Are barnes reliable?

[meatyrem]

Yes I have checked ou their website. They show perfect expansion every time, of coarse why wouldn't they. That is what I wanted to hear, from all of you, who have the experience. It seems as if I'm hearing half of good and half of bad. Even tho barnes advertises perfect performance, I for one know that every shot fired at game is NOT balistic gelatin filled game. Every shot will not be the same as the last. Way too many variables. Their tests are way too simplistic, your gonna get the same performance every time when you fire a bullet into the same material every single time. They should try more REAL world tests. Balistic gelatin does not have skin ( light or heavy ) or bone in it or muscle, tendons or ligaments and conective tissue or the many other things I am not mentioning.

Now, I've always thought that the nose cavity on the tsx was too small let alone inconsistant from one to another.

Would any of you fellas out there say that barnes improved it with the ttsx? With a larger more defined hollow point?


By the way, I am loving the feedback, excellent from everyone! I'm not trying to get a ****ing Match going here, just like to weigh everything out. I take a long time thinking and evaluating before I go ahead with something. Just because I know every situation is not shooting balistic gelatin.
Meatyrem

 

[Firecat]

I think by design the TTSX lend themselves to more reliable expansion. In fact I would not be surprised to see Barnes start phasing out the old TSX in favor of the new TTSX. Just my opinion, but why wouldn't they? The BC's are higher and the industry is crying out for it.

 

[meatyrem]

Exactly what my thinking is. Oh believe me, if I decide to use barnes it will NOT be the original tsx. But from what I see, I believe I have not heard of a single ttsx not properly expanding. I may be wrong on this.

 

[venom600]

In fact I would not be surprised to see Barnes start phasing out the old TSX in favor of the new TTSX. Just my opinion, but why wouldn't they?

I bet you're right. From a marketing perspective, the TTSX was something that they could still call a 'premium' bullet and charge more for. With the MRX and LRX lines in place now, there's no reason (including marketing) for them to keep the original TSX line alive.

Sure, they'll have to sunset it over the course of a year or so (to give the current TSX users some time to develop new loads for the TTSX), but I bet it's gone pretty soon.

--Ben

 

[bigngreen]

I've found the TTSX to be reliable to open so far but I wonder if the problems will persist of deflection and blowing the petals of.
I really struggle with the cost, I can buy twice as many bullets of another brand that will usually group better and performance is no worse!

 

[Bully]

I have shot barnes x in several calibers.I have found they work OK in lighter weight for caliber bullets and some shoot real well.I also found they don't work well or open up at lower velocity.A good friend almost got took out by a lion, that he hit three times but the bullets all failed to open, in a .375 x-bullet.the lion was killed by the PH when it charged and almost got my friend.To let you know,the lion was shot and ran off.the tracker followed it for a way,but they lost light and waited till next morning.they then found it still a live and he shot it twice more, before PH killed it. My friend said when they skinned the lion out, it looked like it was shot with a FMJ.PH told him that's why he don't care for barnes bullets and if asked will tell hunter to
Leave them at home. I myself almost lost a good elk and would had if it was not for a fresh snow on the ground. I just don't care for the performance on game. I will stay with nosler or Berger .

 

[jimbires]

Jim,

Yeah my post was for you, please don't think I had even the slightest bit of elevated blood pressure when I wrote that. I just cannot comment on Barnes failure because that has never happened for me, or my hunting partner or my father.

I encourage guys like you to bring forth your failure reports so guys like meatyrem can make an educated guess.

What was the distance to the buck you shot? Where was the bullet placed (I couldn't make it out in the pic), I'm not questioning your ability, but I would like to know. What bullet weight & caliber?

Sorry for all the questions, Root Cause Analysis is programmed into my brain!

the buck was inside of 100 yards . it was a 7mm , 160 TSX . if I remember right muzzle velocity was 3100 or 3150 FPS . it was standing kind of quartered towards me . first shot was in the front shoulder , the leg bone was just all smashed . while tracking him there was leg bone falling out of him . apparently the bullet and none of the bone chunks or fragments hit anything vital . I'm still scratching my head on this one . when I caught up to the deer he jumped up to run . I shot again . he took a step or two and went down . the finishing shot I recovered , that is the bullet I posted pics of in the other thread . after seeing what the bullet looked like I gave up on the TSX's . I think the petals must have been coming off my other bullets too is why none of my shots showed bullet wound damage , but I don't know this ???...... Jim

 

[jimbires]

I've found the TTSX to be reliable to open so far but I wonder if the problems will persist of deflection and blowing the petals of.
I really struggle with the cost, I can buy twice as many bullets of another brand that will usually group better and performance is no worse!

