Randominator
Well-Known Member
I have never tried the Hornady Sub-X, but I have taken several deer with the 190 grain Makers at 1060 fps. Distances have ranged from 40 yards out to 136. Excellent results and accuracy.
Anyone shot deer with the 190grn Sub-x at 1050ish fps??
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I've taken a PILE of Whitetail does with the 190 Sub-X they work great. Decent expansion, fairly accurate from my 16"Bolt gun. The 200 Maker is an awesome bullet I've taken a bunch of whitetail with it also. It's not as accurate in my rifle and they cost about 3x as much so I stuck with the Hornady SUB-X.
I limited my self to 100yds with that bullet. Most of the deer were in the 60ish yd range. Although the furthest was 115yds. On that doe the bullet went through both shoulders and exited. Deer went 25yds and dead. Haven't lost one yet!
I limited my self to 100yds with that bullet. Most of the deer were in the 60ish yd range. Although the furthest was 115yds. On that doe the bullet went through both shoulders and exited. Deer went 25yds and dead. Haven't lost one yet!
Comanche41
Active Member
I can't speak about how they do on deer, but I do shoot a lot of them. Just bought another 500. I will use them on hogs when they come back on my place. Check over at 300blktalk.
Also, the Hornady 190 factory loads are designed to run in any gun, like gas guns, and you get the noise and all that goes with it.
I suspect that you would get better expansion out of the Makers or some of the other very expensive subsonic bullets. I have settled on the 190s for most of my shooting.
I believe that the biggest problem with subsonic hunting is that most shooters don't shoot enough to know how to range the target and know the trajectory of their bullet at any given range. You've got to shoot...A LOT. 10 or 15 yards makes a big difference in the POI. You also have to have very consistent loads, meaning single digit SDs. The price of the Hornadys compared to the Makers allows me to do the necessary shooting.
I've shot hundreds of rounds working up loads. I shoot a bolt gun. My 190 load is X grains of Unique (HP-38 is my backup). That gives me an average of 993 fps MV, single digit SDs, NO occasional supersonics, and MOA or better accuracy out to 200 yds. Zeroed at 100 yds, there is 34" of drop at 200 yds. Now I have to fill in the gaps at different ranges.
Also, the Hornady 190 factory loads are designed to run in any gun, like gas guns, and you get the noise and all that goes with it.
I suspect that you would get better expansion out of the Makers or some of the other very expensive subsonic bullets. I have settled on the 190s for most of my shooting.
I believe that the biggest problem with subsonic hunting is that most shooters don't shoot enough to know how to range the target and know the trajectory of their bullet at any given range. You've got to shoot...A LOT. 10 or 15 yards makes a big difference in the POI. You also have to have very consistent loads, meaning single digit SDs. The price of the Hornadys compared to the Makers allows me to do the necessary shooting.
I've shot hundreds of rounds working up loads. I shoot a bolt gun. My 190 load is X grains of Unique (HP-38 is my backup). That gives me an average of 993 fps MV, single digit SDs, NO occasional supersonics, and MOA or better accuracy out to 200 yds. Zeroed at 100 yds, there is 34" of drop at 200 yds. Now I have to fill in the gaps at different ranges.
There's a lot of people having feeding issues in gas guns with the flat point in the SUBXs.
The dope is identical to.22LR match ammo. It's not hard, but you're correct in that there's no possibility of a point blank zero.
Nimrodmar10
Well-Known Member
You might want to take a look at Outlaw State Bullets. I've been shooting them for years and they work great. They have striations cut along the nose that go 2/3 of the way towards the base.
What you have to realize is that these subsonic loads have about the same trajectory as a 9mm pistol. They call it Parabellum for a reason. Lots of drop. And knowing your trajectory is very important when shooting these guns.
You might also want to use a filler on top of the powder in the 308. Ten grains of Trailboss gets lost in that case. With the powder spread out in the case you don't get consistent velocities. I use Holofill 808, but there are other products that will work.
What you have to realize is that these subsonic loads have about the same trajectory as a 9mm pistol. They call it Parabellum for a reason. Lots of drop. And knowing your trajectory is very important when shooting these guns.
You might also want to use a filler on top of the powder in the 308. Ten grains of Trailboss gets lost in that case. With the powder spread out in the case you don't get consistent velocities. I use Holofill 808, but there are other products that will work.
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Outlaw State Bullets LLC .308, .310, .458 subsonic hunting bullets. .308 225 grain bullets, .310 225 grain bullets, .458 530 grain bullet, .338 spectre. Specialty projectiles. Ammunition.
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wvbearhunter
Well-Known Member
Get him a pair of Ear Pro. I had to for my son who has autism. The make all sound the same decibel levelWell this thread hasn't instilled a ton of confidence in this bullet for me.I did adjust my load yesterday. I'm shooting it in a 308 win Savage FCP-SR 24" barrel. 190 SubX in Lapua Brass with a Federal 215 magnum primer and 10.0 grains of Trail Boss. This gets me an average of 1050 fps and a 17fps spread over 5 shots.
I was previously shooting 10.5 grains with a Winchester LR primer and was averaging around 950 fps but it have like a 50 fps extreme spread. The magnum primer definitely seemed to even out the powder burn and picked up the fps so I was able to cut back on powder some. Which is nice since trail boss is not being produced right now.
