Sendero barrel vs. custom barrels... worth the upgrade $ ??

[P KUNDA]

There are few

I'm not too sure how people are getting there info whether custom barrels are more accurate than sendero barrels. My sendero sfII shoots in the .2's consistently with berger vld's. My buddy's shoots in the .3's. How much better than that can you get for a $1000.00 gun. A barrel and chamber can get close to that.

,,,,,,,,


and too far in between. For $1000 it's owesome. For a strange reason people/rifles always shoot better while in the pub. Put them on the line and for some strange unexplicable reason they can't produce the same magic groups ever again.


Peter

 

[Lightvarmint]

My .02.

Shoot both barrels 500 times and then video them. You will be surprised that any barrel that is fire-cracked (both will be) will shoot well for a while. They do!

We have been randomly playing around with factory Remington rilfes for a couple of years. It started out as an attempt to see how thriftly we could get satisfactory performance. So far we have tuned new ones and used ones. To date, each and every one shot under .3 using tuned factory ammo. The only thing we did to the ammo was change the seating depth and boy what insight it was.

Using handloads with the sendero rifles, we got all the senderos under .2 except for one finnicky used one that remained stubborn at .375 (rifle bought used and had an unknown number of shots down the tube).

The point is if you are going to compete against fellow shooters that are using custom barrels, then you probably need one to stay competitive. However, if you are hunting and you are the adventurous type, you could tune a sendero to shoot better than most shooters are capable of shooting. Not to mention saving some bucks for gas and to go on some exclusive hunts.

All my guns are custom guns with custom barrels........... Except for one. It is a 24" Sendero Special 300 win mag with a muzzle brake that cost under $600.

Had I known that the Senderos would shoot so good when properly tuned ammo is used, I could have saved myself:

$12,000 on custom barrels alone.

$16,000+ on four custom long range rifles.

$7500 on scopes

I have probably spent way over 40K designing cases and generally tinkering around with stuff trying to squeeze all the juice out of cartridges and custom offerings in the last six years. If I could keep the knowledge I have and then hit rewind, I would buy factory senderos and bed them followed by good load developemnt and then go hunting.

Now, if you want a switch-barrelled gun then going with the custom action is a must. But after you factor in the cost of a custom barrel, chamer, crown and barrel threading, then you could have bought almost another sendero.

Lastly, if you are desiring a case that the remington action does not offer a bolt size to fit, then go the custom route. And, if you go the custom route, get a custom action that is more than just a remington clone that accepts remington parts. Get one that has some mass to it (A Bat would be my choice) and that is a custom action from the ground up. Also, if you decide to use a bullet that a sendero twist will not stabilize, then go the custom route as well.

But, I did have a good time tinkering with all that stuff.

James

 

[GABR13L]

Hmmmmm very interesting post - thanks a lot for stuff to think over

 

[jpruitt]

jpruitt, where are you in MS man? I looked on the map and it said you were near Starkville too... is that right or is the map bugged?

Gabe...... I am in Starkville also!!!!!!! We should get together and grab some coffee or something and maybe do some shooting some time... Jim

 

[GABR13L]

Yeh man, I posted on your "Member Introductions" thread holler back there

 

[cross]

The only way my new SFII 7Rem Mag will put Bergers in .2s is if I start measuring my group size in feet!

 

[Lightvarmint]

The only way my new SFII 7Rem Mag will put Bergers in .2s is if I start measuring my group size in feet!

Switch bullets and change seating depth. Clean the gun and get all the copper out, get the trigger tuned, bed the action, use a mirage shade and install a different scope that is known to be accurate. Do these one at a time and you may find that one helps. There are other things to do as well, but it is after all the above.

James

 

[johnnyk]

I agree with LightVarmint. I owned a 7Mag Sendero that I shot about 1200 rds through. I got rid of it because the barrel was heat cracked and was getting hard to clean. 20-30 patches! The last time I shot it before trading it in, it shot the 150gn Scirocco into .2".
I swapped it for a 700P in 7Mag . I talked with the previous owner and he said he only shot about 3 box of factory fodder with it. The first loads I put down the barrel were some of the 150gn Scirocco's made for the previous Sendero. I had to seat the bullet a little deeper in the case because the throat wasn't burnt out on the newer rifle. It shot them into about .3" if I remember correctly.
I decided to try the 168gn Berger VLD and that through me for a loop. I tried several different loads with 4-5 powders and a couple of primers. It shot good once and I couldn't duplicate it again so I gave up on the Bergers and went to the 150gn Ballistic Tips. It put three bullets in the same hole! Usually takes 5-10 patches to clean'er up.
I also have a .25-06 Sendero SF that loves 115gn VLD Bergers! and 100gn NBT's and 75gn Sierra HP's. Fixing to try some 115gn NBT's and see what's what. It usually takes about 3-4 patches to clean this $25.00 Remington factory barrel. Very smooth.
Never bedded any of mine other than torqueing them to 65in/lbs. I do tweak the triggers and tailor all my handloads. Always get the best glass you can afford. Enjoy that barrel till it goes south, if it ever does! JohnnyK.