BnG , what do you mean by deflection ? the bullet hitting bone and then changes course ?
this is what I thought looked like happened on my 2008 buck . I told my Dad what I thought happened and he wouldn't even buy it . he gave me the yea it must not have been standing the way you thought it was . LOL so I have really hesitated to write this on the forums . Jim

 

[Firecat]

At the same time I called Barnes to talk to them about the minimum velocity for expansion, I also asked them about changing over to the TTSX from the tsx. They said that the copper alloy is the same used for both bullets so the load should transfer over with ease, however on some of the TTSX the ogive is changed slightly. This would mean that the charge of powder should in theory be able to be the same, but the seating depth may need adjustment when transferring bullets. This makes it simple to switch. I would still likely back off 1 or 2 grains to be safe, but I don't see why your current charge couldn't be kept. As for price, the TTSX is with 1 or 2 $'s of where the TSX werre, so its really not an issue. That being said, I may only shoot 20 - 25 per year per rifle. Not a range bullet by any means.

 

[Outlaw6.0]

the buck was inside of 100 yards . it was a 7mm , 160 TSX . if I remember right muzzle velocity was 3100 or 3150 FPS ....... Jim

In my first post to this thread I believe this was one of the first things I talked about, 160grn 7mm. I wouldn't hesitate to say a full 90% of the failure reports I hear about are heavy for caliber bullets (especially 7mm for some reason in my experience). I tend to wonder of the rotational velocity of the 7mm >160 isn't high enough, which would in turn cause a lot of precession leading to deflection? I'm no ballistics expert by any means but it makes sense to me, the 7mm 140 MRX my partner shoots has yet to show any signs of deflection...

Jim, you sure do have a head stratcher there, I don't get it, & I understand your concern (I would be!).

As to the other posters, I do agree that the TTSX will eventually replace the TSX to a point (just as the TSX replace the original X), I would bet the 375 & up retain some of the TSX, i'm thinking of the new intros like the 350grn 375 TSX and such. Those bullets still have their place (i'm thinking africa).

 

[bigngreen]

BnG , what do you mean by deflection ? the bullet hitting bone and then changes course ?
this is what I thought looked like happened on my 2008 buck . I told my Dad what I thought happened and he wouldn't even buy it . he gave me the yea it must not have been standing the way you thought it was . LOL so I have really hesitated to write this on the forums . Jim

Deflection is likely what you experience! The first cow elk I had it happen on was shot at 450ish yrds with a 168 gr TSX from a 300WBY, she was very slightly quartering, not enough to change my hold even. I got a few inches lower into the heavy bone about a third of the way up from the bottom of her chest, massively heavy bone!! She went down DTR, her legs came up to her chest and she bounce of the dirt so I watched for a couple minutes and we ran down the feed lot and took a couple more cows. The we go out to start gathering them up and she picks her head up, take and cut her throat and then go to figuring out what happened and I found the bullet blew the bone to bits turned almost 90 degrees and came out her chest, she was feeding when I pulled the trigger with her head down and the bullet then entered her neck and bounced back out of her vertebra not breaking it but it cut her jugular, if it would not have cut her jugular it would have been a bad deal. In the mountains it would have turned into a sad story.
Second cow was similar but a little closer and running, slight quartering to me and it landed in the same spot and should have blown bone and bullet through her heart and lungs, bullet did not do so and I could not figure out where this one went but it was not into the chest cavity.
I also wittness a bull take two right in the boiler room at under 200yrds with a 165 TSX and when we opened him up they only made it to the first lung, completely blowing up, his off lung and heart were only bruised but the bullet dumping that much energy broke his intestines open and blood shot in places I've never seen before on an elk, I couldn't believe he was shooting Barnes so I cut one and it was all copper and was for sure a Barnes.

That is three fails out of a ton of animals with great performance, I think they are a great bullet but they are not any better than some of the others I've shot for sure. I think the 225 TTSX is going to be a good enough bullet I'm building a rifle just for them and intent to try to get the 265 TTSX to shoot in a RUM.
My theory is that the Barnes is to hard at times, it blows the nose of the bullet of then all you have is a hard blunt shank with no give and you then get deflection, the lead core bullets in the same situation continue to mushroom, removing bone from it's path and then continuing on that path more reliably. If you shoot a Barnes at a gong and what do you hear, you hear it spinning out into space which is deflection. Shoot a Berger at the same gong and you will find little copper disks at the base of the target which means that bullet mushroomed all the way to the base trying to stay on coarse. Driving a lighter Barnes faster is going to increase deflection IMO, if I use them I'm starting to load the heaviest I can with moderate velocity so they don't blow the tip of but mushroom and drive through the vitals of an elk or I load them as light and fast as I can and us them for varmints.
I am not saying that the Berger is better than the Barnes just to make that clear, I've had about the same success with both!!!