Bullet??????

[ski-dooz]

I'm currently I am shooting Berger bullets in all of my guns. What I use for most hunting is the 300 RUM. I use the 185 vld hunting. I have taken elk at 300 and 600, and deer from 100-500. I have killed a lot of animals with these but it has been rough. Here is the problem....... I shot a deer at 100 yards feeding it jumped up ran off and it took me an hour to find it. It never bled a drop. I found it 100 yards in a pine tree again no blood. I opened it up no heart most of the lungs gone. My dad shot couple of doe with same results. Now for the worst one I hit an elk probably 390 inch center mast after I jumped 3 of them laying by a water hole. Again center mast ran off no blood. I spent the next 2 hours looking until I had to head back to pack out my buddies elk. I have looked back on all of my kills and the same thing has happened every time NO EXIT HOLE! I don't know what to do. I like the BERGER but I can't keep hunting without a pass through. I like the way the Berger long range but again they go in and don't come out. I was wondering if anyone has an Idea on a bullet that will shoot long range and give me a pass through so I have some blood to follow. Thanks

 

[HammerB1]

Hammer Bullets. They are machined pure copper. The way they work, most of the time, they will exit. We shot 23 big game animals this past hunting season and only one did not pass through, it was the 30-cal 181 grain hammer hunter that was found just in front of the hind quarter of an elk. The shot was at 400 yards quartering to. It traveled approx. 36" before it stopped.
Thanks
Brian

 

[Lefty7mmstw]

On deer I usually use Hornady, Sierra, or Nosler... In my 300win I've killed a couple of dozen mule deer with the 165 interlock and rl22 and nearly all have passed through. Sierra and Nosler bullets get the nod for me in 7mm's as they seem to shoot well with little load work up. They also harvest game very well; I was blowing 140 sierra pro hunters out of my 7rum at 3500 fps and they held together for a pass through from 200 yards to 800 yards. I only caught one from a 7rem (3200 fps launch) that dropped a running deer at around 300 yards. It weighed 60% after going through the hip raking forward. I have shot a number of critters with 7mm 140 nos ab's around 3400 fps launch and not caught one.

I haven't killed any elk myself but my brother has had good luck with Barnes in 30cal.. He used his 300win on a cull hunt a few years back to drop 4 elk with 6 shots (nat. park- shoot the wiggle out) using 165 grain barnes... I don't think he caught one pill.

I know a lot of guys like Berger, but I stuck a toe in the water with a few boxes and I am less than impressed. I am working with the eld-x in both 7mm and 30cal... I think the 200eld-x pushed with retumbo I'm my 300rum will be a real winner; the 175 eld-x wants to shoot in my 7stw, but I haven't proven anything yet as I've only put up a few groups so far... A couple of those weren't so hot as I was seating deep to clear the mag. well... I guess the 175 eld-x doesn't like getting set deep in that rifle.

 

[snox801]

Cutting edge bullets or hammer. I have yet to use the hammer but will be shortly. I can speak on the cutting edge. They work very well just as advertised.

 

[MudRunner2005]

I'll try to give you a different suggestion than what everyone else is giving you...

Try a heavier bullet, like the Berger 210 VLD or 215 Hybrid. Heavier bullets retain more kinetic energy, resulting in more energy on impact, which can mean more pass-throughs. Broz uses the 215 Hybrids almost exclusively and has zero complains in probably close to 50 big game kills by now.

 

[bigngreen]

A Berger 185 in a 300 RUM, OHHHH hell no!!!! Put a 230 Berger in it and you'll see a whole new level of elk crushing take place, all my Berger kills look like a massacre took place, blood everywhere but you gotta shoot heavy for cal not light for cal. I shoot the 215 in my 308 and it destroys them with blood trails that will almost make a guy sick there so gory, in the snow you can usually see them with your naked eye from the shooting position. A 300 RUM with a 230 Berger is a very serious level of elk killing to some ridiculous ranges and very hard to beat with even a big 338 but you gotta use the right bullet!!

 

[ski-dooz]

On deer I usually use Hornady, Sierra, or Nosler... In my 300win I've killed a couple of dozen mule deer with the 165 interlock and rl22 and nearly all have passed through. Sierra and Nosler bullets get the nod for me in 7mm's as they seem to shoot well with little load work up. They also harvest game very well; I was blowing 140 sierra pro hunters out of my 7rum at 3500 fps and they held together for a pass through from 200 yards to 800 yards. I only caught one from a 7rem (3200 fps launch) that dropped a running deer at around 300 yards. It weighed 60% after going through the hip raking forward. I have shot a number of critters with 7mm 140 nos ab's around 3400 fps launch and not caught one.

