hunter ethics, were have they gone?

[huntinfool18]

I just wanted to share a little experience I had this past week. I was hunting here in Wyoming with some good friends. We had permission to hunt some privite land which part was a large field with fresh cut grass. On the side of the field there was a small mound of dirt which is were we parked our truck to set up. One night as we were sitting there I look behind us and 2 other hunters were walking out in the middle of the field firming prime time and sat down in a small ditch. About 15 mins later 3 whitetail does come out along a fence on the far side of the field about 550 yds from me and 300 from the other hunters. Well as soon as the first Doe jumped into the field the shooting started from the hunters in the field. First shot hit about 3 feet low in front of the deer, next shot missed, didn't see were. The Doe is ready to jump back over the fence by now, 3rd shot hits the Doe in the back leg breaking it and is flopping around. She stands at the fence for a few seconds and then jumps the fence. 4th and 5th shots miss. The 2 hunters go and look to see if they hit the deer, after about 5 mins give up looking and go back to sit in the ditch. After about 10 more mins I walk out right in front of those 2 hunter across the field and track the Doe down, finding it and finish it off about 100 yds away from were the other 2 stopped looking.
Fast forward 2 days later. Same field. We pull into the field right before dark to pick up one of our crew that we dropped off a few hours earlier. As we pull in we notice a herd of about 8-10 mule deer does and fawns. Pulling in further we notice the same 2 hunters in the field in the same spot in the ditch. The deer about 200 -250 yds this time. About 5 mins later the shooting begins. Short story 5-6 shots later 1 deer on the ground and who knows how many wounded. The next night we pull into the field at the same time as these hunters, which already have 2 deer in the back of there truck from earlier that day. Come to find out it was a forum member a lot of guys might have a lot of respect for on here. I walk up to him shake his hand and ask if that was them sitting in the field, it was and he was well aware he hit that Doe I tracked down. All he said is yes I have a chunk of bone in my truck and asked if I found her. I said yes. As he was walking away he all he says is enjoy eating her. I just got to thinking about how different people are with there made up "internet" person and the person they are in real life. Were have all the ethics and respect gone for your fellow hunter and the animal you are hunting???

 

[Broz]

Disgusting, to say the least. Yet they wish to act as if they are real hunters.

Jeff

 

[Joe King]

I agree, If your going to shoot you have an obligation to make **** sure you either hit or missed, if you hit you had best put every effort into putting that wounded animal down. I realize that every once in a while you'll run into a critter that defies the odds and you end up loosing it, but to to just go take a gaze without putting out any real effort?

 

[bigngreen]

We all screw up at sometime but how we deal with that will be what determines what our actual intentions are, far more than when everything goes right.
I know the mantra of my ethics are my own is prevalent here but a persons personal ethics in the field reflects on us as a whole.
I kinda wonder if we skirt talking about this issue we have caused more harm than good, maybe!!

Kudos for taking that doe on your tag, I would have called the game warden and turned them in for abandoning game!!!!

 

[Tikkamike]

Ill just clear the air here. That was me. I was taking a guy out who had never hunted before We got to the fields and there was a truck pointing east with people sitting in it so assuming they were hunting the east field so we took the south one which was better anyway with an inexperienced hunter. The deer came out and he got super excited and just started firing away, I had told him to take his time and not to get too excited but as you know sometimes the shooting gets wild. we went and looked for the deer found the chunk of bone and and found a blood trail that was not very good, so I told him we would give her a few hours and come back later in the night hopefully she would bed down and not be able to get back up. So we went back to the ditch to see if more came out as we had a lot of tags to fill. Thats when Ryan (huntinfool18) walked across the field and i heard them shoot a couple times so I knew what they went and killed so we left. The next day was spent at the range to verify the guys gun and do a little training. then we went out again. This time the mule deer came out I was spotting his shots (4 of them ) and they were all low misses but one. He did finally get one. So yeah things got a little out of control but when an new and excited hunter is on the trigger its hard or impossible to control them. I have been spending a lot of time with him at the range and he does well on paper but that "deer fever" gets to him badly. Later that week when I saw Ryan and he was questioning me I was friendly in spite of the line of very pointed questioning I was getting. He said he killed her which I knew he had what else am I to say? so i went with "enjoy it" The situation wasnt ideal but I guess its the only way for the guy to learn. I have hunted with Ryan before and I think we both know things dont always go as planned do they? I know I will catch a lot of flak for it but its what happened.

 

[barnesuser28]

I once gut shot a mule deer doe with my bow, we tracked that doe 2 miles in 2-3' snow so i could get another shot in her, got within 10 yards and i put another arrow into her lungs, she was down within a minute. I am not proud of that shot but i am proud that we kept on her. Kudos to you for ending that animal as quickly and humanly possible.

