Seems like both cartridges are the same, but are they? If choosing 1 which would it be on those with experience with 1 of the other or both? I've thought about the non-ai, but the taper is steep unlike the ai version. It kinda makes it a 22 creed? Pros and cons if any of either or both of those with experience of the 2? Fire forming brass and life due to doing it as needed for the ai? Help would be appreciated!
-
If you are being asked to change your password, and unsure how to do it, follow these instructions. Click here
22-250ai or 22 creed
- Thread starter ARlife4me
- Start date
Help Support Long Range Hunting Forum
Zen Archery
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2012
- Messages
- 1,535
Whats end goal? Standard .224 bullets just get 22-250. If want to run heavy .224s get a 22CM.
I'm running 22CM AI for heavy 80's.
I'm running 22CM AI for heavy 80's.
waspocrew
Well-Known Member
I have both. I really like my 22-250 AI and have probably 700 rounds down the tube with it. Very easy to load for, fire forming is simple and can be very accurate. It just involves an extra step. My 22-250 AI is a 1:8 twist and handles up to the 88 gr ELDM just fine.
On the other hand, I do feel the 22 Creedmoor is the easy button. Great brass options available (Alpha, Peterson, etc), no fire forming needed. I went with a 1:7.5 twist for the 22 Creed to get me up to the 95 SMK if needed.
As above, what's the end goal? In either case, you'll want to make sure you have the right twist for the intended job. Very easy to vaporize bullets with either cartridge if the twist is too fast.
On the other hand, I do feel the 22 Creedmoor is the easy button. Great brass options available (Alpha, Peterson, etc), no fire forming needed. I went with a 1:7.5 twist for the 22 Creed to get me up to the 95 SMK if needed.
As above, what's the end goal? In either case, you'll want to make sure you have the right twist for the intended job. Very easy to vaporize bullets with either cartridge if the twist is too fast.
It's for an AR and mag length of 2.830" max so there's plenty of room. Anything heavier than 75gr up to 90gr for now. Having a 342win gets me more velocity with the 90's given the same coal of 2.830". Just want a 22cal for boat-tails that the 24cal doesn't offer in the lighter bullets. I did see where Peterson had (in stock) 22creed brass in srp's, but out of lrp's. Not sure which would be the better primer pocket option? + I'd go with a 7 -7.5 twist for future heavier bullets. I'd check rpm before deciding knowing the possible velocities with a 20" barrel. Might go shorter with the 18" for maneuverability? No suppressor will be used. 1 day maybe?
I've owned 2x 22 creeds, one 8tw, other 7tw. The 8tw a 22", the 7tw an 18", load development has been very simple with both. 22cm with it's add case capacity offers a few more powder options, H1000 can be used with the 88+ gr bullets, 7.5tw stabilizes pretty much everything. It's important to get a 219 bore barrel VS a 218 in my opinion, as the 22cm is overbore and will develop fire cracking in first 400 rounds. Once this starts, slight jacket damage occurs as it goes down the barrel, and gets worse as throat condition deteriorates. A tighter bore combined with jacket damage, causes jacket failure in flight. 219 bore will help prolong the time before this becomes a problem. Also, buy you're brass first, load some rounds, check the loaded neck diameter. A lot of smiths have reamers with 257 necks. In my experience with my first barrel, this was too tight and I had to neck turn brass, using necked down lapua 6cm. Alpha brass is, if I recall, 254 loaded diameter, and should have a chamber neck of 258-259. Some things to consider! Enjoy the build! I shot two deer with my 18" 22cm last year running 75eldm at 3150 fps, results were fantastic, one was at 280y, other 480y. 280y white tail buck did a 30y sprint and crashed dead. Vitals on the white tail were destroyed, the 480y shot was high shoulder/neck junction and was instant lights out. These lil fast 22s are quite lethal and a pleasure to shoot.
Frank in the Laurels
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jul 15, 2007
- Messages
- 2,018
..neither, a standard off the shelf .22/250 will be more than enough compared to everything else .224dia...too much anxiety and nonsense with components these days, I'm sticking to old soldiers.
MagnumManiac
Well-Known Member
I have both a 22-250 and 22-250AI, if push comes to shove, I will always choose the AI, and that includes the Creed case. The only other modern platform I would base my choice on is the 6.5x47 Lapua case.
Cheers.
Cheers.
SupressYourself
Well-Known Member
I think the Creed is a better option for an AR. That AI shoulder may not feed as well. It's also nice to skip fire forming.
For those mentioning the standard 22-250. It's a great cartridge, but the body taper makes it not feed well after you get 5 or 6 rounds in a magazine.
For those mentioning the standard 22-250. It's a great cartridge, but the body taper makes it not feed well after you get 5 or 6 rounds in a magazine.
I have shot the 22/250 and AI for decades on coyotes, shots were 350 yards and under. I shoot the 55g with a MV of 4050 fps with Win 760 or AA2700, 50g Ballistic tips at 4200, and coyotes died quickly. We had to take shots on running, trotting, and walking coyotes, and very often you do not leade them enough and hit them in the stomach and hindquarters. You need the speed to do some terrific damage so they are planted in their tracks. I had more flippers, spinners, and floppers with the std 22/250 than the AI version, and I cannot stress this enough....55's. I saw diminishing DRT coyote kills when hit in the stomach at distances of 250 yards and further with the std. 22/250. Back then, we hunted in Mexico with proper gun permits and hunting licenses, that ended in 1991 when the New President of Mexico passed a law that all Americans had to have a Mexican Guide with them.