I haven't killed any elk myself but my brother has had good luck with Barnes in 30cal.. He used his 300win on a cull hunt a few years back to drop 4 elk with 6 shots (nat. park- shoot the wiggle out) using 165 grain barnes... I don't think he caught one pill.

I know a lot of guys like Berger, but I stuck a toe in the water with a few boxes and I am less than impressed. I am working with the eld-x in both 7mm and 30cal... I think the 200eld-x pushed with retumbo I'm my 300rum will be a real winner; the 175 eld-x wants to shoot in my 7stw, but I haven't proven anything yet as I've only put up a few groups so far... A couple of those weren't so hot as I was seating deep to clear the mag. well... I guess the 175 eld-x doesn't like getting set deep in that rifle.

I bought some 200's and ordered some of the larger ones. keep posted on the performance.

 

[ski-dooz]

A Berger 185 in a 300 RUM, OHHHH hell no!!!! Put a 230 Berger in it and you'll see a whole new level of elk crushing take place, all my Berger kills look like a massacre took place, blood everywhere but you gotta shoot heavy for cal not light for cal. I shoot the 215 in my 308 and it destroys them with blood trails that will almost make a guy sick there so gory, in the snow you can usually see them with your naked eye from the shooting position. A 300 RUM with a 230 Berger is a very serious level of elk killing to some ridiculous ranges and very hard to beat with even a big 338 but you gotta use the right bullet!!

I talked to Berger and they said that there bullet was not designed to pass through. Is your wound where it entered?

 

[bigngreen]

I talked to Berger and they said that there bullet was not designed to pass through. Is your wound where it entered?

I see a lot of exits, but we also see a lot of blood trails because their lungs are blown to shreds and every time they cough you get a spray of blood out their mouth and the entrance. I honestly haven't had to trail an elk since shooting Bergers cause I watch them flop over after a few steps but when you get up to them it's a mess usually.
I used to run Barnes, ran Cutting edge but the Bergers when used properly will out perform them. I will run some Hammers because I'm liking that their looking a little more frangible but I'll still run as heavy as I can.
Search for threads by Broz, he's extensively documented a lot of kills, 80 head of elk last year alone with Bergers, I've piled up a lot with them as well on cull hunts but haven't done nearly as good of job documenting it. Search out guys who know how to get the most out of them and pick their brains!!

 

[Barrelnut]

I'll 3rd that the issue is using too light for cartridge Berger bullets. In the 300 RUM you need to be running the 210 VLD minimum. The 215 or 230 even better. I'd shoot the one of the three that shot best. One big reason I shoot the Bergers is the incredible accuracy I get from them. And at long range it is hard to find a bullet that shoots more actually and hits as hard. Just step up the bullet weight, you'll be amazed.

 

[Pdvdh]

The 210 VLD can come apart at 300 Win Mag velocity. I'd go 230 in the RUM, based solely on what I've read. I shoot the 215gr at 3050fps MV. It shoots well.

 

[MudRunner2005]

The 210 VLD can come apart at 300 Win Mag velocity. I'd go 230 in the RUM, based solely on what I've read. I shoot the 215gr at 3050fps MV. It shoots well.

They don't come apart in my .300 WinMag, or my .300 Ackley (.300 Weatherby Improved), which is a fair-bit larger than the .300WM...

Never heard of the 210 coming apart at normal large magnum velocities before.

 

[RockyMtnMT]

I will say that if you want to shoot high velocity and flat you can have a bullet that will hold enough weight to pass through and damage the vitals all the way through them. Not wreck the surrounding meat. Shed the nose of the bullet in large enough pieces that continue to penetrate and do damage. Open up in the same way down to 1800fps. You can.

Steve

 

[Pdvdh]

Never heard of the 210 coming apart at normal large magnum velocities before.

Now you have. If you're interested in the details, here's the link:
http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f19/berger-210-vld-black-bear-field-report-31392/

And if you want to read about a 210 VLD failing to expand on a Dall Ram, read about that here:
http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f92/alaskan-dall-sheep-210-berger-vld-60791/

The 210 VLD - straight out of the box - is the most inconsistent performer of any expanding bullet I've ever used. I recommend them to no one. I have more confidence in the 215s. Since I began customizing the 210 VLDs by meplat uniforming and countersinking their tips, AND ensuring none of the tips are pinched shut into a solid mass of copper, they've performed acceptably well. But I still think the 215 is a better bullet design for large game hunting.