jskmtd
Well-Known Member
Thanks for all the great info. This makes me want to set up a 300 win mag to shoot the 215's. This has been a great learning experience and a fun read.
Comparing the Berger 210 VLD to the 215 Hybrid
- Thread starter Broz
- Start date
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have read this front to back several times, i hope my 30-338 returns from the gunsmith in time to work the load out with the 215gr. my elk hunting trip is in wy. the week of thanksgiving. this is excellant reseach material, hope i can add to its findings.
Broz
Well-Known Member
Whackin and Stackin. Muley down!
I took my friend that shot the bull earlier out to get a Muley. We spotted this buck and I ranged him at 456 yards. I dialed in my 300 Win with the 215 Bergers and got him set up for the shot. The buck was 1/4 facing us at 456 yds. I told him to put it in the front corner of the near shoulder. He took the shot and the buck hit the ground so hard he actually bounced. Then we heard the WHACK return to us. The buck kicked about 3 times while lying there but expired very quickly.
Details on the shot.
Distance 456 yards
impact velocity= 2539 fps
impact energy = 3078 ft lbs
entrance again was .308" angling in through the shoulder and into the chest cavity.
Bullet did not exit. Extreme damage to vitals and all arteries to the heart were severed. Chest cavity FULL of blood. Buck blead out internally and fast.
The pics:
How he fell right where he stood.
Fragmenting damage to vitals
Chest cavity full of internal bleeding.
The hero pic with a nice Muley Buck.
Thoughts on this one.
The angle of the shot made for a hard path to the vitals through the shoulder of a mature buck. This is one, at 456 yards, where if a bullet was going to "explode on impact" from high velocity it should have. But it didn't, it kept right on trucking into the broiler room for a very quick kill. He never knew what hit him. So it seems the closer shots (under 500) with a long angled path to the far side are not likely to exit. But even the thickest bone on the animal will not stop good penetration. The 215 Berger Hybrid has proven itself to me at all distances for me to hunt with. But I do like it better at distances past 600 yards even though it has shown devistating damage and kills up close. For my needs I look for a bullet that will shine at long range, but will still do the job up close. With over 10 big game kills in 12 days and not one problem the 215 Berger will work for me.
In the near future I will be taking my wife to get her elk. She will use this rifle and the 215 Berger. Then I will use it also for my Mule deer as well.
More later,
Jeff
I took my friend that shot the bull earlier out to get a Muley. We spotted this buck and I ranged him at 456 yards. I dialed in my 300 Win with the 215 Bergers and got him set up for the shot. The buck was 1/4 facing us at 456 yds. I told him to put it in the front corner of the near shoulder. He took the shot and the buck hit the ground so hard he actually bounced. Then we heard the WHACK return to us. The buck kicked about 3 times while lying there but expired very quickly.
Details on the shot.
Distance 456 yards
impact velocity= 2539 fps
impact energy = 3078 ft lbs
entrance again was .308" angling in through the shoulder and into the chest cavity.
Bullet did not exit. Extreme damage to vitals and all arteries to the heart were severed. Chest cavity FULL of blood. Buck blead out internally and fast.
The pics:
How he fell right where he stood.
Fragmenting damage to vitals
Chest cavity full of internal bleeding.
The hero pic with a nice Muley Buck.
Thoughts on this one.
The angle of the shot made for a hard path to the vitals through the shoulder of a mature buck. This is one, at 456 yards, where if a bullet was going to "explode on impact" from high velocity it should have. But it didn't, it kept right on trucking into the broiler room for a very quick kill. He never knew what hit him. So it seems the closer shots (under 500) with a long angled path to the far side are not likely to exit. But even the thickest bone on the animal will not stop good penetration. The 215 Berger Hybrid has proven itself to me at all distances for me to hunt with. But I do like it better at distances past 600 yards even though it has shown devistating damage and kills up close. For my needs I look for a bullet that will shine at long range, but will still do the job up close. With over 10 big game kills in 12 days and not one problem the 215 Berger will work for me.
In the near future I will be taking my wife to get her elk. She will use this rifle and the 215 Berger. Then I will use it also for my Mule deer as well.
More later,
Jeff
trebark
Well-Known Member
Broz...thanks as always for your thorough reporting and analysis. Because the bullet did not exit on the muley, do you have any pictures of the bullet or fragments?
Broz
Well-Known Member
Sorry I don't. It took us till after dark to get it drug part way and we got it the rest of the way out this morning. We took it straight to the processor and dropped it off.
Jeff
Broz
Well-Known Member
Add a couple more LR kills to the pile. Took two more antelope today with my 300 win and the 215 Bergers. One at 635 yards and the other at 972 yards. I didn't take pics of the 635. But I did the 972. Both where .308" going in and both exited with large exits. The 635 goat took about 20 steps doing the Berger wobble then fell dead. The 972 goat was down right there and kicked a couple times before expiring. Here are the facts from the 972 and pics.
Distance 972 yards:
Impact velocity was 1996 fps.
impact energy was 1902 ft lbs.
entrance was .308"
exit through the shoulder was close 2"
Exit in shouder:
Close up of exit:
Distance 972 yards:
Impact velocity was 1996 fps.
impact energy was 1902 ft lbs.
entrance was .308"
exit through the shoulder was close 2"
Exit in shouder:
Close up of exit:
RTK
Well-Known Member
You sure are racking them up
trebark
Well-Known Member
Do we have a sufficient body of evidence yet to say that the 215 hybrid is an effective hunting longrange hunting bullet?? 
