can i shoot berger out of my WSM?

Wheatgerm

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i didnt know if i should post this in reloading or here, but i hoped it would get more attention here..
im currently shooting 165 hornady out of my rem700 300WSM and they are shooting great, i cannot complain with the groups or speed (3200fps) however they do not carry the energy i want out past about 650-700 yards.

so i will be jumping up to a 180 gr bullet range for better long range energy. id like to go with the berger hunting 185 vld (BC .547) if i can with my gun.. but ive heard the longer vld bullet wont fit in a short mag unless you seat them really far in the throat? ive heard this can lose accuracy big time.
im wondering if anyone has tried and been successful or not with this bullet in this load?

if not i think my next choice will be the nosler accubond 180 BC .507

any help would be great! i dont want to pay 50$ to find out i cant shoot the berger. thanks!
 

Tikkamike

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This probably wont be the most popular answer but as I see it energy is an irrelevant number. a baseball thrown by a pitcher hitting the batter has 10x more energy than a bullet hitting an animal at 200 yards and it doesnt kill him. it takes very little energy to put a bullet through an animal. and if you are shooting with a max range of 6-700 yards a high BC isnt super important either (although a higher BC always flies flatter and fights wind better) What you want is a bullet that will expand and retain enough weight to penetrate the animal and break bones on the way through. ..Some people like fragmenting bullets, I am not one of them. I like to know that no matter what angle I hit the animal I am getting the bullet all the way through.
Now to address the OAL issue. Yes the berger is very long and to fit the magazine will probably have to be seated way down in the case (using up case capacity) and probably deteriorating accuracy (maybe not depends on your rifle) an accubond will get you much closer to the lands and still fit the magazine and its an excellent weight retaining bullet. Another option is Barnes which actually prefer a long jump to the lands typically and have 95-100% weight retention which means you are breaking bones on the way in, ripping up organs on the way through and breaking more bone on the way out and creating 2 sucking chest wounds which are fatal in themselves.
I am in emergency response and when a victim has just 1 hole its a whole lot easier to save them than when they have 2 holes.
 

4xforfun

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This probably wont be the most popular answer but as I see it energy is an irrelevant number. a baseball thrown by a pitcher hitting the batter has 10x more energy than a bullet hitting an animal at 200 yards and it doesnt kill him. it takes very little energy to put a bullet through an animal. and if you are shooting with a max range of 6-700 yards a high BC isnt super important either (although a higher BC always flies flatter and fights wind better) What you want is a bullet that will expand and retain enough weight to penetrate the animal and break bones on the way through. ..Some people like fragmenting bullets, I am not one of them. I like to know that no matter what angle I hit the animal I am getting the bullet all the way through.
Now to address the OAL issue. Yes the berger is very long and to fit the magazine will probably have to be seated way down in the case (using up case capacity) and probably deteriorating accuracy (maybe not depends on your rifle) an accubond will get you much closer to the lands and still fit the magazine and its an excellent weight retaining bullet. Another option is Barnes which actually prefer a long jump to the lands typically and have 95-100% weight retention which means you are breaking bones on the way in, ripping up organs on the way through and breaking more bone on the way out and creating 2 sucking chest wounds which are fatal in themselves.
I am in emergency response and when a victim has just 1 hole its a whole lot easier to save them than when they have 2 holes.

A baseball weighs between 5 and 5.25 oz....lets say 5.25 That is 2296 grains(7000 gr per lb divided by 16 oz in a pound x 5.25 oz). Lets say he is a major leage pitcher....thats a 90 MPH fast ball. Now it won't be going 90 when it hits the target..ah...er....batter, but lets say it still is 90 MPH. That is 132 FPS. (90 miles x 5,280 feet in a mile divided by 3600 seconds in an hour) = 132 FPS. plug that into a balistic calculator and puff..........88.8 foot pounds of energy.

Hardly 10 x the energy of a bullet hitting at 200!!

Unless my math is wrong.....lightbulb

Just sayin.
 

Wheatgerm

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N. Utah
ive been mainly an archery hunter for a long time so i agree with you that energy "somewhat" doesnt make a difference given you can still provide a devastating wound channel.. ive seen plenty of animals killed with an arrow that hits with less than 100 pounds of energy..
that being said i have also seen multiple bull elk shot 4+ times with 7mm & 300 win mags hit well in the vitals and still very much alive for a long tracking to recover. this is why i have started looking into energy. figuring if the bullet hits harder (and stays together with good expansion) it should do more damage?

from my research and from what you have said i COULD have good luck with the berger, but im more likely to have better luck with the nosler given the space im working with? id like my gun to be reliable and comfortable at 800 if needed but realistically shouldnt have to shoot over 600. will the BC @ .507 be good for this range?
 

Tikkamike

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ive been mainly an archery hunter for a long time so i agree with you that energy "somewhat" doesnt make a difference given you can still provide a devastating wound channel.. ive seen plenty of animals killed with an arrow that hits with less than 100 pounds of energy..
that being said i have also seen multiple bull elk shot 4+ times with 7mm & 300 win mags hit well in the vitals and still very much alive for a long tracking to recover. this is why i have started looking into energy. figuring if the bullet hits harder (and stays together with good expansion) it should do more damage?

from my research and from what you have said i COULD have good luck with the berger, but im more likely to have better luck with the nosler given the space im working with? id like my gun to be reliable and comfortable at 800 if needed but realistically shouldnt have to shoot over 600. will the BC @ .507 be good for this range?

I would pick the nosler over berger every time. they are an excellent bullet
 

Wheatgerm

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N. Utah
Why not try the 208 gr A-max with bc of .648. More than enough to do the job!

that would be plenty to do the job haha but i would like something left of the animal after i shoot it. JK
id like to stay above the 3000FPS mark. and if i decide to hunt deer with this gun i think 208gr would be a little heavy.

what difference would i see between a 180 gr hornady BC .480 and a 180 nosler BC .507?
the hornadys shoot great and cant go wrong with the price
 

Wheatgerm

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N. Utah
stick with the lighter bullet that shoots good. Speed kills!!

haha you guys arent making this easy..
i pullet the BC data for the 165 gr bullet.. it actually drops more at 600+ yards than the 180gr and has about 300 pounds less energy. seems out past 600 there is no benefits out of keeping the lighter bullet out of my caliber
 

4xforfun

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It is worked out mathematically on the internet somewhere and it is about 10x
Point being its irrelevant number


I...just worked it out for you...gave you the formulas and everything....do the math your self and don't believe everything you read on the internet. It is NOT an irrelevent number....just not as important as some say it is.
 

liltank

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Central Pennsylvania
Ok, lets compromise here. Use the 185 Berger. Plenty of energy, flatter trajectory, more hitting power. It is a Berger, but they have proven very effective. Though I didn't agree with EOL using them on water buffalo or what ever they were on the South America hunt, but it did work. It was the only thing that put up a good fight due to a 300 RUM velocity impact. Everything else dropped like a sack a taters!
 
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