 

[Lightvarmint]

I agree with LightVarmint. I owned a 7Mag Sendero that I shot about 1200 rds through. I got rid of it because the barrel was heat cracked and was getting hard to clean. 20-30 patches! The last time I shot it before trading it in, it shot the 150gn Scirocco into .2".
I swapped it for a 700P in 7Mag . I talked with the previous owner and he said he only shot about 3 box of factory fodder with it. The first loads I put down the barrel were some of the 150gn Scirocco's made for the previous Sendero. I had to seat the bullet a little deeper in the case because the throat wasn't burnt out on the newer rifle. It shot them into about .3" if I remember correctly.
I decided to try the 168gn Berger VLD and that through me for a loop. I tried several different loads with 4-5 powders and a couple of primers. It shot good once and I couldn't duplicate it again so I gave up on the Bergers and went to the 150gn Ballistic Tips. It put three bullets in the same hole! Usually takes 5-10 patches to clean'er up.
I also have a .25-06 Sendero SF that loves 115gn VLD Bergers! and 100gn NBT's and 75gn Sierra HP's. Fixing to try some 115gn NBT's and see what's what. It usually takes about 3-4 patches to clean this $25.00 Remington factory barrel. Very smooth.
Never bedded any of mine other than torqueing them to 65in/lbs. I do tweak the triggers and tailor all my handloads. Always get the best glass you can afford. Enjoy that barrel till it goes south, if it ever does! JohnnyK.

Exactly what he just said!

James

 

[stifle]

Test It Test It

I think when you buy a factory rifle you just get lucky sometimes. A buddy of mine is shooting 1/4 moa with his 223 (I have seen it) and I finished putting together the components of a factory sendero 300 rum that will shoot lights out every time. \(look on gun pics 300 rum shooting nice) This sendero cleans like a dream to. Foam it leave it and rum 2 patches through it and its clean as a whistle. I have over 250 rounds through this RUM and it just seams to be getting better.
In my opinion unless you get some trigger time on that rifle and see the results for yourself you might be throwing away money. Sometimes the remington boys can get it right.
Ron

 

[johnnyk]

Gab,
He's right...test it first. Case in point. I found a Winchester 70 SA (Heavy Varmint) in .243 setting in a local gun shop about a week ago. I looked it over for a few minutes. Seemed to be in pretty darn good condition. The jewelling was still sharp on the bolt and the only scuffs or marks I could find on it was on the barrel where it sat in a gun cabinet.
The gun shop owner had $700 marked on the tag. It had an old glossy Burris 6x18 with Weaver rings and mounts. I asked and he said he would let just the rifle go for $500! It just so happened that the previous owner was standing right beside me as I was admiring it. He was there checking out some AR15's. During the conversation he said he hadn't shot it much, it was very accurate and just decided to move on to something else. Now I know that accuracy is subjective, but I had to take that chance.
I went back and bought it yesterday. Got it home and cleaned the barrel. Took about 10 patches to get the carbon and copper out and another five to lay down a fine coat of oil (Kroil/Marvel Mystery combo) and whipe that out. Turned trigger down to 2.25lbs, checked bedding and re-assembled. Loaded some old 85gn HP (Match) Winchester bullets in front of IMR4831 with CCI BR2's. Charges were 41.5gns thru 44.5gns. Best group was .267" (44.5) and all the rest were under .5". She's a keeper! JohnnyK.

 

[su37]

"I have and then hit rewind, I would buy factory senderos and bed them followed by good load developemnt and then go hunting."


Bingo! I could not agree more and mirror's my own experience.

 

[Niles Coyote]

Ive had three remington's over the years, one was a sendero and the other two are heavy barreled varmints. All were able to shoot 1" at 100 on a bad day (for me) on a good day Ive shot these under 1/2" (five shot groups). This is all with reloads that I have tuned to the rifle. My advise is to shoot the rifle with the barrel that is on it. Put money into your optics, so many people use cheep optics and dont understand why they are not getting the tight consistent groups that others talk about.

After you burn that factory barrel to the point that it will no longer hold the groups it use to, then get your custom barrel. just my 2cents....

 

[was21]

My recommend is to shoot the factory barrel first and if it does what you want....
be happy! You will also learn a few things about the gun that you might also want to change if you decide to go with the custom barrel.
The customs [if properly installed] should pick you up some accuracy, and usually always, as previously noted in other posts, be much easier to clean.

The other benifit that hasn't been mentioned is that in my experience you will pick up velocity gains[maybe 100-150fps ] over a factory barrel of the same length.
I have a 20" 308 Kreiger barrel that actually shoots 40-50 fps better than 2 other 26"
barreled factory tubes with the same load. A definite added bonus and a much handier piece in the woods.
FWIW
Wes in AZ