Elk Caliber?

[drtony]

This has been a great thread!

I will add that there is no such thing as over gunned. There is such a thing as poor bullet choice no matter what cartridge you are using. I have been consistent in this thinking since long before I became a bullet maker. Someone early in the thread mentioned a bull that absorbed a close range shot. Sometimes strange things happen, but I am going to venture to guess that he either had a bullet that failed to deform properly or a bullet that shed too much weight with the high vel impact to penetrate deep enough and still retain enough vel once into the vitals to do enough damage to cause the needed trauma for quick blogs loss.

As a bullet maker I have learned that bullets that are marginally stable but still shoot accurately will have a higher probability of failure to track straightand deform properly. A 1.5sg or higher calculated at standard atmosphere at sea level, well greatly increase consistent bullet performance. Know the distance that your setup will retain at least 1800fps and limit yourself to that shot distance. And finally when it comes to elk, don't stop putting bullets in an elk until it is of its feet. If it is of its feet and still breathing, be prepared to shoot again. Don't get off your rifle until it is dead.

Steve

Thank you for the update, I agree this has been an awesome thread with everyone offering really good advice/wisdom.

MY plan is to use a premium factory round (no matter what caliber is ends up being) like Nosler accubonds or ABLR. I would think that can get the job done in a .30 cal or 7mm mag.

 

[Rum Man]

I use the 210 nosler ablr in one of my Rum's , factory Sendero and factory ammo . I just got lucky it loves them !
Best of luck in your quest for the One !

 

[RockyMtnMT]

I would stay with the ab. The ablr can be quite explosive at short range. Not as predictable as the ab. Partitions are better yet just not as good in bc. Which doesn't matter until after 500y anyway.

Good luck and keep us updated on how it goes.

Steve

 

[Hbomb11]

And finally when it comes to elk, don't stop putting bullets in an elk until it is of its feet. If it is of its feet and still breathing, be prepared to shoot again. Don't get off your rifle until it is dead.

This is a great point...I snuck up on a bedded bull once only 30-40 yards away. I put 5 rounds in him before he fell down and he didn't flinch or move an inch. He just stood there looking at me and finally I could see the blood coming out of his mouth and his head slowly dropping and finally dropped dead. I was using 7mm 160 gr nosler partitions. I thought actually might have missed considering I'm zeroed 2 inches high at 200 yds but after field dressing I was able to find all entry holes.

 

[drtony]

I would stay with the ab. The ablr can be quite explosive at short range. Not as predictable as the ab. Partitions are better yet just not as good in bc. Which doesn't matter until after 500y anyway.

Good luck and keep us updated on how it goes.

Steve

I have 165 partitions (weatherby made) for my 300 wby. I seriously considered that if the wby is good to go.

For that rifle, I also have 150 partitions (weatherby made), 180 nosler AB, 210 nosler ABLR, HSM 185 berger, and HSM 210 bergers

Hopefully the rifle will love one of those!

 

[BJH]

I agree with the theory of keep shooting until you are sure an elk is down for good. If I am shooting at long range and it may be a while until I get to the animal and will loose sight of it... I like to put an insurance shot in one as well. I have followed the 'keep shooting until its down' theory no matter what I have shot at them and its worked well for me. I hope that you get the opportunity to test it out on your hunt! Everyone should have the pleasure of butchering and packing a big bull out of the mountains at least once in their life. It is an experience that makes me question my intelligence every time it happens.

 

[cohunt]

I have an old family friend that wanted to start trophy hunting over 35 years ago--he had never shot a firearm in his life except for in basic training and said he could barely hit the side of a barn back in basic.

He asked another African trophy hunter what rifle he would suggest and was told the 300wm--he bought 1 and only 1 rifle in his life and it was that 300wm. He practiced and became a very good shot with it. After 30 years of trophy hunting all over the world he gave up as he said he was too old, passed the rifle on to his daughter--You should see his trophy room==elk, red stag, black bear, grizzly, cape buffalo, bison, elephant, giraffe, moose, lion, leopard, eland, blesbok, wildebeest, gemsbok, impala, kudu, nyala, antelope, zebra, and a few others (he always gave the meat to his guide for eating or to give to the locals as he hated waste)

remember the quote "Beware the man who only has one gun. He probably knows how to use it!"

 

[gillettehunter]

I have killed a lot of elk with a .270. Right now I have a 7 SAUM with 180 gr bullets as my go to rifle. Might use the search function and look up Broz's post on elk. He runs a ranch in MT with depredation elk hunts. He has seen over 70 animals taken in a season. He has a lifetime of experience in one year.
Bruce

 

[drtony]

I have killed a lot of elk with a .270. Right now I have a 7 SAUM with 180 gr bullets as my go to rifle. Might use the search function and look up Broz's post on elk. He runs a ranch in MT with depredation elk hunts. He has seen over 70 animals taken in a season. He has a lifetime of experience in one year.
Bruce

I will defintely search for Broz's post. thank you!

