Boone and Crocket reticle range test.

[nottoofar]

good grouper,
Whatever method works for you is great.
I prefer to get my good solid rest,zap the animal with my rangefinder, assess the conditions, pick an aimpoint in my scope and fire. It doesn't get any easier than that.

I don't trust clicks. With set aimpoints I have tested and proven to be consistent and correct at the range I am much more confident.

 

[QuietHunter]

I think each method has its advantages. Multiple point reticles can allow for a more rapid shot, but are limited in accuracy and therfore in range. I have worked out ballistic plex and mildots and since I usually practice similar to where and how I hunt it works well out to around 600 yards.
At longer distances it makes sense to determine all the factors and dial it in. There is less room for error and falling between a hashmark or dot is not really acceptable. I have a Leupold tactical that I have taken to longer distances. Once all of your math is correct it is much easier to be repeatable. Clicking it is theoretically only limited by the amount of elevation you have and the accuracy of your load if you have factored everything else in.

 

[Ian M]

I use the handy Pathfinder Ballistic Chart on my scopes now instead of attaching labels for drop to the rifle. The Pathfinders, also sold by Leupold, are similar to a tape measure, they pull out and reel back into the turret like container. They are great - well made and fast. Available in 1" and 30mm and put on in seconds.

Also carry cards in my pocket, just in case. Usually shoot 175 BHA so carry the waterproof Ballisticards for that load. Ballisticards are also a very handy LR tool, can be custom made to your particular load.

Don't forget the great little ACI indicator from SniperTools, no scope being used in angle shooting should be without one of these little babies. Fast and accurate calculation of drop when shooting at angles. They either strap to the scope tube or you can get a slick little holder from Badger Ord. I like the Badger rig, since I am doing all these commercials...

Bottom line is - putting an ACI and a Pathfinder on your scope makes it look very specialized (even if you do not have a clue how to operate them

). I would say that they make the rig look COOL but am way too old and crotchety for that - but all my scopes have them now, can't beat an NXS rigged out with those accessories.

I agree that you cannot shoot as accurately at longer range, past 5-600, without using your turrets, that is a simple fact. I have shot the Horus a lot, it is the ultimate hold-off point scope and it works out to longer distances. But it is one busy reticle design and I find I need to write down my holdoffs or I forget where I was at. Takes about the same time when I crank the turrets. Bottom line is that we need to use math and keep notes to be confident.

 

[goodgrouper]

nottofar,
I'm glad you are confident in your method and I didn't mean to sound like my way was best, it just works for me and many of the people I show. Confidence is key as you know, and only a fool would argue with success. Just for my education in case somebody I know prefers your method, what do you do if the bullet point of impact needed for a given range is inbetween the hashes? Is there a way to compensate for this without messing around with the power? I take people out and try to get them in the vha 1000 yard club on rodent-sized targets and one needs all the power one can get to see the darn things at that range. I would hate to turn the power down on their scopes.
Any info would be helpful.
-goodgrouper

 

[nottoofar]

goodgrouper,
Not a problem. Of course you think your way is best cause it works for you and you have confidence it is the best way, for you.

Since I don't trust clicks, there is no way I could use your method. I agree that if indeed clicks are accurate and adjust to the exact place you think they went when you clicked it there your method is better especially for past 600 yards as other posters have noted.

For me if I end up between the aim points on my scope I end up estimating. Just like I did when I just had a regular duplex.
Lets use an example.
I used to sight in at 300 yards, leaving me vulnerable to the overshot at 200 yards or especially on an angle shot. If I saw a deer at 400 yards, I know a deer is 18 inches wide and my bullet drop at that distance is 7 inches so I hold just under the back line and dead deer.
Now with the Boone and Crocket reticle I have the same options. If I see a bear at 305 yards I know he is exactly midway between my first two aim lines (250 and 350).
I center the bear and shoot, dead bear.(see the pictures I posted of my bear a couple weeks ago on long range hunting).
My biggest range between aim points is from the 350 to the 500 mark. Here is where the rangefinder and a flat shooting rifle is critical. If I know the exact yardage it is easy to go either from the 350 or 425(halfway point) or the 500 yard aim points and adjust for a slight holdover or holdunder. Or if there is the option to move to adjust the distance to get closer to one of the aimpoints that is good also.
I have been using holdover out to 500 yards on animals for years and been very successful on animals as small as coyotes so the Boone and Crocket reticle is just a more precise method. I practice a lot out in the desert out to 600 yards so have it down pretty well.
I grant you that a person who did not put in the range time and just went out and thought the reticle was going to work great and was not prepared with knowledge of his bullet drop and bullet impacts at the different aimpoints and for inbetween distances may be in for some surprises.
Sorry for the long explanation.

