Find fire solutions WITHOUT electronics?

[RyanTrials]

What would be the best website/book to read to learn long hand ballistic calculation? WITHOUT the help of apps/calculators?

I'd like to eventually get to the point where i don't need to rely on any electronics to get different firing solutions for different temps/humidity/pressure/ranges of course/altitude. I know there are calc forms and charts you can take with you in the field, but id really like to get a better understanding of how they all plug into the forulas and why, etc.

Any info is appreciated!
Happy shooting

Ryan

 

[Rich Coyle]

Huh?

 

[ShtrRdy]

I'm not aware of a closed form solution to a ballistic problem. Even the Ballistic Coefficient that we use today is an estimate of the Coefficient of Drag which is a function of velocity at any given moment during the bullets flight.

Your best bet would be to gather D.O.P.E. at various distances and during various conditions with your weapon system.

Another possibility, (if you want to avoid electronics), is looking into the Whiz Wheel.

 

[Jerry M]

Mil-Dot Master may help:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B008WTWKEA/?tag=lrhmag19-20

Good luck

Jerry

 

[Mikecr]

What would be the best website/book to read to learn long hand ballistic calculation?

This would be a library..

 

[ShtrRdy]

Mil-Dot Master may help:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B008WTWKEA/?tag=lrhmag19-20

Good luck

Jerry

The Mil-Dot master is used to estimate range when using a mil reticle. They also have a version for use with a moa reticle. It does not provide a ballistic solution.

 

[Bravo 4]

As suggested, you need to get DOPE for all conditions you want to shoot in and keep it in a data book. You would be setting yourself up for failure trying to use some formula for drops in different conditions. The further the distance to target the more unpredictable your outcomes could be. Wind is a different thing. I think your best bet is to use a ballistic calculator to get your drops and verify everything (trueing if needed). Then print off multiple drop charts for environmental changes you could face. I do this before hitting the field. I too don't like to rely (not solely at least) on technology. If you do then I believe you are setting yourself up for failure. I still carry a map and compass despite having a gps, it's called redundancy...or a backup...or a PACE plan (Primary/Alternate/Contingency/Emergency), some things you need at least the first two.

 

[THEIS]

Hello,

Check the compatibility matrix here and see if they have "slides" for your chosen caliber and ammunition. Adaptive Consulting and Training Services, LLC

The Field Density Altitude Compensator is a manual (non electronic) ballistics calculator.
Adaptive Consulting and Training Services, LLC

THEIS

 

[Bravo 4]

Disclaimer: I am not knocking that product or trying to go against Theis on this.

Those DA cards are good for mid range, but if you aren't using anything electronic (hand held weather station, gps, watch, ballistic calculator, etc) then you are using SWAG for range and conditions. They are generic and will get you close for the most part. Once you get past 600 yards, you will really start noticing the difference. One day (or shooting location) you may be spot on but then the next you may be off enough to cause a miss or worse, a wounded animal.
I have used these, and a mildot master. I had guys on my teams that would buy any and everything to try and make things easier. By easier I usually mean to get out of doing a little work (maybe in this case someone already did the work for you).
I believe that using a ballistic calculator & trueing it with actual drop data and then making your own charts for different conditions is a more accurate way of doing things. Best thing is actual DOPE but that isn't always feasible. Depending on the rifle and intended target, I will usually put masking tape on the elevation turret and make a BDC out to 500-600 yards for quick target engagement. Leave the moa/mil markings exposed for precise and longer target engagements.

 

[THEIS]

Disclaimer: I am not knocking that product or trying to go against Theis on this.

Hello,

Didn't take it that way

You are absolutely correct in regards to the best way is to put the "time in". No amount of electronic or non-electronic support equipment will ever be better than BTDT type of data.
But;
FDAC, Mildot Master and slope doper are great for what they are intended...a backup to BTDT data and electronic firing solution data. They are better than attempting to do the mathematical formulas on a piece of paper with wind and rain

THEIS

 

[Bravo 4]

They are better than attempting to do the mathematical formulas on a piece of paper with wind and rain

THEIS

I concur!

 

[rcoody]

A PhD in physics might be a good start

The basic calculations are pretty easy. It is when you throw in aerodynamic drag calculations for your bullet when it really starts to get interesting. Then density altitude, wind drift, decreasing velocity, etc

All the ballistic calculators really are just mathematical models and not individual calculations. That is why each needs to be tweaked for your specific rifle, bullet, velocity, environment

Extremely complicated

 

[Buffalobob]

It is unclear exactly what the question is but here is something I do for when I do not expect to be using a device to run solutions but do have a rangefinder.
At home weeks before I go hunting I first use google earth to find the altitude of the general area that I plan to hunt. Then either based upon experience hunting that area or googling up Weather Underground almanac, I find the historical average early morning average temperature and the late afternoon temperature, percent humidity, etc for the month I be there and write that data down.
I then take my ballistic calculator and develop a drop chart out to the maximum range I am willing to shoot for ONE SET OF CONDITIONS. That is my baseline.
I then use that same set of conditions except I will make a calculation with the temperature increased by ten degrees and another calculation with the temperature decreased by ten degrees. I check the drop difference from my baseline at 1000 yards. The difference in drop is then the CHANGE @ 1000YDS PER 10 DEGREES. I write that number down.
I then put temperature back to the baseline condition and then make two more calculations one with the altitude increased by 1000 feet and one with the altitude decreased by 1000 feet. I check the drop difference at 1000 yards. The difference from my baseline is then the CHANGE @ 1000 YARDS PER 1000 FEET ELEVATION. I write that number down.
I repeat this process for every variable that has a significant effect on bullet drop and most of the rest really do not matter so much for really fast high BC bullets at ranges under 1000 yards.
I also run uphill angle calculations to see what the drop difference at 1000 yards will be at 10, 20 ,30 degrees and write that down.

I then build a drop chart of my baseline conditions that includes a 10 mph wind. On this drop chart I type in all the CORRECTION FACTORS @ 1000 YARDS AND WHETHER THEY GET ADDED OR SUBTRACTED. It is very easy when you unexpectedly see an animal to shoot to get in a hurry and add instead of subtract and each of the factors can be added or subtracted depending on which way the current conditions are. Obviously if you are shooting at 800 yards instead of 1000 then you ratio out the final correction by 80%.

I do not know if this is actually what you asked or not.

Just so you know - I have one degree in physics and another in engineering and am very fast with mental math --- but trying to do it correctly while watching an animal moving toward the treeline can produce errors