28 nosler with 195 vs 300 win mag with 215 hybrid

[rcol317]

As Elk Hunter 338 pointed out they are so close but the recoil is the big difference. I've taken many trophies with my 300 Rum and never feared the recoil in the field but hate it on the bench. When making a long shot across the windy canyon I've always appreciated the Rums ability to deal with the wind and come through!

 

[Elk Hunter 338]

In rifles of same build weight, same brake and everything else same the 215 vs 195 recoil wise is not a noticeable difference!
28 nosler burning upwards of 85gr of powder va 300 win burning roughly 77gr of powder.

 

[machoking]

I've killed 12 elk dead right there with a 7 mag and 150-162 grain bullet. 2 with a .260 Remington, 143 grain bullet. Shot placement > displacement. I know, people are going to argue "what if you don't have a good shot?" Well, I wouldn't take a bad shot with a 300 RUM or a 243. I've never shot an elk that was wearing a kevlar vest, maybe the elk in Idaho forget theirs at home? You put the high shoulder shot on an elk, with a bullet of good construction and within the speed envelope for which that bullet was designed, you have a dead elk. I'd much rather see someone shooting a 6.5 that they have practiced with over and over than a big overbore magnum that makes them flinch.

 

[MudRunner2005]

Hunting bullet to 1000 yards, deer, antelope and elk. Which is the choice? A lot of proven data on 215 but have heard of some performance issues with 195? 195 wins ballistically for wind drift. Any help is appreciated in my decision.

Here's a picture I took the other day... Here's you a true Berger bullet visual comparison to put it into perspective.

Left-to-right...

.257 115 grain
6.5mm 130 AR Hybrid
7mm 168 VLD
7mm 195 Elite Hunter
.308 210 VLD

Which bullet do you think has better ballistics... Hint, hint...2nd from the right.

 

[FEENIX]

Where's Broz? mtmuley

I think we all know where he stands and his "real" world experience on the .300 WM/215 combo is hard to beat.

 

[FEENIX]

Broz ran a 7-300 and a 300. After a few animals they left the 7-300 home. I would contact him for direct comparison. If elk is always on the menu a 3 is what the bore should start with for a number. How you fill in the rest is up to you. There is no replacement for displacement. If you just found out your going next season run what you brung and enjoy. Modern brakes like beast and the rest have really evened up the major difference which is recoil. If shooting a 300 and big 7 is mitigated by a good break why settle for far less cross section. All of the sub 30 calibers are separated by single digit .000's of an inch. From 284 to 308 is like a 6.5 to a 7 or 6 to a 6.5 or a 22 to a 6mm. All are major moves with a tweener cept the 23 cal. 25cal 27 cal. In every case it is more about the bullet than the case.
One of the very reasons the 06 has had such a great ride.

Well said Sir!

 

[FEENIX]

I opted for the 215/300 combo simply because I can run it in a 9 or 10 twist tube.

More importantly to me, in a pinch, I can sling the ABM/Berger Ammo if I don't get a chance to roll my own or any of the available heavier bullet weight factory ammo from Nosler/Barnes/Hornady etc.

With a dedicated 195 EOL chamber and twist (1-8 IIRC), you're locked in to rolling your own with no safety net for facyory ammo per se. But that only matters if you dont have enough on hand or nothing happens to your ammo while out in the field.

Just my 2 pennies.

Excellent point on the availability of a factory ammo option, esp. for non-reloaders.

 

[BJH]

I know that this may take us off subject slightly. But it is in the original post. So, I am a little confused with the performance issues with Berger? I have heard from many people that they just blow up on the hide and never penetrate. I have also read here that they do not expand and just blow right through the animal. For you guys using the Berger bullets, what are you seeing? Do they blow up on the hide or pinhole? I have several boxes of the 195 EOL's sitting on my reloading bench ready for a custom 7-300 Win and a 28 Nosler. Just wondering if its worth trying them. I have always ran the 180 Hybrid and love them. But always like to try new things.