Broz
Well-Known Member
Do we have a sufficient body of evidence yet to say that the 215 hybrid is an effective hunting longrange hunting bullet??
Well, it is only mid season, And this test media is so tastey I just can't quit.
What I am looking at now is will one fail. But I will admit with 8 antelope, 3 Bull Elk and 2 Deer they have proven worthy to me. 200 yards to 1285 yards. But I will limit the 300 win to 1000 on elk. As it has been said before there is no perfect bullet at all distances. I like this bullet better at 600 plus but it will sure kill effectively at all distances. Just some real carnage at the closer distances. What I need is a poke at a coyote past 1300 yards to see how it does below 1700 fps. But then I would seldome shoot at game past 1300 with a my 300 win. A yote or wolf, you bet.
Jeff
trebark
Well-Known Member
Thanks again for your great report and analysis. It's provided me with sufficient information to potentially make a change for one of my rifles....
http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f53/my-300rum-mcr-70809/#post494570 shoots the 208Amax very accurately and the Amax is devastating on game. Although the RUM has the capability of shooting the 230hybrid really fast, I haven't made the switch because there is sufficient velocity loss with the 230 that the ballistics of the 208 are equal or better than the 230 out to about 1200. Once you get past 1200 the superior BC of the 230 really starts to shine. The problem with that for me is that 1200 is a bit beyond my ability at this point.
With the 215 though, it would provide the awesome BC AND minimal velocity loss AND devastating on game!
Thanks again for all the data points. You have succeeded in digging into my wallet and making MORE money fly out!
http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f53/my-300rum-mcr-70809/#post494570 shoots the 208Amax very accurately and the Amax is devastating on game. Although the RUM has the capability of shooting the 230hybrid really fast, I haven't made the switch because there is sufficient velocity loss with the 230 that the ballistics of the 208 are equal or better than the 230 out to about 1200. Once you get past 1200 the superior BC of the 230 really starts to shine. The problem with that for me is that 1200 is a bit beyond my ability at this point.
With the 215 though, it would provide the awesome BC AND minimal velocity loss AND devastating on game!
Thanks again for all the data points. You have succeeded in digging into my wallet and making MORE money fly out!
Well, it is only mid season, And this test media is so tastey I just can't quit.
What I am looking at now is will one fail. But I will admit with 8 antelope, 3 Bull Elk and 2 Deer they have proven worthy to me. 200 yards to 1285 yards. But I will limit the 300 win to 1000 on elk. As it has been said before there is no perfect bullet at all distances. I like this bullet better at 600 plus but it will sure kill effectively at all distances. Just some real carnage at the closer distances. What I need is a poke at a coyote past 1300 yards to see how it does below 1700 fps. But then I would seldome shoot at game past 1300 with a my 300 win. A yote or wolf, you bet.
Jeff
B23
Well-Known Member
Ok Jeff, new rules that apply just for you and your 300Win Mag and those 215's. To make it fair for the animals I've put together a new set of rules for you.
1001+ yds you get to shoot however you want.
801-1000yds you have to shoot left handed.
601-800yds you have to shoot standing.
0-600yds you have to shoot with both eyes closed. Now you can open your eyes before you pull the trigger and after but while your squeezing, the trigger that is, both eyes must remain closed. gun)
1001+ yds you get to shoot however you want.
801-1000yds you have to shoot left handed.
601-800yds you have to shoot standing.
0-600yds you have to shoot with both eyes closed. Now you can open your eyes before you pull the trigger and after but while your squeezing, the trigger that is, both eyes must remain closed. gun)
Tumbleweed
Well-Known Member
Ok Jeff, new rules that apply just for you and your 300Win Mag and those 215's. To make it fair for the animals I've put together a new set of rules for you.
1001+ yds you get to shoot however you want.
801-1000yds you have to shoot left handed.
601-800yds you have to shoot standing.
0-600yds you have to shoot with both eyes closed. Now you can open your eyes before you pull the trigger and after but while your squeezing, the trigger that is, both eyes must remain closed. gun)
He would still outshoot most of us!!
B23
Well-Known Member
Oh hell, give Jeff a little more credit than that. It doesn't take much to out shoot me. I'm just trying to make it a little more challenging for him. I'd hate to see Jeff get bored, quit, and go fishing because it was getting to easy for him. Then who would we get all our information from.
Broz:
The good folks at Berger and Midway have you to thank for the new box of 215's that arrived at my door yesterday. I'm looking forward to building up a round for my 300 RUM, and am grateful to you and the other fellows who have made this such a great and informative post. I was looking at the box where it says, "Not Suitable for Hunting". It should say right below that, Unless you're sure you can afford to pay the man at the meat locker for 13 animals and counting. Thanks and keep it up!
The good folks at Berger and Midway have you to thank for the new box of 215's that arrived at my door yesterday. I'm looking forward to building up a round for my 300 RUM, and am grateful to you and the other fellows who have made this such a great and informative post. I was looking at the box where it says, "Not Suitable for Hunting". It should say right below that, Unless you're sure you can afford to pay the man at the meat locker for 13 animals and counting. Thanks and keep it up!