My hope is for my autistic son to be able to shoot deer with it since he doesn't like loud booms and such. Next weekend is youth season and he's very excited to use it. I sighted it in at 50 yards and shot a 3 shot group. The fist shot being in the yellow at 12 o'clock and the the next two shots high making it about a 3/4" group at 50. I then went inside and loaded one more cartridge and backed up to 100 yards and ran all the numbers through my ballistic app and dialed the correction for drop and put the second round in the yellow at about 9 o'clock. So I'm pretty happy with it. I'll just take my rangefinder and ballistic calc and dial whatever he needs for him. I'm hoping this bullet performs as advertised. This will be his first time actually shooting at a deer. He's really excited. The past years I took him out and he would line up on a deer and you could see the hesitation in his face and then he'd step away from the gun. Loud noises cause a lot of anxiety for autistic kids and he just wouldn't pull the trigger but since I got my suppressors approved he LOVES shooting. View attachment 501814View attachment 501815
wvbearhunter
Well-Known Member
The Lehigh 196 Controlled Fracturing is another spectacular sub in 300blk
I've killed one whitetail doe and one coyote with the 190 SubX. The doe was a headshot from 25 yards as she fed, the bullet entered between her eyes and exited her neck with an impressive exit wound. The coyote was a broadside shot at 50 yards, the bullet zipped through with very little expansion - I'd guess the thin skin and tiny cross section of this yote wasn't enough to facilitate any expansion. Either way, the shot placement was good and the yote didn't make it 20 yards.
I've shot hundreds of these at various mediums and surfaces and wouldn't hesitate to take a deer with a broadside shot out to 100 yards. The importance of good shot placement cannot be overstated with these guys. With the subsonic round, you're not getting the effects of hydrostatic shock like we do with a high velocity rifle round, so we rely on expansion to help with arterial damage and vital organ damage. I think of using these in the same way I use my bow. Get close and make a good shot or don't take the shot at all. As long as you understand the limitations of the SubX and subsonic rounds in general, you're good to go.
I shoot the subsonic Maker bullets out of my 375 Raptor. I've yet to kill anything with that round but it sure does seem impressive.
I've shot hundreds of these at various mediums and surfaces and wouldn't hesitate to take a deer with a broadside shot out to 100 yards. The importance of good shot placement cannot be overstated with these guys. With the subsonic round, you're not getting the effects of hydrostatic shock like we do with a high velocity rifle round, so we rely on expansion to help with arterial damage and vital organ damage. I think of using these in the same way I use my bow. Get close and make a good shot or don't take the shot at all. As long as you understand the limitations of the SubX and subsonic rounds in general, you're good to go.
I shoot the subsonic Maker bullets out of my 375 Raptor. I've yet to kill anything with that round but it sure does seem impressive.
WV Hitman
Well-Known Member
All these new sub .30 gr. bullets leave a lot to be desired. I've had a .300 Whisper (aka Blackout) since it's inception. JD Jones is a good friend and asked me to see what worked in it.
He developed it to use a 240 gr. Sierra HPBT Match. That would kill deer, but usually ran a ways. He also hooked me up with Lehigh Defense to test their subsonic bullets. A lot of their early bullets were bad & looked like the subXs in the pics. Deer ran or were lost.
Now, based on over 120 deer kills. 4 turkeys, several coyotes, here's what I've found. #1 subsonic bullet in the Whisper is the Speer 220 gr. Round Nose. I get about 95% instant drops on deer including a big buck at 240 yards. # 2 sub bullet is the Lehigh 186 gr. Chaos. It gets about 95% drops, too, but shoots flatter than the 220 RN, so you have to use a different mildot on your scope (mildot scopes are mandatory with subsonic bullets since they fly like a thrown rock).
I shot some of the Horn. 190s, but they shot so far off my 220s that I had to use 3 or 4 mildots different. A waste of time.
Bottom line, if you want a dependable .300 subsonic bullet, just stick with the 220RN at 1050fps & stop worrying. Do the expand? Maybe, but I get 100% penetration even on the 240 yd. buck with a double shoulder hit. It dropped like he was poleaxed at that distance! So did my last coyote at 170 yds. Save you $ on the new subs & get 220 RNs & figure out what load gets them subsonic. Saves a lot of heartache/headache/worries.
He developed it to use a 240 gr. Sierra HPBT Match. That would kill deer, but usually ran a ways. He also hooked me up with Lehigh Defense to test their subsonic bullets. A lot of their early bullets were bad & looked like the subXs in the pics. Deer ran or were lost.
Now, based on over 120 deer kills. 4 turkeys, several coyotes, here's what I've found. #1 subsonic bullet in the Whisper is the Speer 220 gr. Round Nose. I get about 95% instant drops on deer including a big buck at 240 yards. # 2 sub bullet is the Lehigh 186 gr. Chaos. It gets about 95% drops, too, but shoots flatter than the 220 RN, so you have to use a different mildot on your scope (mildot scopes are mandatory with subsonic bullets since they fly like a thrown rock).
I shot some of the Horn. 190s, but they shot so far off my 220s that I had to use 3 or 4 mildots different. A waste of time.
Bottom line, if you want a dependable .300 subsonic bullet, just stick with the 220RN at 1050fps & stop worrying. Do the expand? Maybe, but I get 100% penetration even on the 240 yd. buck with a double shoulder hit. It dropped like he was poleaxed at that distance! So did my last coyote at 170 yds. Save you $ on the new subs & get 220 RNs & figure out what load gets them subsonic. Saves a lot of heartache/headache/worries.
I would go soft lead at that speed, I use plain melted down wheel weights to mold in a 45 hand gun 200 grain and I get expansion to quarter size from 45. I have used on rabbit, deer,hogs. Pass through on deer but not hogs. I bet with a long 200 ish 30 cal it would really penetrate and definitely expand some. It's really interesting how lead also stays together at low speed, the bullets are always intact. I have one here from a deer but not sure how to post the pic
