264 win mag questions

[mtbohunter]

Hello LRH,
I recently purchased a Browning A-Bolt Medallion in 264 win mag for 2 reasons.
1. My local taxidermist and good friend has 5 of them (264's) and besides his 338's and 375's, he basically said I could not live without one. My go to has been a 25-06 for deer/coyotes and 338RUM for all larger.

2. Our local large gun store had Browning A-Bolts on close out and I could pass on the price! $640 for the 264 and $540 for a 300wm for my son who is 4... At least that is the plan

So my question is, how far can I push the 264 with Retumbo and 140 accubonds?
I loaded 20rds .15" off with 60gr and cleaned between each round. Shooting at 3 dots at 50yds for the barrel set, I got 3 holes and about filled my pants by the time I was done. Noted it was 50yds but NOT 1 FLYER!

I then loaded 3@61gr, 3@62gr, 3@63, [email protected], 3@64 and [email protected].

Shot the first 3 with .75"group @100yds & 2956fps,
Second group was.68 and 2990fps,
third was about the same 63.5 & 2976fps, (Slower?)
and 64gr were .5" & 3060fps,
and 64.5gr was .8 & 3085 but I truly believe that was my fault on the last group and all were at 100yds.
My velocity spread (Comp. electronics pro crono) was between 30fps and 60fps with all groups giving 2 shots at really close velocity then one around 50fps slower. My crony was probably way to close at about 7ft and some of the spread could have been from muzzle blast.
I was letting the barrel cool between shots at 60 degrees ambient temp.
I have good velocity at 3085 but have No pressure signs yet so I am wondering how much further to go. I am going to try 3 at .5gr higher, but how far can I run in reality?
I know the dangers of heat, but in a hunting rifle once I get over the magical 3100fps mark and have good accuracy I will probably call it good.
I have to give my taxidermist a +1 on recommending a 264 as its looking really good!
Any thoughts on top velocities safely would be greatly appreciated!

 

[Trnelson]

If your browning is a 26" barreled rifle you **might** find 3100. Every rifle is it's own set of rules. I am running WC 867 surplus powder in my rig. I'm running through 26" of barrel then a spec war 762, for 3180. My rifle found pressure sign at 76.5g for 3230 through the can. I run 74.6g which is where I found best accuracy. YMMV. I haven't tested without the suppressor, recoil is equal to my 5.56 and it's not much louder than a 22lr. Lastly, I broke in my barrel with minimum charges of powder until the velocity stabilized, then I started pressure testing and load development. At about 65 rounds the ES really started to tighten up with no changes in the ammunition. I broke in shoot one, clean, shoot two, clean up to five rounds. Then I shot ten between cleanings. I have exactly 130 rounds down the pipe at this point. YMMV. Have fun, work up slow and look for best accuracy. A 140g 6.5 bullet is something to behold, even at "only" 3000fps...

 

[mtbohunter]

Sounds like a sweet rig!
I just cant believe how forgiving it appears 264 can be and I really cant wait to try it on black bear this spring here in SW Mont!
What would make the Browning not want to hit 3150 with accuracy? Is the chamber generally to tight in factory guns to allow for it?
And by the way, what part on Ne are you from? I started this journey in Dannebrog:> Small world.

 

[mtbohunter]

I have an additional question or two for LRH on the subject.
Is it as simple as running lubed 7mm mag brass through a 264 fl die to make brass? I have read that a few times and if its that easy, I wouldn't have spent the money for Nosler brass. That stuff is supposed to be ready to load?? I tried it and had a great deal of tension differences in the neck when seating bullets:<
Can I just neck size the brass from Nosler or should I fl size it before use?
$75.00 for Nosler brass is tough!
Thanks Again!

 

[Trnelson]

In my playing around with 264 mag I've found a 26" barrel is just darn near required in order to get to the full potential of the cartridge. YMMV. With the right combination of powder and bullet, 24" could show an advantage over the 6.5/284 or 6.5/06. I love my 26" barreled savage actioned 6.5/06 dearly, but the 264 mag with at least 26" is just another level of 6.5 bliss. I'd love a chance to send a 140 Berger through a black bear! I don't think you'll be dissapointed with the results. The 140 Hornady A-max is also a good choice. I've been tempted to try the 150 Cutting Edge in my 264 mag, but I have not yet. I bought 100 pieces of Nosler brass for my 264 and have had excellent results, only 2 were culled for being more than 2g heavier than the others. I've fired all 98 in the rifle and have fired 32 of them twice. I neck size exclusively until the bolt is difficult to close, then I'll anneal and full-length size them. A guy could certainly neck 7 mag brass down and run that, as long as you devise a solid method to identify them and keep them separated. It would likely ruin your day and maybe your rifle if you managed to fire a .284" bullet down a .264" barrel... IIRC Norma makes 264 mag brass, I wouldn't feel bad about using that at all either. I've read on the forum that Norma actually makes the Nosler brass fwiw... I'm not certain if that is really true, but I've seen that several times now.
I'm in Lincoln, small world!