 

[Ian M]

nottoofar,
You hit it on the head, we have to practice and get the knowledge and confidence to use holdoffs with accuracy.

I was like you for a long time, did not like to mess with turrets and I still believe that some turrets are best left alone. But I found that when I got really good scopes that the turrets are absolutely accurate and trustworthy. Made a big change in my shooting. Scopes like the NXS and MK4 are designed to be cranked - matter of fact the more you work the turrets the crisper some of them get since there are rubber O-rings that need to seat from use. When I use mildot reticles I also get five additional holdoff points for elevation, all I have to do is shoot to determine what range they are good for.

Big problem is out past 5-600 where the curve of the trajectory is not a nice arc but a parabola that starts to curve real sharp. We find that makes holdoff estimation really tuff, clicking will give more precision.

Envy your ability to go out in the desert and shoot, we lose about 1/3 or more of our shooting-year to winter.

 

[Guest]

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[ 09-23-2004: Message edited by: W ]

 

[sscoyote]

This is a great discussion, and a topic that's practically taken over my life for the last several years.

Couple months ago, my shooting partner XPHunter (posts here sometimes), and i went to the ITRC in Gillette, WY competing against the military and police sniper guys in this popular sniper style event. While on the line checking zeros with our XP pistols, one of the guys on the team next to us was kneeling next to his NXS-equipped rig doing some calculating on a PDA. I asked him if he was using Exbal, and he sure enuf was. I knew we were in trouble then, and as it turns out those guys took second place.

Manipulating scope reticles, magnification and turrets for downrange zeroing/ranging has got to be the most fascinating shooting i've ever done hands down. Once i was subjected to it i went home and started calculating reticle subtensions for ranging with ratio and proportion formulas, etc., and checking the calcs out the front window of my house on various sized sign posts at various ranges-- loved it!!! There was just 1 problem-- i neede to have something to measure reticle subtensions. Then one day i was riding my bike and stopped at a stop sign. I glanced at the sign's post, and there it was. Holes drilled in it at exactly 1" intervals all along it. I rode home and noticed a sign at about 100 yds. from my house (102 lasered actually), and finally had something i could measure reticles with. After that all my hunting buddies were in trouble-- i was establishing downrange zeros with magnification changes for all their plex-equipped scopes, using a combination of Exbal's calcs, and mine-- it was absolutely fascinating, and quite successful most of the time. Then it was on to manipulating std. ballistics programs to see what kind of info. i could extract from them for establishing downrange zeros/ranging. This stuff is a lot like reloading is to factory loads-- sure u can get by with factory stuff, but reloading opens up a whole new world to the shooter, just like becoming a student of optics and ballistic programs does. Sorry i got a little carried away here, but it sure is a neat business we're into.

I with most of the others here. I like ballistic reticles, until trajectory gets too steep, then it's onto clicks. One thing i've learned tho about ballistic reticles-- after awhile u sort of learn to visualize the trajectory between stadia (to a point), which makes connecting at in between ranges not too difficult at all really. I use the longest zero stadia for a comeup zero reference for additional clicks which also often eliminates the need for 30 mm tubes.

 

[rwleonard]

You can also use a good ballitics program to dertimine the yardages to which each hold-over point corresponds under a different set of conditions and put that info on a sketch of the reticle inside the scope cover.

Rick

 

[Guest]

After watching the long range hunting dvd; shooting Elk, Coyotes, etc., dialing with a good scope is indeed accurate! One thing that I have run into, when speaking of the recticle test, is a lot of folks are scared to adjust their scope; unless they just have to. It continues to amaze me; that some folks are afraid to make adjustments, because they are afraid they will put their scope out of alignment, and not be able to realign it by themselves! Questions is, "How do you go about convincing these folks that they can?"

 

[goodgrouper]

sscoyote,
Not to change the subject, but I noticed that you were from Pueblo, CO. Can you answer my post on the "General Discussion" board?
--goodgrouper

 

[sscoyote]

Got u GG.

 

[blockb]

Notoofar, At about what power is the large and small triangle setting marks at? Thanks

 

[Brien]

"How do you go about convincing these folks that they can?"

get them into a nightforce or leupold target scope and show them that they do in fact track... you just have to have a little faith in your equipment.. faith comes with practice!!! doesnt matter what you use for long range shooting... as long as you know that everyday is a new set of conditions!
Brien

p.s. i have been using clicks for 2 summers now... but i also thought i would like the boone and crocket reticle on my light carry rifle so i bought one.. on my long range stuff i like a clean reticle.. and clicks! lol great discusion though