Deer loss from Wolves in Michigans UP.

[Coyboy]

and doesn't challenge their degree from Walt DisneyUniversity.



I like that

 

[Snubbie]

and doesn't challenge their degree from Walt DisneyUniversity.



I like that

So do I. I'm stealing it!

 

[SidecarFlip]

For my se Michigan bro---Why are you blaming the MDNR for the wolf problem? They didn't introduce the friggin things into the UP where they are decimating the moose and deer populations! They came down from Canada just like they did in Wisconsin and Minnesota. Because they were/are on the ES list there hasn't been much that could be done other than killing ones that got into problems with livestock similar to the problems out west. FYI a few DID come across the ice a couple winters ago and have been documented by the DNR down in the Pigeon River Valley in the northeastern LP where our elk herd is located and where the deer have had the TB problems, not down in the Thumb area! Given a few years if they are not eliminated I'll bet the elk will start going down in numbers and it won't be that long until Michigan will no longer have a big enough herd to justify culling through the lottery that we have had for quite a few years.

I would agree that they didn't introduce the wolf but they do control the population by listing it as an ES. I'm not (blaming anyone). I have a problem with artifical control.....

I also agree that the elk herd as it is will decline due to predatory kills by wolves, much like the killing of domesticated livestock. If I had a wolf issue here (where we live and farm), I'd have no problem in dispatching the predator or predators without asking permission of any government entity. Come to think about it, if I had to consult with a government entity everytime I made a decision about farming (and many of those decisions I'm sure come under some sort of legislative or agency mandated hubub), I'd be out of business.

It's all about coexistence and something that legislation should stay out of. Wolves were around long before any politician was and probably will be after politicians cease to exist....

Never hunted in the ELP so the TB, CWD issue is a non-issue for me. We hunt in the WLP north of 46 where healthy deer are in abundance, such abundance in fact that we have extended doe season just to keep the deer from becoming bumper dog food......

The current crop of sub compact plastic cars don't have a prayer with even a yearling....

Driving north on 131 north of Kent County in the fall, can be an exercise in deer dodging in the early evening.....

Where I actually reside, in DMU486, there are few deer so a 'vacation' to the WLP and our property is always welcome, winter, spring (for Morrels) and summer. Here in the SE corner of the state, human population has displaced the deer and the wild dogs have largely taken over, one reason I always carry a short barrelled semi-auto rifle in the farm tractor. Farming isn't just about planting crops.......

Our WLP property has become a haven for poachers and ill mannered hunters and requires regular policing. Lately (this season), I have been noticing a larger number of licensed hunters who are under the impression that having a tag entitles them to hunt on privately held land...without asking permission, something I frown on and discourage progressively and I'll leave it at that....

 

[Topgun 30-06]

The Feds do the ES listing, not the individual states like the MDNR, and they have to work within those ES guidelines. You do have a pretty good population up where you're talking about as I go up through there from Allegan to property I own 10 miles southeast of Kalkaska. We had a good deer population back in 1973 when I bought that land, but it went steadily downhill until just the last few years and now it seems to be coming back a little bit.

 

[SidecarFlip]

The abundant population is obviously well noted by Michigan hunters. I can tell that by the number of poachers this year.

Nothing better than hunting your land and coming upon a tree stand with a stranger in it...... hunting.

Makes for an interesting and quick confrontation as I'm always dual gunned in the woods. Better to be prepared and pro-active.

46 or the Muskegon River is the demarcation line. Where we are, anything that goes bang, whizz or boom works, except rimfire.

I have seen wolf, bear and coyote tracks in the sandy spots in the woods but I've yet to come across any animals, or have I seen any kills attributed to predators other than wild turkeys and there is a raft of them.

 

[jmden]

So do I. I'm stealing it!

Same here. That is a great term to use!

Walt Disney University? I'm going to use that. When they ask where'd I get my degree in return, I can tell 'em I majored in Environmental Science with a minor in Biology and your 'Bambi' mentality shows how little you know about where the abundant wildlife we have enjoyed (past tense...) comes from!

 

[jmden]

I would agree that they didn't introduce the wolf but they do control the population by listing it as an ES. I'm not (blaming anyone). I have a problem with artifical control.....

'Artificial control'---what exactly do you mean by that?

 

[SidecarFlip]

'Artificial control'---what exactly do you mean by that?

I could have worded that better, I guess.

I should have said control by legislative process or mandate. 'Artificial control' is more like 'hot lead'....

We all live in a society where everything that can be 'adjusted' is eventually 'adjusted' by politicians or appointed persons that 'think' they are acting in the best interests of the majority, when, in fact, they aren't.

Life in these times would be a whole lot less complicated with less control. Natural selection is always better than human intervention except in extreme cases and those cases are probably 1% not 100%.