Viper vs. SIII ???

bruce_ventura

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May 22, 2011
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Ventura CA
Which long range scopes would I recommend at $1,000 or less? I don't have a long list because I don't comment on scopes I haven't personally evaluated, and I haven't evaluated everything out there.

I would recommend you consider Burris MTAC and XTR scopes. Both are high contrast SFP scopes. MTAC is AO, while XTR is SF. You may have to give up FFP if you want high contrast. Consider this: if you have enough time to range a target and calculate wind holdoff, you have enough time to adjust magnification. It's really a matter of training yourself to do it reliably.
 

emn83

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Feb 11, 2012
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east Iron Range, Minnesota
just reread the specs on the Viper....only 65 MOA of elevation.....That may be a deal breaker for me, I like everything else on it better, but that little elevation concerns me. not sure if that will be enough to get me out to 1000.....the 100 on the SIII gives me a lot more margin of error, especially with my 20 MOA base.....I don't know, am I making too big a deal of this?
 

Browninglover1

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Northern Utah
I had looked at the Burris, but they are MIL based scopes in those two, and I want a MOA based scope. Thanks though
The XTR's are MOA. They have a Ballistic Mil Dot Reticle that has Mil Dots on both sides and top, but a BDC style reticle on the bottom post. The reticle is actually pretty sweet, it allows me to shoot out to 700 yards with my 300 WSM without dialing.

If you want to range with a reticle that has 1 or 2 MOA increments then I can see where's it's a deal breaker for you.

I have a Sightron SIII and can attest to what Bruce has said about glare. I'm used to shooting Burris Black Diamonds, and the SIII simply doesn't perform well in certain lighting conditions. I love my SIII and will buy another, but when he talks about glare issues he knows what he's talking about.

I've also owned a Viper and shot 2 or 3 additional Viper PST's and HS's and they are all have a lot smaller eyebox than my Sightron. I would buy a Vortex PST only if I found a great deal on a used one, if I was spending full price it would be a SIII for sure.
 

Txhillbilly

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Jan 20, 2010
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A little south of Cowtown
I have 4 SIII scopes-2/LRMD,2/MOA-2 reticles.In all of the shooting that I've done with these scopes,I have never had any glare/contrast issues worse than any other scope that I use.
While Zero stops are nice,I find the glass in the Viper PST isn't near the clarity of the Sightrons,and FFP doesn't really matter to me.My Swaro's are FFP and I like them,but I actually like shooting SFP scopes more for target shooting or hunting.
For the price,I find the Sightron SIII hard to beat.
 

kraig

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Jul 9, 2010
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Georgia
Lots of good thoughts so far. I'm in the same boat...looking real close at a SIII or a Viper PST. I had also looked very close at the Weaver Tactical too.

Has anyone also compared one of the counter sniper scopes in this mix?
Counter Sniper Optics [Online Catalog - 3/25-56 Weapon Mountable Optical Gunsights]

or

Counter Sniper Optics [Online Catalog - 10/40-56 35 mm Weapon Mountable Optical Gunsights]

I think I might like the reticle enough to look closer at these even though they aren't MOA scopes. Saw one on a savage and the seller compared it to his SIII also.

What say those who might have used them. I'm very interested in the contrast because that is what helps in the shade of a tree, early morning, late evening shooting.
 

Txhillbilly

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Jan 20, 2010
Messages
142
Location
A little south of Cowtown
Lots of good thoughts so far. I'm in the same boat...looking real close at a SIII or a Viper PST. I had also looked very close at the Weaver Tactical too.

Has anyone also compared one of the counter sniper scopes in this mix?
Counter Sniper Optics [Online Catalog - 3/25-56 Weapon Mountable Optical Gunsights]

or

Counter Sniper Optics [Online Catalog - 10/40-56 35 mm Weapon Mountable Optical Gunsights]

I think I might like the reticle enough to look closer at these even though they aren't MOA scopes. Saw one on a savage and the seller compared it to his SIII also.

