guns_and_labs
Well-Known Member
Also make sure your empty brass is not too long.
Bolt is hard to close with new handloads
- Thread starter Oliveralan
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Oliveralan
Well-Known Member
ha what a coincidence! What measurements should I take on the brass to ensure it's the proper length? Just oal of an empty case? And is this before or after resizing?
Oliveralan
Well-Known Member
i have just measured my full length sized brass aswell as neck sized only brass and the lengths vary from 2.005 to 2.020" !! The shorter ones chamber slighty easier. I also measured my twice fired brass and this is shorter than the once fired ones. It has not been resized deprimed or anything, but it is at about 2.010" average. I'm getting really confused, seems like my shoulder needs to be bumped and the case trimmed??
KDB
Well-Known Member
Are you sure that bullet isn't jamming (touching) the lands when you are closing the bolt? Have you measured the chamber with a dummy round to find out what the rifles OAL is? I know you said that it was shorter than spec, but the rifle may have a short throat. Easy variable to check and possibly dismiss.
Good Luck
Good Luck
Oliveralan
Well-Known Member
Yes I made sure, my rounds are not being jammed into the lands. I will get a case trimmer asap and see if this solves my problem.
Oliveralan
Well-Known Member
Are you're loads really hot by any chance? If they're on the upper end your shoulder might need bumping back like the others said...The other thing is if you're using a full length die with the expander ball if you don't lube the inside of the neck it might be pulling the neck and shoulder foward on the way out of the die negating sizing you just did on the shoulder. Take out the expander ball from your sizer and try it that way. I adjust my redding body die so I can feel a slight resistance closing the bolt but not difficult to chamber. Check your loads too, if they're hot they might be expanding a lot more.
"Once fired LC". Better start measuring the base above the rim too.
A lot of military brass comes from machine guns which has slightly oversize chambers for good reasons. This means the brass swells more than your chamber.
Even with tighter dies, once brass swells way out it never wants to come down and often makes it harder to chamber in tighter chamber guns.
BH
A lot of military brass comes from machine guns which has slightly oversize chambers for good reasons. This means the brass swells more than your chamber.
Even with tighter dies, once brass swells way out it never wants to come down and often makes it harder to chamber in tighter chamber guns.
BH
Oliveralan
Well-Known Member
I lubed my cases and die very generously but there is still a lot of resistance when I try to get the brass out of the die. It is a lee collect full length sizing die. How can I remove it's expander ball or equiv?
The lee collet die neck sizes only.
The lee full length die does that exactly, full length sizes including the neck. I don't know of a lee collet full length sizer at least that I've seen yet. I used to use the lee when I first started loading but stopped becuase of that very same issue. I use a redding body die now just to bump the shoulders back and the lee collet die to size the neck.
what you can try though with your lee full length sizer is take out the center mandrel and decapping rod with the expander. I've never done it but I would think that would get rid of the neck sizing ability of the die. Then essentially you would have just a body die. You can still deprime with the lee collet die.
After you lube the die and casings let them dry for a minute or so. I've found it works better. I use my fingers to even out the coating on the casings too.
The lee full length die does that exactly, full length sizes including the neck. I don't know of a lee collet full length sizer at least that I've seen yet. I used to use the lee when I first started loading but stopped becuase of that very same issue. I use a redding body die now just to bump the shoulders back and the lee collet die to size the neck.
what you can try though with your lee full length sizer is take out the center mandrel and decapping rod with the expander. I've never done it but I would think that would get rid of the neck sizing ability of the die. Then essentially you would have just a body die. You can still deprime with the lee collet die.
After you lube the die and casings let them dry for a minute or so. I've found it works better. I use my fingers to even out the coating on the casings too.
KDB
Well-Known Member
On the subject of case lube, remember that more is not better. Heavy lube on the cases and on the inside of the die can cause a hydraulic pressure effect--making it harder to size the brass. In the extreme, it can deform the brass.
Given that your shorter brass is chambering easier, I think you found your problem. You'll want to trim your brass after sizing. Full length size that twice fired brass that's shorter right now and then measure it. I bet you'll be surprised to find it's longer than it was. The reason is that when you fire, the brass stretches to fill the chamber neck. The chamber neck is larger than the space allowed for in the sizing die so when you size the brass it gets squeezed back down to tollerance. That displaced brass has to go somewhere when it's squeezed back to size and the easiest place for it to go is to extend the lenght of the neck.
I would say give trimming after sizing a shot before you start tearing dies apart. Unless, of course, curiosity has the best of ya and you just feel like tearing 'em up!
I would say give trimming after sizing a shot before you start tearing dies apart. Unless, of course, curiosity has the best of ya and you just feel like tearing 'em up!
RoughNeck182
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I had a very similar experience once.
It sounds to me like you have the same dies I have from the Lee Deluxe Rifle kit - the full length sizing die and the collet neck sizing die. I have found that it takes several cycles with the neck sizing die before the shoulder needs to be 'bumped' or just good old fashioned full length sizing It also sounds like you full lengthed sized the new brass the first time so you should be good for shoulder space right now if I have read you correctly. So, to the point at hand for what it's worth:
I have had rounds I loaded but forgot to chamfer the outside of the mouth that were really tight to chamber. They were fine in all the other dimensions. It was surprising how much drag it created just to be not chamfered. It had a slightly different 'feel' on the bolt than brass that needs the shoulder bumbed. Some light crimping fixed those rounds and I have always made sure to chamfer properly since and haven't had it again.
Cheers
It sounds to me like you have the same dies I have from the Lee Deluxe Rifle kit - the full length sizing die and the collet neck sizing die. I have found that it takes several cycles with the neck sizing die before the shoulder needs to be 'bumped' or just good old fashioned full length sizing
It also sounds like you full lengthed sized the new brass the first time so you should be good for shoulder space right now if I have read you correctly. So, to the point at hand for what it's worth:I have had rounds I loaded but forgot to chamfer the outside of the mouth that were really tight to chamber. They were fine in all the other dimensions. It was surprising how much drag it created just to be not chamfered. It had a slightly different 'feel' on the bolt than brass that needs the shoulder bumbed. Some light crimping fixed those rounds and I have always made sure to chamfer properly since and haven't had it again.
Cheers
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