25-06 ackley and other ackleys

Discussion in 'Reloading' started by Ackley Varminter, Jan 22, 2014.

  1. Ackley Varminter

    Ackley Varminter New Member

    Messages:
    3
    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2014
    Well i just got through building my first 25-06 a.k. This is one of many different calibers that me and my father have built over the years. Its an L.A tang safety Ruger action with a 26" shilen 1-10 twist. I've always been a lighter bullet is better kinda guy but my 25 A.K loves 58 gr accurate 4350 with a 85 gr nosler varminter at speeds of 3680. If you have never loaded for an ackley befor my rule is start with a regular load for that cartridge for fireforming and stay away from nickel brass. After fireforming start with the top load for the regular cartridge and work your way up,The point of building an ackley isn't getting more speed but to get the pressure down if you wanna get more speed then go with a weatherby or different round all together but i guarantee the ackley will be a better shooter. Either way you feel I'm an ackjley man for. life. Feel free to. ask any questions.
     
  2. joseph floerke

    joseph floerke Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    190
    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2012
    Why not gain speed i just switched my dads 280rem to a 280AI gained about 200fps lost pressure and it shoots a heck of allot better now.
     
  3. Jud96

    Jud96 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,491
    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2013
    I believe the main reason of Ackleys is to make the cartridge more efficient by utilizing the same case but improving upon it by increasing powder capacity, lowering pressures, and giving you more speed. I would only rechamber a rifle or build one in an Ackley to further better an already great cartridge such as the .243 Winchester or .260 Remington.
     
  4. Outlaw6.0

    Outlaw6.0 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,097
    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2010
    I've had 3 ackleys in my life, I started with a 243AI shot it out & up graded to the 6mmAI & then built a 6.5-06AI for my father as a X-mas gift.

    Watch our for pressure as the Straight tapers have a knack for masking pressure until your over loaded. The 243AI was a great little cartridge but & LOVE the 6mmAI, it substantial taper & gentle shoulder angle make for a rather large improvement.

    P.O. had it figured out a long time ago. Good stuff.


    t
     
  5. Trickymissfit

    Trickymissfit Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,137
    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2010
    Parker redesigned to 64mm case to reduce brass flow first. I think his first case in that length was the 30-06. Folks that shoot the 30-06AI rarely see 100fps in gain, but usually see far less brass flow issues. The same can pretty much be said for that whole family. Yet for some odd reason the 7mm and 6.5 calibers seem to work better than the 30 improved version, but velocity gains "usually" are not as great as some of the smaller cases due to excessive overbore.

    I used to be a front of the pack fan of the Ackley case concept. I'm not now! I'd prefer the 30 degree shoulder or even the 35 degree shoulder to avoid some other issues that come along with a 40 degree shoulder. The differences in velocity are very little. A couple days back I looked over some loading data for the 6mm Mashburn (30 degree shoulder), and was stunned at the velocities they were getting. I've shot the 22-250AI, .257AI, 6mmAI, .243AI, 6mm/250AI, and maybe the .222AI. Of them I liked the 6mmAI, and .257AI best, but the .222AI was a great round. Always wanted to spend a summer behind the .250AI and a fast twist barrel. Of them this one is the best. I would say that I saw about 170fps gain with the 6mm, .257, and the rest were less.

    gary
     
  6. Gary Kaney

    Gary Kaney Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    596
    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2003
    Who did you guys work? I have a FN TSR 223 I want to AI. So far I've talked to 3 gunsmiths about doing the AI , and I've gotten 3 different ways answers.
     
  7. BRIT

    BRIT Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    82
    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2007
    I have two Ackleys. One is a 30-06 and the other a 25-06.
    The 30-06 has fulfilled all my expectations. Excellent Accuracy, just shy of 3k fps with a 168 A-Max which is healthy, zero pressure signs and primer pockets as tight as new after six reloads, never trimmed a case either. Rem Action and Lilja Barrel
    My 25-06 is still a work in progress but so far accuracy is very poor. This is a Borden Action and LW Barrel too. Only Bullet showing promise so far is 115 Berger VLD and H4831sc. However 53 grains is max before heavy Bolt lift and that is for only 3000fps too. Brass is fireformed Sako Factory.