What say those who might have used them. I'm very interested in the contrast because that is what helps in the shade of a tree, early morning, late evening shooting.
The Weaver Tactical and Super Slam models are nice optics.I wouldn't give the Counter Sniper scope the time of day.Cheap Chinese crap.
 

bigngreen

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Nov 24, 2008
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7,706
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SW Montana
This is a tough one, basically the two most popular optics at this price point, the Burris XTR never made it past the initial fondling for me for a long range hunting optic good glass is only one part of the long range optic and for me lower on the list. Turrets and reticle are on the top of the list, deer and elk are easy to see and I don't really need ultra glass but I absolutely require good turrets with zero stop which the Vortex has but for ELR I have time to look at the turret and think but I'll be tying on 60 70 plus MOA and I need to see smaller targets and the SIII has been great for this. Shooting antelope last weekend out to 1200 yards both the Vortex and the SIII were stellar, never had any of these contrast or glare issues despite a clear MT day!!! Good luck choosing :D
 

barnesuser28

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Mar 2, 2012
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2,816
Location
ND
Shooting antelope last weekend out to 1200 yards both the Vortex and the SIII were stellar, never had any of these contrast or glare issues despite a clear MT day!!! Good luck choosing :D
Hey bigngreen remember, it didnt happen without pictures. :D gun) what cartridges were you using? PM me if you'd like.
 

kraig

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Joined
Jul 9, 2010
Messages
71
Location
Georgia
Lots of good thoughts so far. I'm in the same boat...looking real close at a SIII or a Viper PST. I had also looked very close at the Weaver Tactical too.

Has anyone also compared one of the counter sniper scopes in this mix?
Counter Sniper Optics [Online Catalog - 3/25-56 Weapon Mountable Optical Gunsights]

or

Counter Sniper Optics [Online Catalog - 10/40-56 35 mm Weapon Mountable Optical Gunsights]

I think I might like the reticle enough to look closer at these even though they aren't MOA scopes. Saw one on a savage and the seller compared it to his SIII also.

What say those who might have used them. I'm very interested in the contrast because that is what helps in the shade of a tree, early morning, late evening shooting.
WELL UPON FURTHER RESEARCH... I don't think counter sniper is even an option. Just to many "odd" things about them to really consider.
Counter Sniper scopes Review/Test - Sniper's Hide Forums

And other reviews aren't any better. Sorry guys...newbie and first time "higher end" scope buyer wo/enough money to make a mistake. I'm really leaning towards use what I have for day time shooting and wait to get the best for when it counts (mostly early morning and late afternoon shooting)
 

Jordan Smith

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Mar 12, 2012
Messages
214
Location
Calgary, AB
I went through this exact decision a few months ago, and I ended up going with the Viper PST 6-24x50 FFP MOA. Glad I did. I love the FFP for wind hold-off at any magnification, ranging, etc, and the ZS and IR are nice features. The IR on the PST is great. Even on max brightness, it's very serviceable at twilight.

The 65MOA that is listed in the specs turned out to be 69MOA in my particular scope. With a 20MOA base and Burris Sig rings with the "10" inserts in front and rear, I have plenty of elevation to reach well beyond 1000 yards with my .243AI. The adjustments measured dead-on accurate and repeatable on my optical grid.

The optics are crystal clear until you get to over 20x, and then they are still very good, but not Zeiss/Swaro good. To give you an idea, on 6x my PST is brighter, and has better resolution than my FX3 6x42, which is an amazing optical device for the price.

I would suggest that the SIII may be better for formal competition, but to me the PST seems like a better do-it-all, hunting/tactical/competition scope.
 

Ridgerunner665

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Joined
Sep 15, 2008
Messages
553
At 2,600 fps muzzle velocity (just a guess, seems reasonable for a 308, I've never loaded the 185's)...you'll only need appx. 33 MOA of adjustment...you said you had a 15 MOA rail...the Viper will do the job.
 

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