OK, My turn on the 6.5 Creedmoor

JTB said:
I don't call it magic, I'm just calling it like I see it. Used to hate the cartridge hype but was forced by my 12 y/o grandson into working up some loads for his deer hunt this year. Dropped an LRP scope on his new CM and went to the range. All I really use is h4831, H1000 and Retumbo so I loaded up as much as I could compress into the cases and went to the range. Really couldn't find a bad combination as far as accuracy but was able to to reach 1/4 MOA vs 1/2 MOA by adjusting loads. I told him that he hit the jackpot and got one of "those" rifles that will shoot anything. So I secretly (to avoid the harassment from those I told I would never own a CM) ordered a light/inexpensive 22" barrel, $20 muzzle brake off eBay & 6.5 CM reamer and fitted the barrel to a 700 243 youth model I had laying around. I bedded it to the original plastic stock, added a timney and VX5HD (7 lbs with scope) and had the same outcome as the previous rifle. On a new barrel it took 3 shots to sight it in, cleaned it, and then took 4 shots from the cleaned barrel using 147 ELDs; all holes touching @ 100. So I gave it the ultimate test, would it shoot 142 ABLR? Same result; all touching. Now what do I do with it???:cool:
Click to expand...
JTB said:
I don't call it magic, I'm just calling it like I see it. Used to hate the cartridge hype but was forced by my 12 y/o grandson into working up some loads for his deer hunt this year. Dropped an LRP scope on his new CM and went to the range. All I really use is h4831, H1000 and Retumbo so I loaded up as much as I could compress into the cases and went to the range. Really couldn't find a bad combination as far as accuracy but was able to to reach 1/4 MOA vs 1/2 MOA by adjusting loads. I told him that he hit the jackpot and got one of "those" rifles that will shoot anything. So I secretly (to avoid the harassment from those I told I would never own a CM) ordered a light/inexpensive 22" barrel, $20 muzzle brake off eBay & 6.5 CM reamer and fitted the barrel to a 700 243 youth model I had laying around. I bedded it to the original plastic stock, added a timney and VX5HD (7 lbs with scope) and had the same outcome as the previous rifle. On a new barrel it took 3 shots to sight it in, cleaned it, and then took 4 shots from the cleaned barrel using 147 ELDs; all holes touching @ 100. So I gave it the ultimate test, would it shoot 142 ABLR? Same result; all touching. Now what do I do with it???:cool:
Click to expand...

Send it to me here in Shelbyville KY ;)
 
Whatever the physics, metaphysics or other cause is, I like many others, have had very good experience with the 6.5CM.

I am sort of an independent/contrary minded sort, and I don't like having the same thing as everyone else. So, I was, purposefully, a very late adopter with the Creed. But I have to admit that after experience with 4 (non-custom) rifles, they all shot as good or better than any of the dozens of other rifles in as many different chamberings that I've messed with in the past. Even reduced loads for my son shoot great (<0.75 MOA).

In contrast, most rifles I've personally messed with showed a marked "preference" for bullet type/charge weight, and we're just flat tougher to find the best load for. In the extreme, I had a .257 Roberts that I finally gave up on loading for and just shot factory ammo, as I couldn't better it.

On the other hand, I have no idea what the truely most accurate loads are for my Creeds, as most anything is at my level of skill (0.5 MOA, only sometimes better), so I really can't tell the difference.

Similarly, if I had to bet on which factory rifle off the shelf would be most accurate in any given line, my bet would be on one in 6.5 CM. I know there surely have been some poor shooters in that caliber just like any other, but I'd say the odds are weighted in its favor.

On the other hand, ever tried to buy a really accurate .223 bolt gun off the shelf? I have, and it's tougher to do than buying a really accurate 6.5CM.

I personally feel certain that good cartridge design (shoulder angle/body taper/neck length/powder column length/freebore length, etc.) at least plays a part.
 
Last edited:
Canhunter35 said:
Inherent accuracy does exist.
308...prime example. More factory loads will shoot in a 308 than a lot of cartridges
Hornady designed the 6.5 saami reamer then builds the ammo and surprise it's accurate. That's not marketing, it's design.
Buy a 204 ruger. I can barely make my handloads more accurate or faster than their ammo.
That's design not marketing...just saying
Click to expand...
I agree. Reasons I agree are;
A round rock is inherently more accurate than an oblong jagged rock.

A a longer heavier bullet with a better ballistic coefficient is inherently more accurate than a shorter, lighter lower ballistic coefficient bullet. Physics makes one inherently more accurate, not magic.
 
Less recoil, bullets with better ballistic coefficients, seem to make it a good caliber........not magic........not a "Goto" caliber for Moose or Elk, but, a good caliber for deer!
 
jstamper said:
Whatever the physics, metaphysics or other cause is, I like many others, have had very good experience with the 6.5CM.

I am sort of an independent/contrary minded sort, and I don't like having the same thing as everyone else. So, I was, purposefully, a very late adopter with the Creed. But I have to admit that after experience with 4 (non-custom) rifles, they all shot as good or better than any of the dozens of other rifles in as many different chamberings that I've messed with in the past. Even reduced loads for my son shoot great (<0.75 MOA).

In contrast, most rifles I've personally messed with showed a marked "preference" for bullet type/charge weight, and we're just flat tougher to find the best load for. In the extreme, I had a .257 Roberts that I finally gave up on loading for and just shot factory ammo, as I couldn't better it.

On the other hand, I have no idea what the truely most accurate loads are for my Creeds, as most anything is at my level of skill (0.5 MOA, only sometimes better), so I really can't tell the difference.

Similarly, if I had to bet on which factory rifle off the shelf would be most accurate in any given line, my bet would be on one in 6.5 CM. I know there surely have been some poor shooters in that caliber just like any other, but I'd say the odds are weighted in its favor.

On the other hand, ever tried to buy a really accurate .223 bolt gun off the shelf? I have, and it's tougher to do than buying a really accurate 6.5CM.

I personally feel certain that good cartridge design (shoulder angle/body taper/neck length/powder column length/freebore length, etc.) at least plays a part.
Click to expand...
 
There is NO such thing as "inherent accuracy" in ANYTHING to do with shooting! There is only accuracy and consistency. There is no part of a weapon being fired that did not get acted upon by an outside force. Therefore there is nothing "inherently accurate" about something that is inanimate and must be manipulated manually by someone or something. Because it takes a series of movements and disciplines to create accuracy...Nothing "inherent" about it.
 
MudRunner2005 said:
There is NO such thing as "inherent accuracy" in ANYTHING to do with shooting! There is only accuracy and consistency. There is no part of a weapon being fired that did not get acted upon by an outside force. Therefore there is nothing "inherently accurate" about something that is inanimate and must be manipulated manually by someone or something. Because it takes a series of movements and disciplines to create accuracy...Nothing "inherent" about it.
Click to expand...
Buy as many boxes of ammo you can for your 7mm, then buy as many as you can for your 308. Shoot targets with each group, I bet there's a higher chance that the 308's groups aggregate smaller.

My experience with wbys is try every ammo available and one might group well. The others are horrible. Grab a 308 and one box might be horrible the rest are pretty decent
 
I too agree that accuracy is inherent to a lot things, like it or not, it does exist. Instrument of measurement, values, and definition is all relative. This will remain controversial because there is no standard definition of what is accurate and what is inherently accurate. But why does it need to be standardized? I don't.

"If" there is no inherent gain in cartridge design, then we might still be talking about 6.5x55, .30-06, .375 H&H today. People just need to deal with it. Wait for it!!!!!!

An older thread >>> https://www.longrangehunting.com/threads/inherent-accuracy.4630/
 
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