6.5x285- Burger Bullet?
- Thread starter Gurn
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4bycamper
Well-Known Member
Tagging in.
I would like to help but my 6.5x284 is still at the smith.
Yay-Broncos
I would like to help but my 6.5x284 is still at the smith.
Yay-Broncos
barefooter56
Well-Known Member
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- Nov 10, 2014
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Gurn,
Straight answer. What the rifle likes. Same for seating depth. On our website under information go read 'VLDs, making then shoot". You want to find the seating depth sweet spot first at the lowest powder charge listed for the bullet/powder/cartridge combination you are testing. Once you've found that. Work you load back up slowly checking for pressure signs and accuracy as you increase your powder charge. There are no magic velocities or seating depths that you can just plug and play. Test.
Straight answer. What the rifle likes. Same for seating depth. On our website under information go read 'VLDs, making then shoot". You want to find the seating depth sweet spot first at the lowest powder charge listed for the bullet/powder/cartridge combination you are testing. Once you've found that. Work you load back up slowly checking for pressure signs and accuracy as you increase your powder charge. There are no magic velocities or seating depths that you can just plug and play. Test.
I had a cooper 6.5x284 with a 26" barrel that shot tiny groups with 57.5 Retumbo and 140 VLD, I can't remember what the jump was but somewhere between .050 and .075
the velocity over the magnetospeed was 3037 FPS average.
I still can't believe I sold that rifle.
the velocity over the magnetospeed was 3037 FPS average.
I still can't believe I sold that rifle.
Thanks, at first we were about 10 off the lands but only getting around 2700. That seemed to shoot pretty good. Then we increased the velocity to I think close to 2950. The accuracy started falling off. We backed off the lands farther and started getting pressure signs I guess from invading the case more. I don't really know cause I'm just starting to learn about Berger hunting bullets. I've most times been a fan of the X bullet. When they first came out they were great on performance. Problem was the load data they put out for them in the first manual was off the rictor (don't know how ta speel that word) scale. Their max loads were through the roof with pressure. I guess they were tryin to get the same speeds as lead core but just couldn't with the solid bullet. The second manual lowered the charges to a safer level. Any how the accuracy was poor in most rifles. They tried coating the bullets but they still had problems. Finally with the TSX they fixes all that stuff.
My son tried the Bergers out west (west of me anyhow in Michigan) and liked em. Most times with the TSX you could set them 40 back and just drive the heck outta em and they shot good. I was trying to figure these Bergers out and started reading everything I could on them. Some folks were saying that they were never made to be a hunting bullet but were for target. Folks tried them for hunting and liked how fragile they were exploding in the animal so they started selling them as hunting bullets to. I was thinkin I never messed with a rifle except a AR15 with such a fast twist as the 6.5.The AR I had was 1 in 7. I was told that the 1 in 7 was not good for the lighter bullets 50-55 because the fast twist could cause bullet failure. That's why I was asking about velocity. I was reading how the Berger bullets were failing with the thinner jackets for target shooting so they made the target bullets thicker jacket but left the now hunting bullet thin. Meaning the hunting bullet is the same as the original target bullet. I know it's not the same bullet but looking at the nosler load data for 140 6.5 the loads shown for most accurate were around 2600-2800. 6.5-284 Norma Load Data
This is where I was reading about the thinner Berger bullet failing. Berger bullet failure test
So anyhow as I said I don't know and sure aint no expert on reloading or especially Berger bullets So I recon it's off to the Berger Bullets How To Make Them Shoot Thread for me. Thanks. Sorry seems like the link for the Nosler load data works sometimes and sometimes not.
WOW!! That's fast. Thanks Mr 8&Bait. I'm thinkin that would put his 24" at 2900 something. I cant Believe ya sold it either!! Ha! I've sold ah bunch I'm still mad at myself over!!
barefooter56
Well-Known Member
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- Nov 10, 2014
- Messages
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Gurn,
Bullet failure is a strange thing. It can be caused by velocity, barrel length, bore condition all of which increase friction and heat. The twist rate issue is way down the list. Read the " VLDs making them shoot" and it you have any questions please get back to us. And yes, you seating the bullet deeper was probably the cause of the pressure issue. Get your seating depth figured out before increasing the powder charge. And keep in mind that just because 8andbait got 3037 fps out of his rifle and you want more than 2700fps dosen't mean that the rifle will go along with the program. It likes what it likes and that's just it.
