New Hammer range test

[RockyMtnMT]

Here is a pic of the new Hammer .338 254g next to a Berger 300g VLD. Gives perspective to the size and form of the new Hammer.



Steve

 

[srhaggerty]

Steve I know you recommended the 8.5 twist with those 150's, but was wondering since I had excellent results with those 155's here in Wyoming. Could I get away with the same 9 twist and 150's?

 

[Timber338]

Here is a pic of the new Hammer .338 254g next to a Berger 300g VLD. Gives perspective to the size and form of the new Hammer.

View attachment 70203

Steve

Wow. That's impressive. Really want to hear how that 338 tests out for BC and inside an elk.

 

[RockyMtnMT]

Steve I know you recommended the 8.5 twist with those 150's, but was wondering since I had excellent results with those 155's here in Wyoming. Could I get away with the same 9 twist and 150's?

I don't remember your elevation, but I think you would be fine. 3000' above sea level would be as low as one could go with a 9" twist. 5000' would be fully stable.

We were a bit conservative with the twist rating on the 155g and 177g Hammer Hunters. The 150g as it is now is slightly longer than the 155g so it is just a bit tougher to fully stabilize.

Steve

 

[srhaggerty]

I don't remember your elevation, but I think you would be fine. 3000' above sea level would be as low as one could go with a 9" twist. 5000' would be fully stable.

We were a bit conservative with the twist rating on the 155g and 177g Hammer Hunters. The 150g as it is now is slightly longer than the 155g so it is just a bit tougher to fully stabilize.

Steve

Steve Cheyenne is right at 6000'. I hunt anywhere from 5000 to 10000'.

 

[RockyMtnMT]

Steve Cheyenne is right at 6000'. I hunt anywhere from 5000 to 10000'.

You are golden.

Steve

 

[RockyMtnMT]

Shot the 254g .338 Hammer out to 1280 yards today. Good news it shot very accurately. Bad news is bc came in lower than expected. Thinking it has to do with the boat tail. When we cut the bullet off from the bar at the end of machining it leaves a slight burr on the base of the bullet. I am thinking it is acting like a parachute. Will get rid of this and test again and let you know.

Read more: New Hammer range test | Hammer Time

Mean while gonna go get some elk this weekend with it and work on the issues later.

Steve

 

[Bravo 4]

I'm interested in how they perform on game, especially elk. Good luck on your hunt.

Is this the design you were waiting on perfecting before you made a .408 caliber...

 

[RockyMtnMT]

I'm interested in how they perform on game, especially elk. Good luck on your hunt.

Is this the design you were waiting on perfecting before you made a .408 caliber...

Yes it is.

We said from the start that we would be transparent when it comes to our products, so I have to give a less than stellar report. The good news is Trav was able to get both his elk tags filled, but we were less than happy with the bullet performance on game. Back when we first started our bullets we were making them with 1mm hollow points and discovered that they were not opening well at low vel and had to do a whole line change in our design. Now we started into the quest to develop a high bc offering and went back to the 1mm hollow point. Our thinking was that we had made a change in copper to a softer custom alloy and a more slender nose shape that it would work well. Out initial testing backed this up. Along came this rare chance to test on game. Both elk were well hit at 760y and were fortunately in wide open country. Took way too long to go down. Bullets are showing near the terminal performance as our Hammer Hunter line. So I can say that we will no longer work with 1mm hollow points. They simply do not work as well as our 1.5mm hollow point. We will continue to work with this new ogive design but with a larger meplat. Looks like I may get drawn for the same damage hunt soon so we will be hustling to get a new design good to go. Or just use the good ol' Hammer Hunter and be confident in the terminal performance. Takes a lot of the fun out of it when they don't die well.

One other thing learned; it is difficult to duplicate on game performance without using game. Very glad to have learned what we did without any of these in the hands of our customers.

I will continue to keep you posted on the advancement of the new design.

Steve

 

[Bravo 4]

So with the 1.5mm hollow point does that mean that the larger the diameter of the bullet the greater the BC potential? At least compared to a smaller caliber bullet of similar design.
Also, would a set sized hollow point make the smaller caliber have more rapid expansion compared to that same larger bullet?

 

[RockyMtnMT]

So with the 1.5mm hollow point does that mean that the larger the diameter of the bullet the greater the BC potential? At least compared to a smaller caliber bullet of similar design.
Also, would a set sized hollow point make the smaller caliber have more rapid expansion compared to that same larger bullet?

I think the size of the hp has some relativeness to the amount of material that is around it as far as it's effectiveness. As far as the bc potential of the larger dia bullet is concerned I would say that it is due to the fact that it is heavier. Added weight adds bc. The heavier a bullet is the bc goes up regardless of form. The ability of a bullet to expand seems to be more relative to the sectional density. Higher sectional density bullets are easier to get to deform on impact than the smaller sectional density bullets. The higher ones seem to have a little more poop behind them to initiate deformation.

What I think we are seeing here is the small hp has a tougher time getting through the hair and crud to get into the fluid needed to cause the cavity to open up. Not sure if it plugs or gets miss shaped and keeps the terminal performance from being what it is when we test on controlled media. The bullets that we used on the elk yesterday show good performance on test media so we were hit with disappointment.

There is a very good chance that I will be drawn in the next few days for the same hunt and we will have an opportunity to duplicate the shots with our Hammer Hunter bullets of nearly identical weight and length but having 1.5mm hp's. If this happens it will be a chance to compare that would be rare. Headed to the range tomorrow to get new loads dialed in. We will see.

Steve

 

[Bravo 4]

I'm sure you have thought of this, but what about a tipped version? Kinda like the CEB Lazer.

 

[RockyMtnMT]

I'm sure you have thought of this, but what about a tipped version? Kinda like the CEB Lazer.

At this point my opinion of tips is they plug the hole that is needed to get hydraulics into in order to create good deformation. The tip needs to get out of the way. The tip allows for a larger hole to be present but the hope is that on impact it pushes in and starts the expansion. Problem is it must allow fluids into the hole for proper expansion.

I will never say never but I don't think so. It is a compromise in my opinion. We would rather stay with the hp and get the best bc with the size of hp that is necessary for terminal performance.

Steve

 

[Bravo 4]

At this point my opinion of tips is they plug the hole that is needed to get hydraulics into in order to create good deformation. The tip needs to get out of the way. The tip allows for a larger hole to be present but the hope is that on impact it pushes in and starts the expansion. Problem is it must allow fluids into the hole for proper expansion.

Is this the case with all tipped bullets (Ballistic Tips, SST, Accubond, TTSX, and such)? I understanding (probably due to sales pitches) is the tip promotes rapid expansion and increases BC.
And I'm not being facetious, I'm sincerely asking you as more an SME than I.