    Brit.
     
  8. BEEMAN

    BEEMAN Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    856
    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2011
    I had very slow speeds and poor accuracy in my 25-06AI with 4831 as well. I got a lot of speed out of 7828 but it is not temp stable enough. If I left my rounds on the bench I was not over pressure at 61 gr of 7828. With rounds in my pocket I was over pressure with 59 gr. I have now moved to H1000 and it is more accurate, with decent speed. My rifle is on a trued 700 action, with a 26" Krieger barrel. Load is 115 Berger 15 thou off lands, 61.5 gr of H1000, MV of 3350 fps. Started to show pressure at 62.gr. This load is showing promise as it is accurate and has ES of 11 fps. Work up to this load slowly as your gun sounds very different than mine. 53 gr sounds like a light load to start seeing signs of over pressure.
     
  9. BRIT

    BRIT Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    82
    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2007
    Hi Beeman
    Yes my velocities with H4831sc are disappointing, I had hoped for better with this powder as I thought the burning rate to be just right. I have N165 and Ramshot Magnum to try. Hodgdon powders are like Hens Teeth this side of the Atlantic so doubt if I could find H1000.
    My other option is the New Truflite Blank and standard 25-06 Reamer I have :).
    I have read of some real eye popping velocities people are getting from the 25-06 AI. People are claiming near .257 Weatherby performance! I would like to see pressure Data from some of these Loads.

    Many thanks.

    Brit.
     
  10. FEENIX

    FEENIX Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    10,675
    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2008
    My .270 AI have exceeded my expectations and am very pleased. My accuracy load at this time is pushing the 175 Matrix VLD at 2993 FPS with 58.5 H4831SC, BR2 Win brass out of 30" Lilja 3-groove 1:8".
     
  11. BEEMAN

    BEEMAN Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    856
    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2011
    Brit, I do believe that you can get close to 257 Weatherby performance. With 7828 I was at 257 Weatherby speeds with about 10 grains less powder. It also would not shoot consistently. I think it was having pressure spikes. Could put 2 in the same hole then the third would be 1.25" over. When I mistakenly left my rounds in my pocket I had speeds of 3500 and one at just over 3600 fps with a 115 Berger. This is when I knew I was over pressure, because that is to fast. Still didn't have a crazy bad ejector mark, and bolt lift was a little sticky. How about some N570? That is close to RETUMBO, might work. Or another VIT powder with a burn rate close to H1000. You should be able to get over 3000 fps.
     
  12. MudRunner2005

    MudRunner2005 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    11,855
    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2008
    Still waiting to get my .25-06 AI back from the smith. However, it is still deer season (till 1/31) and I'm sure he is hunting as much as possible, so I'm not gonna bother him right now. However I've already got my fire-forming loads made up and ready for when he calls and says it's done. Can't wait!
     
  13. MudRunner2005

    MudRunner2005 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    11,855
    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2008
    Have you tried IMR 7828 SSC? I have heard great things about it and the 115 Bergers for the .25-06 AI.

    Which is what I plan on running in mine, and developing a load with.
     
  14. BEEMAN

    BEEMAN Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    856
    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2011
    MudRunner I have not tried the 7828 SSC. What I didn't like about the 7828 was how temperature sensitive it was. During load development I was leaving my bullets on the bench. One time I forgot and left the bullets in my pocket. I was instantly over pressure. When the rounds were cold they shot ok but usually had one flier. Also when they were cold I had no pressure signs at 61 gr 7828. If I kept them warm I was over pressure at 59 gr 7828! Is the SSC more temp stable? From what I have read you load the same as regular 7828. In my gun the H1000 tightened up the groups and had a way better ES. If your gun likes the 7828 I think it will run with the 257 Weatherby. I liked the speed with 7828 but it was just not consistent enough. With a 28-30" barrel I would think 3400+ fps could be reached. With the H1000 I am at 3350 fps with a ES of 11.