 

[edge]

There is a reason ethics are personal!

I respect the author for not mentioning the members name in the story.

Now personally I certainly would have handled it differently!
IMO, the author had no business looking for the other hunters animal without their consent!
If I made a shot that I felt warranted letting the animal lay down for a few hours that should be my choice as the shooter!

Perhaps they found guts and wanted to wait, so why not go over to the hunters to and let them know that you were sure it was only a leg hit and wanted to help them track it?
If they told you they were going back after the deer had time to bed then that first story was basically un needed, IMO.
I would always appreciate the help in tracking.
By going there without the other hunters you are in effect stealing their game that they legally shot.

Once again when we discuss ethics it almost always turns out badly!

edge.

 

[huntinfool18]

Things do happen for sure, and happen to the best of us. I mean hell I've made some bad shots, but I always track the animals until I find them or if I don't I rip up my tag. Mike even tho you didn't pull the trigger you were the "guide" and have hunted and taken more animals then most people well take on their entire lifes. You should have stepped up and set the example to the guy you were with that has never hunted before. Like I said it happens, in this case it wasn't taken care of properly.

 

[Hunter2678]

All we can hope for is that the new hunter in this case learned a few valuable lessons..main one being its alot easier to be patient & make the first shot count than to get trigger happy and hope for the best. I would've drove that concept home to the newbie time and again leading up to the hunt if I were the guide as well.

 

[Korhil78]

How is anyone going to control the mind of another hunter when they get excited? Especially a new hunter? He said that he has been working with him at the range and trying to get his nerves to calm down. You can try to talk the new hunter through it while he is shooting but you can't control him. I'm sure Mike was pretty upset in his own mind while the guy was shooting? I mean what are you going to do? Grab the gun from the guy while he is shooting? I am sure a lot of things were going through mikes mind and I am sure that he was about to pull his own hair out. But put yourself in that place. Would you have yanked that gun out of some new guys hands in the heat of the moment? I bet you would have let him keep shooting like mike did.

Huntinfool it's kinda messed up that you get on here bashing mike about his Internet self and his real self. I have talked with mike quite a bit and you know as well as I do that he knows what he is doing in the hunting department. I have also never read one comment where he has been bragging on himself. He post pics of his kills and has a good time talking about them. Not once has he ever got on here saying that he can teach someone to hunt better than anyone on here.

Just try to put yourself in that difficult situation where you have tried to prepare the guy for the hunt by going to the range and coaching him. Then he gets deer fever and starts slapping shots all over. I bet anyone on here would have kept letting the guy shoot while pulling your hair out.

I would have also let the deer have time to die too.

 

[Outlaw6.0]

I find it intriguing how different perspectives of a situation can change a persons feelings & understand if said situation. First post, i'm thinking "that durty bastard", after composing myself & reading the facts......
These are the type of discussions I think we can all benefit from, IF we can keep it civil. It is also THE reason I have what I have in my signature line. Like Mike, I "guide" every year, at least 3 shooters, sometimes 4 or 5 before I get to hunt myself (my choice). People in this position get to see a LOT of different scenarios play out & not all of them are purdy. But it is from this experience that we draw the knowledge to make decisions like Mike's, & I fully agree with his assessment of the situation. If/when my "dudes" make a bad shot, we wait; Why? Because I've spent enough time chasing critters pumped full of adrenaline all over gods creation to know better. Give them time & more often than not they will sicken up & bed giving my "dude" time to calm the heck down & put some meat in the freezer. Maybe i'm lucky, but in the half dozen years or so, I haven't lost an animal that I can remember...

Was this particular scenario perfectly played? Maybe not, then again, show me ANY situation that can't be improved upon in hindsight. With any luck we can all learn a few valuable lessons from this experience.


t

 

[MachV]

Ethics are a big grey area and keeping it civil is the only way to keep this from being deleted. Lets learn something constructive from this!!
Not posting names (even though we had a good idea who it was) was a good start and Mikes steping up to the plate and posting in a civil mannor was a good finish.
I'd like to think I would have hunted somewhere else instead of putting myself in someone elses hunt and that I would have talked to Mike before going after that doe but I was not there so to say they where in the wrong is only 20/20 hindsight IMHO

 

[huntinfool18]

My issue isn't having a new hunter in the field. That's great. It's that they literally track that deer about 5 yards. And gave up on it and clearly left it to rot. Any hunter would have stayed in the field that night and made sure the deer was takin care of instead of assuming that someone finished your job and tagged your deer. You can say I'm bashing mike, I didn't mention any names in my post out of respect for mike . And I have respect for mike for owning up to his mistakes.

 

[Tikkamike]

For the record i dont feel i made any mistakes. I wasnt leaving it to rot i was leaving it to bed and die from a bad shot rather than push it further