I fire-formed cases with 55s at 3850 on hair, or fire formed with 14g of bullseye and cream of wheat. We Also shot the 60g Berger Hp with 37g of Win 760 at 3700 fps, and this load just massacres a coyote, I shot a bobcat in half with this load, around 100 yd shot as he sat on a pond dam watching fish.
Almost everyone is using heavy bullets these days, and I am slow to jump on board with slower, less flat shooting trajectories as most of my shots are 325 and under. I rarely ever hunted in the Plains states where wind howls and distances are great, the exception being prairie dog towns.
The 22/250 AI and the Creed are kiss'en cousins. When you stand a creed case up against the 22/250 AI, they look like twins, with one having a sharper shoulder angle. I have not measured but the CC capacity in water between the two can not be much at all.
If I were in a debate with myself on which to choose, if either one did not have enough power to suit me, I would opt for a 22-243 AI and I have two of these in slow twists where I shoot the 60s at 4000 fps in the 23" Hart 14T. I have not chronographed the 14T, 26" yet. Be forewarned that many of the reamers on the gunsmith's toolboxes do not work with Lapua brass, it is much fatter in the web than Winchester/Rem brass. I neck turn all my necks for the 22/243 AI, with amazing accuracy with the 60g Sierra. 55g bullets did not work worth a darn in the 22/243 AI and I blew the primers out of the pockets using varget, as the powder demonstrated to have an incredible pressure spike on the top end. Win 760 in the 22-243 AI proved to immediately shoot bug hole groups with few rounds fired with 60g Sierras shooting groups in the 2's.
In our Predator calling club, there were at least a dozen guys shooting the 22/250 AI, pretty much the same load of 55g what evers, 44.5g of Win 760, Federal 210 primers with 1/2" groups at 200 yards being the norm.
In today's world, the 22 Creed would be attractive but don't deceive yourself into thinking that it is a more potent case than a 22/250 AI, brass brands being equal.
I fire-formed cases with 55s at 3850 on hair, or fire formed with 14g of bullseye and cream of wheat. We Also shot the 60g Berger Hp with 37g of Win 760 at 3700 fps, and this load just massacres a coyote, I shot a bobcat in half with this load, around 100 yd shot as he sat on a pond dam watching fish.
Almost everyone is using heavy bullets these days, and I am slow to jump on board with slower, less flat shooting trajectories as most of my shots are 325 and under. I rarely ever hunted in the Plains states where wind howls and distances are great, the exception being prairie dog towns.
The 22/250 AI and the Creed are kiss'en cousins. When you stand a creed case up against the 22/250 AI, they look like twins, with one having a sharper shoulder angle. I have not measured but the CC capacity in water between the two can not be much at all.
If I were in a debate with myself on which to choose, if either one did not have enough power to suit me, I would opt for a 22-243 AI and I have two of these in slow twists where I shoot the 60s at 4000 fps in the 23" Hart 14T. I have not chronographed the 14T, 26" yet. Be forewarned that many of the reamers on the gunsmith's toolboxes do not work with Lapua brass, it is much fatter in the web than Winchester/Rem brass. I neck turn all my necks for the 22/243 AI, with amazing accuracy with the 60g Sierra. 55g bullets did not work worth a darn in the 22/243 AI and I blew the primers out of the pockets using varget, as the powder demonstrated to have an incredible pressure spike on the top end. Win 760 in the 22-243 AI proved to immediately shoot bug hole groups with few rounds fired with 60g Sierras shooting groups in the 2's.
In our Predator calling club, there were at least a dozen guys shooting the 22/250 AI, pretty much the same load of 55g what evers, 44.5g of Win 760, Federal 210 primers with 1/2" groups at 200 yards being the norm.
In today's world, the 22 Creed would be attractive but don't deceive yourself into thinking that it is a more potent case than a 22/250 AI, brass brands being equal.
Finding a custom AR barrel shop that has the reamers for chambering without renting 1 for an additional cost is ideal. I don't see where any have the ai versions. The ai version I don't believe would have any chambering issues with 80+ grain bullets. It's not relying on the case as the bullet will help it.
80g A max is a deer and hog bullet.
The easy button is the 22 Creed. I do not like the fast twists plus the long leades they put in their 22 creed barrels for heavy bullets only. When you skin a coyote, there is not much to them, heavy slower bullets often expand little. Even for Chuck rifles, 75g often does little damage, so my good friends tell me. I like to see the chucks about cut in half, I will opt for a 60g Berger or a 60g V max.
Distance/Wind often dictates what you use. The use of a range finder has never been part of my coyote calling, no time. Coyote and chuck hunting in different parts of the country is dramatically different.
The easy button is the 22 Creed. I do not like the fast twists plus the long leades they put in their 22 creed barrels for heavy bullets only. When you skin a coyote, there is not much to them, heavy slower bullets often expand little. Even for Chuck rifles, 75g often does little damage, so my good friends tell me. I like to see the chucks about cut in half, I will opt for a 60g Berger or a 60g V max.
Distance/Wind often dictates what you use. The use of a range finder has never been part of my coyote calling, no time. Coyote and chuck hunting in different parts of the country is dramatically different.
That is why I use fmj's on yotes. I have some Speer 75tmj's for 5.56 and possibly 22creed or 22-250.