 

[mtbohunter]

Alright, teach me about annealing that 264 as well. How do you know how much heat to apply with the flame? I have never tried it. Ive done a lot of neck then fl sizing but never tried annealing. I think your right there though to improve case life. Lived there 15 years and worked at Cushman till it closed. Still have strong feelings about that whole thing! **** glad to be in SW MT though! Come out June 5th to the 15th and we'll get you on a spring bear!
Thanks!

 

[Trnelson]

I use a pan of water up to the neck of the case, and fill the inside to the same level. Two and a half seconds with a propane torch about 2" above shooting straight down does the trick. Let them naturally cool and your good to go. IMO, it's easy to go too far and ruin the brass with too much heat for too long.
The university just razed the cushmann plant site in lincoln for some new buildings. Sad to see such a historic place befall the DOZER. I'll have to check my schedule to see if I'm off during that time. I'd sure like to put a bear in the freezer.

 

[mtbohunter]

Thanks for the tip on the annealing! They will be walking June 1 for sure!
Just call! or email. 406-684-5388 [email protected]
I saw 18 bears last year but I tried to take my 4 year old with me to get on them. Kinda tough carrying a 4yr old up a mountain! First year I havent filled my tag in years.

 

[RT2506]

To make 264 cases out of 7mm I just lube them up and run them in my FL die. I used once fired WW cases and match prep them and use 66.5 grs Retumbo, CCI 250 primers, 130 gr Nosler Accubond 20 thousands off the lands and I average 3350 fps half MOA accuracy. I have a Rem 700 with a 9 twist 27 3/4" Shilen barrel and it has a tight chamber. I use this for deer and had shot them from 30 to a bit over 500 yards and 99% of them have been BANG FLOP and those that die not did not go over 20 yards. The Accubond bullet is really great. It flies like the ballistic tip and starts to expand like one but holds together like the partition and keeps on trucking. Even going 3350 fps a muzzle the close shots like 30 to 50 yards the bullet exits through both shoulders of a deer. I shoot the 130 gr because that is what I found first when I got the rifle and believe it would do best with the 9 twist. If it ain't broke I don't try to fix it. It shot so well I have just stuck with it.

 

[apexmtnman]

I have 3 264's, one pre 64 Westerner, one Remington Model 700 CDL-SF and one custom built on a Stiller action with a Broughton barrel. My son also owns a Sendero in 264. Our go to load is 68.5 grains of Retumbo, WW cases, Fed 215M primers and Berger 140 hunting VLD's. 68.5 grains of Retumbo is max in the Berger manual. With a 26 inch barrel we are getting right at 3200 fps and in my custom 28 inch Broughton I'm getting 3280 fps. This load shoots 1/2-1 MOA in all of our rifles. We use a Redding full length bushing die each time and have .002 neck tension, and load them to have about .010 bullet clearance to the lands.

 

[Leslie Sapp]

Is it as simple as running lubed 7mm mag brass through a 264 fl die to make brass?

Yes. That's exactly what we did until we could get some with the proper headstamp, but the necked down 7mm brass shoots so good, we have yet to load any of the 264

 

[DocDoc]

A little humorous that the reverse was the origin of the 7mm RM, necking up the .264 Win Mag.

 

[Trnelson]

A little humorous that the reverse was the origin of the 7mm RM, necking up the .264 Win Mag.

Just don't EVER remind a 7mag fan of that fact...

 

[mtbohunter]

More questions.
I was finally able to get back out and shoot my A-bolt yesterday and got 3 out of 4 in one wallowed hole with the 2nd being about .75" higher than the other 3. This was with 65.5gn of Retumbo and I had worked up from 63 to 66 with half grain increments. I would be happy with that grouping and building more 65.5gn and playing with seating depth, but my extreme spread was all over the place. From a low of 3100 to a high of 3137.
What is usually the easiest way to get the velocity spread under control? I have been shooting my 338rum with 225 innerbonds with a velocity spread of 7 and 1" groups. This 264 shoots tighter with a much higher spread??