Proof Barrels And Shermans.....WOW !

[bigngreen]

I'm no barrel maker but if a run of barrels is being made on the same machine, with the same material, how can some be "tight"?

There is some art to it also, the heat treat comes into play big time and there is hand work in some processed in some makers.

 

[Recon$$]

I've only owned proofs in magnums but I find them finicky. Hasn't stopped me but my god have they frustrated me a few times. I get there but it's a long process in comparison to other chamberings with standard steel barrels.

 

[Pdvdh]

I'm no barrel maker but if a run of barrels is being made on the same machine, with the same material, how can some be "tight"?

You really believe there's not a way to produce an inconsistent bore, or any other machined steel product, in a machine shop or production facility?

If it were that easy, no QA/QC inspection would ever be required at most machine shops / plants.

I've got a Bartlein with 2 of 5 grooves measuring out of spec deeper than the other 3. Bartlein says it's not possible with their manufacturing equipment. It shoots like a turd. Two of the cut grooves are visible by bore scope across the throat. Chamber reamer couldn't clean them up. Nor did a PTG uni-throater clean up the grooves across the throat, and that tool only centers off the lands.

If there's a human, a human manufactured tool, a human programmed machine, or a human operated machine involved, then there's always opportunity for cluster.

 

[buckbrush]

Lot's of unsubstantiated claims in the OP and the FB comments. Pretty sure Proof will not feel the squeeze of no more sherman chambered rifles.

 

[Pdvdh]

Pretty sure Proof will not feel the squeeze of no more sherman chambered rifles.

Nor the squeeze from the loss of my future purchases. Which serves no one positively...

 

[DJ Fergus]

It doesn't make any sense that the proofs barrels would only show issues with Sherman cartridges. If that were the situation, they would show issues with SAUM cartridges, Rum cartridges, 28 & 30 nosler cartridges.

 

[lancetkenyon]

I have 8 Proof CF barrels. Some get good speeds, some are slower. All are accurate.
I did have one 26" 6.5mm 1:7.5" on a 6.5SS. My 20" would almost match it for speed. It would pressure up 3 gr below where any of my other 6.5SSs would. But stupid accurate. I pulled it and put a Bartlein 24" 6.5 1:7.5" and chambered it in .260AI. That new barrel, pushing the same 140 Hyb, is only only 100fps slower for 2" shorter barrel length and 12gr less powder.
I built a new 26" Bartlein 6.5SS, and even new, got 110fps more with 0 pressure with the same max load as the proof ran. All components same lot, as I just tested the old rounds I had loaded up.

 

[TXTrained]

From the Sherman FB page;

PROOF BARRELS
ok, its time to get real with whats going on!!
I'm tired of having to talk to one client after another because of problems with Proof barrels! Im going to use the "Proof narrative" here. "Proof barrels dont work with Sherman cartridges"! " We've had a lot of troubles with those Shermans"! And just last week "Build a real cartridge"! So, i would advise everyone to do what Proof says and DON'T build any on Proof barrels!
Here are the facts: we have had more problems with proof than "ALL OTHER BRANDS COMBINED"! The same reamers that cut the Proofs, cut every other brand. The symptoms are ALWAYS the same. Pressure as much as 3-4 grains below average and low velocity. The barrels have tight spots (chokes) or are just plain undersize from chamber to muzzle, or both. Even WHEN Proof replaces the barrel, the client is still out hundreds of dollars for a redo and a lot of time.
I tried giving Proof the benefit of the doubt by working with them. In December, we had a 3 way conversation over the phone. Right off, they said " we've had trouble with the Shermans! I reminded them that the only
Sherman part was the chamber AND I had gunsmiths all over the country telling me they were having the same problems I was having.
They then said "well, we have had some issues, but we're working on them"! Because they finally admitted it, I thought, ok, I can live with that answer and we can move forward.
We agreed to cooperate with testing and data exchange so They bought a 7ss reamer, some brass and dies with the promise of building 4 rifles and doing extensive testing. GREAT!
Testing was to begin between Christmas and New years. Finally, after calling them a couple times, they told me they had one chambered and some time later after me calling them for an update, they said they had shot one with 180's using H1000. He said it shot very well and he ran it up to 2880 ish. Whoopee!
We talked about trying some more powders and running them up to pressure and getting velocities and grouping, etc.
Never ONCE have they called me or submitted any data at all since then. In the last month, Ive called them twice and they were always unavailable and they never bothered returning my calls.
In the mean time, I had a client with a problem who stopped by their office, and in their conversation, he was told " build a real rifle", etc.
Soooo.....last week, I emailed them and officially told them that unless I received some correspondence that would change my mind, i could not, and would not work on anything with them, and furthermore, would advise my clients to use their narrative that Shermans and Proofs dont get along.
So you guys can make up your own minds what you want to do, but ive lost all respect for that outfit! Everyone has issues to deal with, including me, but thats what you do; not pass the buck! DONE!

Proof is in the Proof....Don't Buy a Proof.!
My friend bought a Proof and bore scoped it. Result- it looked like used barrel. RUST looking spot andsmall looking cracks.
It shot like crap.Proof sent him a new barrel.The 2nd barrel looked better .However it shot about like 1st one.

 

[blackburbot]

Might be that proofs are tight barrels. People also claim that benchmarks are loose barrels. Find what you like and go with that. You might get pressure or velocity difference than other people. But in all honesty, who cares. Yeah you might be slower, but what does the target look like. You can run 3200fps but it looks like a shotgun hit the target doesn't say much. If they are faster and more accurate than you. Congratulate them and strive to outshine shine them. Don't get mad at them

 

[Charles Keethler]

Hey guys I am considering buying a Savage 110 Lite in 6.5 PRC with Proof carbon wraped barrel any problems with this barrel?

 

[grouse]

I just had to send a 7mm barrel back to a manufacturer. Was so tight the reamer wouldn't go in.

 

[JAYgs8163]

Hey guys I am considering buying a Savage 110 Lite in 6.5 PRC with Proof carbon wraped barrel any problems with this barrel?

Shouldn't be different than any other Proof Barrel. Doesn't mean you can't get a finicky one.

 

[300sendero]

I wonder where proof would be today as a company if they marketed their barrels as the fastest on the market instead of building a reputation of accuracy? Proof barrels shoot. Plain and simple. I've read more comments about this line of cartridges not being as fast as advertised than I will ever read proof barrels wont shoot good.

 

[Deviant]

I may be reading or interpreting this the incorrect way. Just don't understand why any cartridge chambering would be different in a barrel. why a Sherman designed cartridge is having issues. Sherman cartridges are basically a Short Mag - different shoulder or a WSM - short magnums.

I had high pressure and low velocity issues with a custom 6.5 SAUM with a Proof CF barrel. In my case though I sent them the rifle they did supply a new barrel but didn't have the reamer. They ended up sending it back to Snowy Mountain Rifles and luckily Greg was able to get it rechambered and cerakoted for me at no charge. I can only hope that Proof covered at least some of the cost because Snowy Mountain rifles did excellent work as always. The rifle now shoots .3 MOA and is awesome. I have 4 other Proof barrels that have had no issues but this definitely makes a person think twice before purchasing another one.