Full Length resize

cgarb

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Why do die manufacturer's put the resizer ball on the end of the rod by the decapping pin? Im getting neck runout issues probably due to the fact that the case is unsupported when it sizes the neck. I have to full length size for this gun. Is there anything I can do to help this?
 

4xforfun

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Yes...throw your die away, along with the expander ball and get a bushing die. I don't even own a die with an expander ball any more. Redding type "S" all around!!!
 

ohiohunter

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Try floating the rod. Get some rubber washers and put them on the rod at its anchor point. This should give your rod some wiggle room to come out straight instead of pulling to one side or the other.

I've never quite digested the neck sizing w/out the ball. I've done it both ways but it looks to me the ball makes sure the inside is round in the event there are any dents or dings. Again I'll reference the top local f-class shooters here all use the ball and full length size.

Other than "over working" the brass what are the advantages to just neck sizing, removing the ball, etc... We all know brass isn't going to last forever but 100pc of brass for one hunting rifle should last the avg joe a long time.

Also the quality of your dies and press will effect run out.
 

4xforfun

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Where did "just neck size" come from?

You can get bushing dies in FL or neck.

I don't worry about small dents in the neck. If they get on the bigger side I use an expander mandrel to iron them out.
 

ohiohunter

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Where did "just neck size" come from?

You can get bushing dies in FL or neck.

I don't worry about small dents in the neck. If they get on the bigger side I use an expander mandrel to iron them out.

Some guys do.

Dents in the neck would most certainly effect neck tension. Variation in neck tension= variation in pressure which could lead to inaccuracy to a noticeable degree.

Speaking of mandrels I like the idea, but getting them honed and all that other complicated stuff has kept me at bay.
 

Barrelnut

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Both good points. The expander ball does have a job to do. As it is pulled back put of the case neck, I pushes any dings outward and rounds the neck mouth if it is oval or egg shaped for some reason. But if the neck is in good shape and round, you can use a bushing die to size the neck on the down stroke without an expander ball to iron it out on the up stroke. I have started doing this and it does improve runout.

Another option that helps is to remove the decaping pin and use a seperate decaping die for that. Then use the expander ball, but loosen it on the decaping rod about one turn. This allows the ball to free float more and helps with the runout. It is not as perfect a no ball at all though, since the neck dragging on one side of the ball more than the other contributes to the run out also. Lubing the inside of the neck seems to help there, but then I have lube inside the neck. Yuck!
 

4xforfun

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Some guys do.

Dents in the neck would most certainly effect neck tension. Variation in neck tension= variation in pressure which could lead to inaccuracy to a noticeable degree.

Speaking of mandrels I like the idea, but getting them honed and all that other complicated stuff has kept me at bay.

Dents in the neck would AFFECT neck tension. LOL I said I don't worry about SMALL dents.

Sinclair Int has them in stock in every calaiber. No honing required.
 
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philipbrousseau

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the forster sizer dies have neck expander ball at a location on the de-cap rod that starts into the case neck before it is out of the neck sizing portion of the die. these are my favorite fl sizers. you can buy just the sizing die from sinclair instead of the set. also i use graphite dry lube on the necks inside and out. get a 35 mm film container and put birdshot and graphite powder in it and insert just tha nk of the case to lube it. i lube the sides of the case with imperial sizing die wax on my fingers.it only takes a small amount. to much die lube dents cases.
 

rcoody

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the forster sizer dies have neck expander ball at a location on the de-cap rod that starts into the case neck before it is out of the neck sizing portion of the die. these are my favorite fl sizers. you can buy just the sizing die from sinclair instead of the set. also i use graphite dry lube on the necks inside and out. get a 35 mm film container and put birdshot and graphite powder in it and insert just tha nk of the case to lube it. i lube the sides of the case with imperial sizing die wax on my fingers.it only takes a small amount. to much die lube dents cases.

that is what I use. The instructions that come with the die show the location for the expander ball very well.

CutawayDie_FLS_thm.jpg
 

ohiohunter

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Some guys do.

Dents in the neck would most certainly affect neck tension. Variation in neck tension= variation in pressure which could lead to inaccuracy to a noticeable degree.

Speaking of mandrels I like the idea, but getting them honed and all that other complicated stuff has kept me at bay.

Dents in the neck would AFFECT neck tension. Dents in the neck would create and adverse EFFECT. LOL I said I don't worry about SMALL dents.

Sinclair Int has them in stock in every calaiber. No honing required.


My bad prof. :D

I know they do but to get the size you want aka desired neck tension you'll have to size your own.
 

4xforfun

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My bad prof. :D

I know they do but to get the size you want aka desired neck tension you'll have to size your own.

No, you iron out the dents on the inside of the case necks with the mandrel and then size to taste as normal with the proper bushing. The mandrel should expand them enough so that your sizing die will squeeze them back down. The expander mandrel fits in it's own holder....not in the reloading die. I don't bother with the mandrel unless the case mouths get dented...like ejecting cases with thin necks in a 1k match that has a concrete floor and your brass misses the brass catcher. I cringe every time it happens!! :D

The mandrels I use are more for neck turning. They come in two sizes for each caliber...an "E" expander mandrel and a "T" turning mandrel. The "E" is slightly oversized so that when you are turning necks the brass doesn't fit so tightly on the "T" mandrel, which makes a pile of heat due to friction. Also, the mandrels have a very gental slope to them so that it is easy on the brass. I also use them when creating false shoulders on new brass for a wildcat....like the dasher. Run the .257 "E" mandrel into a 6mm BR brass, then neck it down the proper amount with your regular realoding die and POOF...instant false shoulder.

http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadi...ber-expander-mandrels-prod33871.aspx?psize=96
 
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SidecarFlip

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Why do die manufacturer's put the resizer ball on the end of the rod by the decapping pin? Im getting neck runout issues probably due to the fact that the case is unsupported when it sizes the neck. I have to full length size for this gun. Is there anything I can do to help this?

Every die I've ever used / seen, the expander ball is threaded on the stem so move it up and add an 'o' ring under the nut to allow lateral movement. Better yrt, loose the NS fie and get a FL sizer, preferrably a busing sizer. NS dies ate fine for a semi-automatic, thats aboutit.
 

SidecarFlip

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Not at all. Semi auto chambers and actions are much looser than a bolt gun to allow rapid ejection and loading whereas a bolt gun has a much closer tolerance and requites FL resizing (among other things) to operate correctly and attain repetitive accuracy.

I don't own one NS die. Wait a minute I do, For my Ruger Mini 14 223 semi auto.

Haven't shot it in years.
 
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