 

[FEENIX]

I know that this may take us off subject slightly. But it is in the original post. So, I am a little confused with the performance issues with Berger? I have heard from many people that they just blow up on the hide and never penetrate. I have also read here that they do not expand and just blow right through the animal. For you guys using the Berger bullets, what are you seeing? Do they blow up on the hide or pinhole? I have several boxes of the 195 EOL's sitting on my reloading bench ready for a custom 7-300 Win and a 28 Nosler. Just wondering if its worth trying them. I have always ran the 180 Hybrid and love them. But always like to try new things.

IMHO, yes they are worth your time and effort.

 

[Elk Hunter 338]

Here's a picture I took the other day... Here's you a true Berger bullet visual comparison to put it into perspective.

Left-to-right...

.257 115 grain
6.5mm 130 AR Hybrid
7mm 168 VLD
7mm 195 Elite Hunter
.308 210 VLD

View attachment 92248

Which bullet do you think has better ballistics... Hint, hint...2nd from the right.

HA HA HA this is always the way it works (unless you didn't have a 230 or 215 hybrid or 230 smk or 225 eld etc. 30 cal then I'll forgive you LOL) take the heaviest bullet for caliber on the smaller stuff Ex. 284 195gr eol and then compare to a medium weight bullet designed some 10 plus years ago and say ballistic superior when you actually comparing apples to a sour grape! That's like when BOTW came out and had their add about the 168 VLD in a 7mag vs a 168 or 180 gr bullet of non high bc configuration out of a 300 win and claimed ballistic superiority!!!! HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA Well duh!!! I personally shoot no less 5000 rounds a year and i would bet its more and I've personally compared APPLES to APPLES the highest for BC in 284 195 EOL and the highest for BC in 308 from 210 -240 class bullets as well as 300 plus gr 338 cal bullets and i can tell you for a fact that when hitting steel or animals at any range with a 210-240gr 30 cal or 300 gr 338 vs a 195 284 there is a distinct difference in terminal performance when hit with the bigger 30 cal and 338 stuff i mean literally night and day, I'm not saying high spine shots I'm saying boiler room shots!!!! There is absolutely no replacement for displacement!!!! Look I'm not saying its not a bad *** bullet! Its the baddest 7mm bullet around and it works well and if your a 7mm guy then its the cats ***, but I'm keeping the screen transparent and as far as The recoil debate ive tested side by side with non broke rifles in 28 and 300 win mag of same weight and design and have had others shoot them as well and the verdict was conclusive the bigger 7 kicked harder and was sharper than the 300 win mag!

 

[kai]

I'm building a custom long range gun with a .284 barrel that I was going to have chambered for the 195 Bergers until I started hearing about the terminal performance issues.

Would a barrel chambered for the 195 Bergers shoot the 175 ELDX... or should the barrel be chambered differently for the 175 ELDX?

The 175 ELDX has a BC of .689 compared to the Berger 195's .755.

 

[PAshooter20BR]

5mph wind at 90 degrees to billet flight:
195 at 3150 fps
215 at 3000 fps
Kill zone of 18 inch diameter
1000 yards
195 drifts 21 inches
215 drifts 25 inches
You make a poor judgement on wind call and are 50% off. That puts your 195 1.5 inches out of kill zone and your 215 out of kill zone by 3.5 inches.
Which do you choose and why?

 

[martinakl]

Don't overlook the Hornady 180 ELD-M. BC is really high on it, even if you average the three BC numbers (which seems to be working for others).

Reports are good about it's on game performance. It's a "target" bullet but so is the Berger 215.

Hornady numbers:
https://www.hornady.com/support/ballistic-coefficient

I'm a 300 Win fan but nothing wrong with a .284 bullet.

 

[Elk Hunter 338]

I'm building a custom long range gun with a .284 barrel that I was going to have chambered for the 195 Bergers until I started hearing about the terminal performance issues.

Would a barrel chambered for the 195 Bergers shoot the 175 ELDX... or should the barrel be chambered differently for the 175 ELDX?

The 175 ELDX has a BC of .689 compared to the Berger 195's .755.

yes it can shoot the 175 and 180 eld bullets fine!!