.

    JR
     
  11. MagnumManiac

    MagnumManiac Well-Known Member

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    This may or may NOT be the problem, as generally a blown primer is ONLY caused by excessive pressure or SOFT brass, Federal brass is notoriously SOFT.
    I have some FC-10 300WM brass that is ONCE FIRED that showed some leakage on some cases, yet ALL had LOOSE POCKETS after firing.
    It is not in any way feasibly reloadable.

    I have heard similar instances to yours.

    I would still have the rifle checked over by a gunsmith. If your bolt face is gas cut, it is up to Federal to fix the issue. PERIOD.

    Cheers.
    :)
     
  12. tim_w

    tim_w Well-Known Member

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    Sounds like you possibly got some hot ammo. I agree with Mudrunner get the barrel bolt receiver checked and do not send Federal any of the ammo back until you are sure you know everything that is been damaged or strained. Check for barrel bulge as well.

    The times we have had this happen we always pulled the bullet and weighed the charge of one of the rounds in the box and then went and purchased another box from a different lot and check it against it as well as the COAL. Of course its possible it was one bad loaded round but many times its a certain part of a lot.

    Lets just say I have seen just about every ammo company (firearms companies as well) try to deny fault when there has been an issue like this if they can possibly do it. Thanks to lawyers for setting the policies like that.

    I now have a system for how to handle these things and when I worked in the industry what I recommended to customers.

    NEVER send back all the ammo at the very least until the issue has been FULLY resolved. They want it all back so you have no proof anymore and of course so none of that dangerous ammo they would never admit is dangerous is out in the wild.

    Ammo manf try to blame the gun and gun manf try to blame the ammo manf. Its all a game to get you to drop it and divert blame.

    Same goes for the gun if for some reason it has to go back to Savage. Make sure you take a ton of pictures and get them where you are pointing to the effected areas and possibly a mic to show size if the issue requires it.


    Make sure someone other than you is paying for the gun to be fixed if the issue was not something you caused in the gun. I personally would not tell them you did anything to the gun even though bedding has no effect.

    Its possible Federal will just pay the smith bill but many times they want it sent to the factory.

    Then again maybe you will be happier just paying for the extractor and the gunsmith bill and getting a new box of ammo instead of dealing with all the BS. I know thats what the manf hope people just do.

    Lets just say its a sore spot with me when people/companies do not own up to when they make a mistake and be willing to correct it. NDAs not withstanding.
     
  13. RT2506

    RT2506 Well-Known Member

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    I have seen HOT factory ammo from numerous makers in numerous calibers in the over 50 years of shooting experience but can't recall ever blowing a primer but some were close, could not reload the cases because primer pockets were stretched too much. During the just past ammo drought, because of people hording it up mainly, I ran into all sorts of stuff. I am a handgun instructor and use Ruger MKII pistols to teach people how to shoot a pistol correctly. I provide the pistol but they bring the ammo. Some of the ammo has been sorry. I had one round that blew up and messed up parts in the bolt. It had to have had too much priming compound, a double shot, in it to do what it did. I have had many fail to fire and even had some regular HP bullets split in flight and leave two holes in the target. I have run into some Remington Golden HP that the bullets are just slightly over sized and cause jams. I guess running the factory FULL BORE quality control suffers. I trust my life to my handloads but have my doubts with factory ammo.
    As for the 25-06 with 100 gr 52 grs IMR 4350 and with 115 - 120 H4831 around 52 grs and IMR or AA 4350 around 49 grs has been a winner in numerous rifles. The plain old cup and core 100 and 117 Sierra are wicked accurate deer killing bullets. I prefer the 117.
     
  14. Ckleeves

    Ckleeves Well-Known Member

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    Some factory Federal Premium is on the hot side for sure. The soft federal brass only makes things worse. I have shot some 270 wsm and 300wsm Federal Premium Accubonds over the Labradar that were downright scary fast and showed pretty bad signs of pressure.