Seating force difference between Badlands BD2 and ELD-M

[mbeavers1]

I have been trying to work up a load with a 150gr Badlands BD2 - unsuccessfully I may add. I seat with an arbor press w/ force pack and a Wilson inline die. I have always thought the seating forces were erratic and much higher than I'm used to with my Berger 6mm bullets, but chalked it up to the difference between in calibers.

Tonight I loaded a ladder of the BD2s and a ladder with 162gr ELD-m. The brass prepped EXACTLY the same: annealed, sized, tumbled, neck lubed w One shot, mandreled, deburr/chamfer, and primed. The seating force of the BD2s was almost double the ELDMs. BD2 running almost 80lbs and ELDMs only 45 lbs. For reference my 6mm Bergers seat with between 33 and 37lbs depending on lot #.

I measured the OD of the bearing surfaces on both to make sure neck tension was the same. Both run between .283" and .284". Bullet to bullet distribution between both similar. Also measured loaded necks of both. Both were 0.315-.3155". Seems neck tension very similar.

Only thing left I can think of is the surface finish. The BD2 is a dull copper and seems softer (seater leaves a ring on the nose) while the ELDM is more polished and harder (less ring after seating).



This seems strange to anyone else and any ideas why?

 

[Wedgy]

The SBD's are lathe cut and have very small grooves/ridges from the cutter that are perpendicular to the case mouth and are probably binding a bit. Maybe try a steeper chamfer angle on your case mouth or a lube of some sort.

 

[MagnumManiac]

I would guess the pressure ring is causing the variance and more resistance on the BD2.
I had the same issue in 338 using a 300g Sierra against a 285g Nosler, however, groups were not affected.

Cheers.

 

[Mike D Texas]

The SBD's are lathe cut and have very small grooves/ridges from the cutter that are perpendicular to the case mouth and are probably binding a bit. Maybe try a steeper chamfer angle on your case mouth or a lube of some sort.

Yep. I usually open up the neck an additional .0005 to .001 with a mandrel on all lathe turned copper projectiles.

 

[Dmagna]

Compressed load?

 

[Phil Rizzo]

Just pay attention to the target, and make changes based on results.

 

[BillLarson]

There is an extensive thread on this site regarding loading BADLANDS BULLETS.....
ON A COMPARISON LIKE YOUR DOING.....
you gotta make sure all internal necks are the same..... in size, finish and lube if your using it...
Just suspecting....with BD2`s being machined they would have less friction being they are machined...????

 

[Mark37082]

It sounds like you are doing extensive prep prior to seating. I don't have a pressure gauge on my press, but experienced similar issues with the BDII. I also ran into fairly significant seating depth issues as the ogive contacted the lands much quicker (requiring much deeper seating and less powder capacity).

 

[Mikecr]

Cleaning the bullets could make a difference.

 

[Rosebud]

That's a long bullet. long bearing surface . Have you run out of twist for the Badlands ? Said you are having issues! So, twist rate.

 

[mbeavers1]

Just pay attention to the target, and make changes based on results.

Yea, that's what's sent me down this road. Results haven't been great. I've been down the neck tension road before, buying custom mandrels from 21st Century and using Gage pins to measure.

 

[mbeavers1]

That's a long bullet. long bearing surface . Have you run out of twist for the Badlands ? Said you are having issues! So, twist rate.

Min per website is 8.5tw and I have an 8. Holes are concentric so doesn't seem to be a stability issue.

 

[mbeavers1]

It sounds like you are doing extensive prep prior to seating. I don't have a pressure gauge on my press, but experienced similar issues with the BDII. I also ran into fairly significant seating depth issues as the ogive contacted the lands much quicker (requiring much deeper seating and less powder capacity).

Yes, they are long. I measured to lands using them and seated accordingly. I'm able to hit pressure before running out of case capacity.

 

[mbeavers1]

There is an extensive thread on this site regarding loading BADLANDS BULLETS.....
ON A COMPARISON LIKE YOUR DOING.....
you gotta make sure all internal necks are the same..... in size, finish and lube if your using it...
Just suspecting....with BD2`s being machined they would have less friction being they are machined...????

I will go back to that thread. Most of what I saw in there was terminal performance stuff. I assume you mean this one:

"Badlands Precision Bullets thread - From BC to terminal ballistics"