PS- I have a Savage .223 with a 1-9 twist rate that just loves 40 grain bullets. So don't believe the twist rate thing you read is a blanket statement
Bullet failure is a strange thing. It can be caused by velocity, barrel length, bore condition all of which increase friction and heat. The twist rate issue is way down the list. Read the " VLDs making them shoot" and it you have any questions please get back to us. And yes, you seating the bullet deeper was probably the cause of the pressure issue. Get your seating depth figured out before increasing the powder charge. And keep in mind that just because 8andbait got 3037 fps out of his rifle and you want more than 2700fps dosen't mean that the rifle will go along with the program. It likes what it likes and that's just it.
PS- I have a Savage .223 with a 1-9 twist rate that just loves 40 grain bullets. So don't believe the twist rate thing you read is a blanket statement
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engineer40
Well-Known Member
Ironic, I also have a 223 with a 1-9 twist that blows my mind with 40 grain bullets. It really screwed up my plans to shoot the heavier bullets with that rifle. I couldn't get any of my 69 grain bullets to shoot better than 1 inch groups.
Even though my original plan was not to shoot the super light bullets, how can you complain about a rifle that can shoot 10 shots into a 1/4 inch at 100 yards? (And magazine fed). Every time I start thinking I really know what I'm doing with rifles and reloading, something happens and I start thinking this is all voodoo again.
Thanks Barefoot and everybody else. The first time out west my boy did a Struck by lightin thing on a deer at about 200yds with a 168 TSX on a deer at about 200yds with his 300 WSM. Don't remember the speed but it was up there. Next year he was reading about the Bergers and did the same thing at just over 300 only pushing 2650 with his 6.5 140gr. So we aint gonna worry about speed anymore. Just read that how ta make em shoot stuff and follow that. Thanks again, more thoughts form others folks will be preciated also.
johnnyk
Well-Known Member
Gurn,
I initially tried both the 140gn VLD and the A-Max's. The A-Max's had a little bit of an accuracy edge over the Bergers in my rifle, so I went with those. I'm using 59.0gn of Retumbo with Lapua brass (9th reload) and BR2 primers. My rifles puts them in a ragged hole at 100yds, quickly (3038fps).
Stock Savage 112BVSS, swapped out with VLP stock and bedded. Here's a 300yd group and a 700yd group....
I initially tried both the 140gn VLD and the A-Max's. The A-Max's had a little bit of an accuracy edge over the Bergers in my rifle, so I went with those. I'm using 59.0gn of Retumbo with Lapua brass (9th reload) and BR2 primers. My rifles puts them in a ragged hole at 100yds, quickly (3038fps).
Stock Savage 112BVSS, swapped out with VLP stock and bedded. Here's a 300yd group and a 700yd group....
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ramrod79
Well-Known Member
I run 140 Berg VLD, and 53 GR of H 4831SC at 40 off lands fed 210M primers ,Lapua brass, velocity is 2966 ft/sec this is my go to load, and it shoots awesome in my custom 6.5 .
Glad to here all the good results yall are getting. I'm kinda envious!! Ha!. We gonna stick with what speed gives us good acc. I don't think askin .5 to .75 is bein to pickey form a gun that cost ah bit more than than say ah run of the mill cheaper Savage. Nobody get mad I sure aint knockin a Savage.....but ya gotta admit. If yer settin at the range next to a feller popin three shot funny lookin one hole groups at good speed with his little rough lookin hard wood stock Savage and a $89 bubble pack scope. Your over there with ah mean lookin machine that set ya back ah few more $ than you was comfortable with, shootin a 1 and bigger. You might jees see your situation as ah bit cannfusin.
I hate ta keep sayin someone else saying but......"The only interestin gun is a accurace one" I gotta say me and that boy think a like. Will keep yall informed when we get this thing drivin tacs.
I hate ta keep sayin someone else saying but......"The only interestin gun is a accurace one" I gotta say me and that boy think a like. Will keep yall informed when we get this thing drivin tacs.
My Cooper with a 26" barrel is getting 2975FPS, ES10FPS, using 58gr of Retumbo, 210M Fed, Lapua. Berger or JLK 140's seated .075" off the lands. Fed215M will produce 3020FPS with the same accuracy but ES is not as low. Either bullet produces .25MOA. I have shot a few dozen deer/antelope over the last six years between 100 and 1200 yards. Bullet performance on game has been outstanding with both bullets.
