CFE223 in cold weather??

[sailorjim]

I have used CFE223 for a few years to hunt chucks from the end of March to the end of July here in Idaho. I have 26 inch 8 twist barrels and shoot 75 gr Hornady ELDMs. The CFE223 has been a great powder for me. I just replaced one of my 223 barrels with a new 8 twist Criterion barrel and can't get that thing to shoot. Velocities and groups are all over the place. A friend who used to be a competition shooter has suggested that perhaps the CFE is not good when the outside temps hit the teens and low 20's. Chuck season usually varies from about 35 to 90 and it burns well though that temp range. I have some hunting loads from last season that are charged with AR-COMP behind 77g STMKs so tomorrow I'm going to try those and I've loaded up some of my annealed Lapua brass with the AR-Comp and the ELDMs. Hopefully I will finally be able to prove that this barrel will shoot.
Has anyone here had experience with CFE223 in low temps?

Don't know about cold temps, I live in Texas. I've use it in .308 and 6.5 Grendel with good results. I was thinking of using it in my 6 Rem but couldn't find loading data. I called Hogdon and they told me DO NOT use it in 6 Rem, it produces wild pressure spikes.

 

[Capt RB]

I just used it in my 300 win mag for reduced loads. 28grns cci200 175smk 1900ishfps. 2mils up, .5 right for zero 3.4U@200. Accuracy is sub 1/2moa. Recoil is less than my 22lr. The reason is for training/instruction.

 

[birddog 68]

I'm working on a 50 grain BT load for my 223 and tried CFE 223 along with Benchmark. This rifle is used for coyotes and punching targets in all weather conditions. (5 - up to 70 degrees) Luckily the Benchmark was way more accurate so I won't be worrying about temperature stability with it.

 

[BillLarson]

It`s threads like these that give NEW...real world info..... I read with interest....
Thank all for taking the time to answer with results.....

 

[ridgewalker]

Now you guys are worrying me! I use CFE223 in several cartridges…222, 223, 7mm-08, and 375 H&H. Only really cold temps I hunt in are winter mountain lion and coyote calling, but it is usually in the teens or 20s. I'll have to chrono them in the cold.
Hodgdon advertises it to be insensitive to temps, but apparently not cold temps.
ooops left out 30-30.

 

[Mike D Texas]

While it doesn't get cold here like some of you, I have never noticed any issues with CFE in Texas cold weather. It does get in the teens and twenties where I hunt.

 

[fmuguira]

To OP, might try a different powder with same bullet to check new rifles accurate. Possible new barrel having some issues also?

 

[Mike Matteson]

following

 

[RAGGED EDGE]

If you have, or can get'em, try CCI #41 primers with CFE. That's what I use in my custom AR, and probably what the mil. contracts call for. My upper is a Wilson HB with a 1-8" twist. Accurate, very easy to clean up.

 

[Calvin45]

You will need to re do your load. It is very temp sensitive.

Dang it! I have a stash of it and it seems to work great in my new to me old 8mm mauser

 

[fmuguira]

+1 to raggededges comment on using mag primer. CFE223 is a ball, plus shooting in cold temps. Both demand Mag primer for best loads.

 

[A1C]

I have used CFE223 for a few years to hunt chucks from the end of March to the end of July here in Idaho. I have 26 inch 8 twist barrels and shoot 75 gr Hornady ELDMs. The CFE223 has been a great powder for me. I just replaced one of my 223 barrels with a new 8 twist Criterion barrel and can't get that thing to shoot. Velocities and groups are all over the place. A friend who used to be a competition shooter has suggested that perhaps the CFE is not good when the outside temps hit the teens and low 20's. Chuck season usually varies from about 35 to 90 and it burns well though that temp range. I have some hunting loads from last season that are charged with AR-COMP behind 77g STMKs so tomorrow I'm going to try those and I've loaded up some of my annealed Lapua brass with the AR-Comp and the ELDMs. Hopefully I will finally be able to prove that this barrel will shoot.
Has anyone here had experience with CFE223 in low temps?

I have CFE in a criterion 223 rem prefit that I'm going to test on 75 ELD Ms this next week and I'll share my experience next week. Not sure cartridge you're shooting … assuming 223 rem or AI maybe 22CM or 22-250… it's 26" but I think I went with the 7 twist (I'll have to verify) and live in E Idaho. Mine loves 24.8 or 24.9 Varget with 205m and Lapua brass so I'll be able to diagnose the difference on it… however I don't have the experience of the CFE in warmer weather as I've not tried it but I'll be able to confirm if group is good or bad. I'm right at 3,000 mv but very accurate w Varget.

 

[WYO300RUM]

I'm working on a 50 grain BT load for my 223 and tried CFE 223 along with Benchmark. This rifle is used for coyotes and punching targets in all weather conditions. (5 - up to 70 degrees) Luckily the Benchmark was way more accurate so I won't be worrying about temperature stability with it.

Benchmark is a great powder for 223. I saw some here the other day and almost bought another pound. Should of I have a few pounds of CFE223 but haven't used it yet.

 

[ChrisTeam2]

I have used CFE223 for a few years to hunt chucks from the end of March to the end of July here in Idaho. I have 26 inch 8 twist barrels and shoot 75 gr Hornady ELDMs. The CFE223 has been a great powder for me. I just replaced one of my 223 barrels with a new 8 twist Criterion barrel and can't get that thing to shoot. Velocities and groups are all over the place. A friend who used to be a competition shooter has suggested that perhaps the CFE is not good when the outside temps hit the teens and low 20's. Chuck season usually varies from about 35 to 90 and it burns well though that temp range. I have some hunting loads from last season that are charged with AR-COMP behind 77g STMKs so tomorrow I'm going to try those and I've loaded up some of my annealed Lapua brass with the AR-Comp and the ELDMs. Hopefully I will finally be able to prove that this barrel will shoot.
Has anyone here had experience with CFE223 in low temps?

In case this might be helpful:

I just tested a proven load with CFE-223 69 Gr. TMKs (Mostly used in 8-45 Celsius Temps) from my 3 years old AR-15 which has a 16" barrel and then tested this load in a new 20" AR-15 that is still breaking in. Bottom line is that the SD was 17.5 fps (not that great, getting about 12 fps in my other rifle), velocity was a respectable 2937 fps at 20 Celsius, 5 shot groups were horrible at 3.5+ MOAs.

I thought about switching primers (from Federal match to CCI No. 41 or Magnum No. 450) but given the data I have, the CFE-223 temp. variability is 1.7 fps per degree Fahrenheit. To economize my time, I think I am going to try and use TAC (0.91 fps per degree Fahrenheit based on third party data) which has given me very good results with 60 gr. TMKs in that same AR 20" AR-15 with 10.0 fps SD. I will therefore develop a TAC load with 69 TMKs, hoping it shoots well in both rifles; happy to share my data once the results are in, if it is of interest.

Idgunner: if you have a lot CFE-223 it may be worthwhile for you to try a magnum primer and redo your load development for a winter load? On a recent Erik Cortina podcast Believe the Target:






Bryan Litz commented that low SDs and accuracy largely stems, in his experience from the proper powder and primer combination and he added that usually once you have that right powder to primer combination, you usually have 1-4 grains of freedom from which to develop your load. Could be worth a trial to use different load/primers combination...