 

[RockyMtnMT]

This is a great point...I snuck up on a bedded bull once only 30-40 yards away. I put 5 rounds in him before he fell down and he didn't flinch or move an inch. He just stood there looking at me and finally I could see the blood coming out of his mouth and his head slowly dropping and finally dropped dead. I was using 7mm 160 gr nosler partitions. I thought actually might have missed considering I'm zeroed 2 inches high at 200 yds but after field dressing I was able to find all entry holes.

Was probably dead after the 1st round and didn't know it. He may have headed out if you had not shot more and made your day far worse in a matter of moments. I know 1st hand.

Steve

 

[257Tony]

We kill about 28-30 bull elk every year on the ranch I guide on, you name a caliber and I've seen an elk shot with it. Some of the fastest kills ivet seen come from guys shooting "small" calibers, 7mm-08, 243, 25-06, etc. These guys know their rifles, and they can shoot them very accurately. I have seeing guys roll up with their brand new 300 magnum they got just special for their hunt, they generally can't shoot it well, and end up wounding and losing their animal, or shooting it in the wrong spot 5 or 6 times until it finally dies.

If you have a big magnum, and can legitimately shoot it well, then you have the best of both worlds, but be honest with yourself first.

Point is, if you can put the bullet in the right spot, it doesn't take a cannon to kill an elk.

 

[DocDoc]

Comparing the Berger 210 VLD to the 215 Hybrid
Search this by Broz for pages of good info.

 

[BigGrizz]

This has been a great thread!

I will add that there is no such thing as over gunned. There is such a thing as poor bullet choice no matter what cartridge you are using. I have been consistent in this thinking since long before I became a bullet maker. Someone early in the thread mentioned a bull that absorbed a close range shot. Sometimes strange things happen, but I am going to venture to guess that he either had a bullet that failed to deform properly or a bullet that shed too much weight with the high vel impact to penetrate deep enough and still retain enough vel once into the vitals to do enough damage to cause the needed trauma for quick blogs loss.

As a bullet maker I have learned that bullets that are marginally stable but still shoot accurately will have a higher probability of failure to track straightand deform properly. A 1.5sg or higher calculated at standard atmosphere at sea level, well greatly increase consistent bullet performance. Know the distance that your setup will retain at least 1800fps and limit yourself to that shot distance. And finally when it comes to elk, don't stop putting bullets in an elk until it is of its feet. If it is of its feet and still breathing, be prepared to shoot again. Don't get off your rifle until it is dead.

Steve

It was a 250gr Berger Elite Hunter. It was the best entry wound I've had one of those bullets make, and the exit was large enough to fit a pop can through long-ways. Entry was front right chest, exit was behind the left leg, uphill shot. I can't say what it did to the vitals- we quartered using the gutless method. Either way he walked off with a huge hole in his chest.

At close range I have had those bullets blow-up and leave massive wholes in rib cages. The wounds really are catastrophic. That is the last time I use a Berger, though. Right now I have ELD-X bullets loaded up and I have questioned myself. I plan on testing them in the most elk-like media I can find. If I'm disappointed, I'll move to an Accubond like my instincts first told me.

You're dead-on with the bullet and shooting advice. Use something solid and don't stop shooting until its down. In my case the dark timber gave him the chance to make a break for it.

To DR- I think somebody else already said it, if you're questioning the 6.5 then you shouldn't probably take it. Also, if you're worried about having a magnum you'll never really use then you could look at a 30-06, 308, etc. There are cartridges out there that have been doing the job for years that aren't benefitting from the "flavor of the day" phenomenon like 6.5s have been.

 

[drtony]

We kill about 28-30 bull elk every year on the ranch I guide on, you name a caliber and I've seen an elk shot with it. Some of the fastest kills ivet seen come from guys shooting "small" calibers, 7mm-08, 243, 25-06, etc. These guys know their rifles, and they can shoot them very accurately. I have seeing guys roll up with their brand new 300 magnum they got just special for their hunt, they generally can't shoot it well, and end up wounding and losing their animal, or shooting it in the wrong spot 5 or 6 times until it finally dies.

If you have a big magnum, and can legitimately shoot it well, then you have the best of both worlds, but be honest with yourself first.

Point is, if you can put the bullet in the right spot, it doesn't take a cannon to kill an elk.

I really like that you brought that up. I grew up shooting guns-- my dads guns. He started my out on a 308 and then graduated me to a 300 win mag. I really enjoy shooting. He is taking his 300 win mag on the hunt and I was planning on taking my 300 wby (which was bought for that hunt). the recoil doesn't bother me much for the first 10 rounds. While trying to zero before i sent it back, I could get 1-1.5" groups at 200 yards. The rifle just shot 6-8 inches right. I fully agree that being comfortable with what you shoot is very important.